3 minutes ago, lgaga1fan said:

Notice how I didnt even mention the person I called 'your little friend' by name and you confirmed it in an instant

Again, I take issue with being mentioned in a Discord because I literally have no interest in it
Meaning I don't want to join such nor would I seek out such information or screenshots. Let alone have any be sent to me.

Someone - not GovHooka - messaged me on here once an entire forum section was removed and wanted to let me know my name was being mentioned in the greater discussion and reasoning for why such was being done.

I mentioned GovHooka because the post literally above yours claims that Graffiti was justified to make the comments he did due to GovHooka messaging him on Discord.

So again, I ask, what would GovHooka and what this person does have anything to do with a pro-Zionism user like Graffitti making broad claims about the content of users like myself and numerous other progressives who just discuss elections and don't want to do personal drama on Discord? You have both GovHooka and Graffiti harassing people in private messages across multiple platforms. What does that have to do with me wanting to use the good sis @Vermillion as an RSS feed for the latest US politics news??

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion

1 minute ago, Sheep said:

It is a bit ironic to kick up a fuss alleging bad moderation and wide-sweeping antisemitism issues on here but then also not want to address the very real issues that exist in running a de-facto side forum via Discord endorsed by staff and where staff are also members yet forums members on here are discussed by others despite not being on both platforms.

If a post on here about a user would get a WP, would such also be true for Discord? How does a user even report such being done to them if they're not a member of this side platform? That's a valid concern.

Mods obviously can't police how users discuss other users on personal social media, but the power dynamics in an official Discord server are problematic.

Now, despite being completely verbose, I'm also not a wet blanket, and not someone who wants to ruin what is largely innocent fun.

But it seems like that same attitude should be relevant for and cause self-reflection for others. Antisemitism is very serious of an issue, but it's also then concerned for in bad faith if the accusations about antisemitism heavily rely on demanding support for Jewish Nationalism like Graffiti has spent the past 2 years doing.

Trying to completely dismantle a forum and its culture and attack its moderation staff as doing some moral failure out of a desire to defend ethnic nationalism from losing in the court of public approval - which is what this is about - is unfair to everyone involved.

Any person on here who discusses politics would say the mods are almost universally fair in part from having a wide range of moderators who can moderate the Civics section and it's a long cry from the days where ATRL had an actual, actively real far-right problem endorsed by those moderating the forum at the time and enabling genuinely dehumanizing posts to be made.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion

How does one even join the ATRL Discord now? I never noticed the pinned thread before and it has been closed since March so how does one get that invite nowadays?

4 minutes ago, Cholien said:

BTS • STRAY KIDS

It's down for maintenance actually

Not my final memory of Civics being me posting a thread about an elephant pissing on the floor of a Republican campaign event

1 hour ago, Rian said:

jesus ******* christ. please log out.

24 minutes ago, Communion said:

It is a bit ironic to kick up a fuss alleging bad moderation and wide-sweeping antisemitism issues on here but then also not want to address the very real issues that exist in running a de-facto side forum via Discord endorsed by staff and where staff are also members yet forums members on here are discussed by others despite not being on both platforms.

If a post on here about a user would get a WP, would such also be true for Discord? How does a user even report such being done to them if they're not a member of this side platform? That's a valid concern.

Mods obviously can't police how users discuss other users on personal social media, but the power dynamics in an official Discord server are problematic.

Now, despite being completely verbose, I'm also not a wet blanket, and not someone who wants to ruin what is largely innocent fun.

But it seems like that same attitude should be relevant for and cause self-reflection for others. Antisemitism is very serious of an issue, but it's also then concerned for in bad faith if the accusations about antisemitism heavily rely on demanding support for Jewish Nationalism like Graffiti has spent the past 2 years doing.

Trying to completely dismantle a forum and its culture and attack its moderation staff as doing some moral failure out of a desire to defend ethnic nationalism from losing in the court of public approval - which is what this is about - is unfair to everyone involved.

Any person on here who discusses politics would say the mods are almost universally fair in part from having a wide range of moderators who can moderate the Civics section and it's a long cry from the days where ATRL had an actual, actively real far-right problem endorsed by those moderating the forum at the time and enabling genuinely dehumanizing posts to be made.

This just boiling down to "why can't I police this other platform too?"

You are literally the embodiment of why civics was deleted

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Sheep

1 minute ago, Sheep said:

This just boiling down to "why can't I police this other platform too?"

You're defending a user who demanded an entire section of this forum be deleted because most users on this forum do not support Zionism and believe it is the militarized ideology behind forcefully cleansing or killing Palestinians.

This was messy and a probably an example of the kind of insular discussions that happen on Discord and maybe that it shouldn't operate as a de-facto official side platform to here. Defending your friend tirelessly while not even being aware of the harassment in the name of defending Jewish Nationalism they were doing shows such shortcomings.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion

Sheep: I am not defending x

Communion: You are literally defending x and this is why the x that you just admitted to defending is wrong and you should be ashamed for the way you built a shrine to x and pray to it nightly. You are literally the x user. Here is an exhausting list of graphics I took from Twitter relating to the topic of x but have no relation to this current discussion.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Sheep

The civics section is gone!??? praise be. we've been sent good moderation

Just now, Sheep said:

Sheep: I am not defending x

But you are defending it by making excuses for it.

You were being messy on Discord and let one user's bad behavior (Gov Hooka) get you riled up and feel vindicated to do a mass "comeuppance" on this separate platform that isn't actually justified once the emotions cool down and the group chat is no longer hyping each other up.

The "extremism is defeated!!" texts probably don't read as well on reflection when appeasing a massive Zionist.

Put up a poll. Let's see for ourselves. Let's ask ATRL's userbase if they think antizionism is always antisemitism.

So much anger and resentment about allegedly bad behavior only to not even realize how you and others were violating other third parties' own privacy and agency in the same, or even worse, ways, by thinking chats on an official Discord server were appropriate to hash out personal vendettas for people not even part of such servers and who wish not to be.

It reads like an entire subsection has gone missing because a single user's opinion was given extreme weight despite this user on reflection being outed as just recently harassing users for having different politics and themselves lying in framing their own politics as moderate.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion

3 minutes ago, Communion said:

Put up a poll. Let's see for ourselves. Let's ask ATRL's userbase if they think antizionism is always antisemitism.

The original offense that went unanswered and lead to the pent up animosity between users was literal straight up antisemitism that was not criticism of Israel. I jumped in to clarify it because I saw the posts where this behavior had been previously brought up and framing it as righteous defenders of humanity ending the evil zionist was literally not what happened. I pointed this out TWICE and you did not bother to respond because you're an antisemite who has demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt, an eager willingness to overlook hate speech. You were more ready to lash users calling each other names on Discord. Shut the **** up and leave me alone before you get more sections of the forum shut down with your horrible trolling that only works on low iq 40 year old retired Britney and Xtina fans whose brains have been fried by poppers. I'm done.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Sheep

30 minutes ago, Communion said:

You're defending a user who demanded an entire section of this forum be deleted because most users on this forum do not support Zionism and believe it is the militarized ideology behind forcefully cleansing or killing Palestinians.

This is not a statement based in fact.

And if you had actually read lgaga1fan’s post, you would see that he was criticizing Graffiti for what he said was “zionazi behavior”. So you’re making assumptions based on things that were not said. Which is a pattern of what you do, and it started well before the discussion of the israel/palestine conflict from 2023.

Just now, Sheep said:

The original offense that went unanswered and lead to the pent up animosity between users was literal straight up antisemitism

Again, there's no reason to believe you in this assessment when you defend a user who has claimed antisemitism to attack users - as recently as yesterday messaging people privately on here to harass them about Zionism. Something you apparently did not know.

Your group chats with your friends wishing horrific things and cheering "EXTREMISM IS DEFEATED" in silencing anti-genocidal views should never have to be relayed to me because my name was brought up on a platform I am not part of. This was messy and inappropriate, let alone hurtful.

The claim that this is about antisemitism - no matter any offending posts by any individuals - doesn't work because the offending user(s) weren't just banned and dealt with, like one would think a moderating team would do. Let alone no transparency regarding what the follow-up would be on Graffiti who apparently wished death on several users in the Discord, on top of the aforementioned harassment he committed.

In my entire time on the internet, I've never thought go out and find someone I disagree with and harass them on another platform and yet this behavior is apparently be defended and cheered on here by you and others. I'm never gonna message someone to scream at them cause they have a different political opinion and yet I'M the extremist and not your friend who probably deserves to be banned??

3 minutes ago, Rian said:

you would see that he was criticizing Graffiti for what he said was "zionazi behavior"

Was this before or after Graffiti apparently wished Gov Hooka dead?

Just now, Communion said:

Was this before or after Graffiti apparently wished Gov Hooka dead?

Once again, he was criticized for his earlier conduct.

“imma be straight up with u as one of ur oomfs and somebody that you know is vehemently against antisemitism and knows where you stand, u rlly come off as a zionazi sometimes bc the behavior of demanding every possible anti-semitic dogwhistle be punished like it's a published manifesto/statement of intent to wipe out jews. That combined with the meltdowns and demands gives the appearance of bad faith where there isnt any. Not trying to wake up old arguments I just thought you might like to know the optics”

This is the person you’re picking a fight with because you made false assumptions as usual.

Having a Civics section allowed political discussion to be kept in one area and moderated there. I'm not sure how removing Civics is going to make it easier for moderators.

No one removed any part of ATRL during the height of the Black Lives Matter movement, because some white supremacists might have been offended.

one day when we're older

will we still look up in wonder

someday when we're wiser

will our hearts still have that fire

4 hours ago, Rian said:

Civics will return if/when mods are finished discussions on a serious matter.

I wasn’t shut down for one member. It’s a larger problem that has been going on with Civics for a while and it will not return until we as a staff come up with a plan to address it. And that’s the end of the discussion.

Just now, Rian said:

Once again, he was criticized for his earlier conduct.

This doesn't answer my question. Graffiti being "criticized" amounts to.. his friend having his back in a group chat? But GovHooka rightfully being criticized somehow results in some sweeping generalized decisions against every progressive user?

Surely there's an irony in chat posts like "Civics users are dogmatic, toxic, and abrasive" while allowing toxic, dogmatic and abrasive comments about users on a side platform that said users aren't on? And I say that with the full confidence of knowing what my posts are and my behavior that I know only staff can see. I don't flood your inboxes trying to silence people I don't agree with politically. And that's a fact every mod would know.

Users saying things like "Communionization" is probably meant to be hurtful but it isn't to me because I know nothing I do promotes antisemitism or harm to Jewish people. And I'm not going to be convinced that I do while those claiming such actively uphold a user who defends the existence of Zionism as an ethnic nationalist movement.

And it feels outrageous that such a person's opinion - or the opinions of those biased due to being his friend - would somehow be the basis for the claim that not only are the hundreds of progressive members on here guilty of so but also that the progressive moderators on here all in on some antisemitic moral failure.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion

I found this crashout kind of endearing ngl, the random short-lived obsession was very appealing to me as a borderline antisocial Taurus tbh.

8 minutes ago, Communion said:

You were being messy on Discord and let one user's bad behavior (Gov Hooka) get you riled up and feel vindicated to do a mass "comeuppance" on this separate platform that isn't actually justified once the emotions cool down and the group chat is no longer hyping each other up.

The "extremism is defeated!!" texts probably don't read as well on reflection when appeasing a massive Zionist.

Literally none of this happened btw the majority of users on that discord are not mods and have no say in the site's policy. Im 99.999% positive that there's a chat/discord/etc where the moderators discuss these things that literally nobody but them mention. The only thing Graffiti was outright advocating for REMOVING was the downvote button (of all things, very funny actually) to be deleted and there wasn't a single mod present and people were laughing at them for suggesting that dddd

i backread and nobody even knew the civics section of the site was gone until somebody randomly posted it because it was not formally announced to anybody

2 minutes ago, Communion said:

Your group chats with your friends wishing horrific things and cheering "EXTREMISM IS DEFEATED" in silencing anti-genocidal views should never have to be relayed to me because my name was brought up on a platform I am not part of. This was messy and inappropriate, let alone hurtful.

Nobody was suddenly rejoicing that Palestinian voices are being silenced, people want significant change to that side of the forum and they aren't all supporting Zionism in wanting it @Rian even said hours ago that the mod team are working on drafting new policy/etc to better moderate the civics section and that's why it was taken down

18 minutes ago, Rian said:

This is not a statement based in fact.

And if you had actually read lgaga1fan's post, you would see that he was criticizing Graffiti for what he said was "zionazi behavior". So you're making assumptions based on things that were not said. Which is a pattern of what you do, and it started well before the discussion of the israel/palestine conflict from 2023.

*this was @Sheep btw not me idk much about graffiti in general the only bone im picking at all is the cokeposting from one user about things that are either being blown out of proportion to be seen as the ultimatum for getting a side of the forum muted for what will likely be only a few days

Also sorry for the edit but this person keeps attributing a single person's nasty behavior to a whole discord. Atrributing one persons behavior to an entire group of people's, the exact thing that theyre criticizing the moderator team/admin for (which isn't reality). Like clockwork girl.

Edited June 14Jun 14 by lgaga1fan

2 minutes ago, lgaga1fan said:

Literally none of this happened btw the majority of users on that discord are not mods and have no say in the site's policy.

One would hope not if the people in this chat are wishing people be killed or found dead for not supporting Zionism.

Genuine questions to be had about the safety of users if this kind of chat is actively promoted across ATRL and people are actively being called slurs or threatened with violence for not supporting an ethno-nationalist movement.

How can members on here who are not Discord members ensure their posts are not being shared and discussed - if THAT is the kind of discussion some users find appropriate - on this server and that its official association to on here means it's appropriately moderated?

Edited June 14Jun 14 by Communion