ATRL Administrator Ryan Posted March 30 ATRL Administrator Share Posted March 30 Dear ATRL Community: After continued internal discussion, we began to start outlining the issues put forth by the constant topics regarding Harry Potter author J.K. Rowling and the various franchises in question and, as we discussed it each time, we kept coming back to the simple fact that Rowling is not only a bigot, but is actively pushing — in her position as a wealthy and famous individual — for legislation that will hurt trans people. It's been made clear in recent months that the ATRL community is incapable of discussing J.K. Rowling or her views with anything approaching civility. Many ATRLers have concerns about Rowling's views, particularly as they relate to the trans community; however, without fail, any discussion of those concerns has been met with hostility, contempt, and transphobia from a great number of those in the community, resulting in several Zero Tolerance Policy bans. This places the ATRL administration and mod team in a difficult position with conflicting responsibilities: our responsibility to ATRL’s trans community to ensure that they are treated with respect, and our responsibility to help foster substantive discussions about controversial topics. We've attempted to address the hostile and transphobic responses to these concerns in real-time, but this is proven to be unsustainable — there are simply not enough moderators to deal with the volume of toxicity that is thrown at the trans community on a timely basis; this is compounded by the fact that many of these comments unfortunately go unreported. Therefore, we're taking the unfortunate — but what we feel as necessary — step of banning any and all discussion of J.K. Rowling and related topics in posts concerning the Harry Potter Universe. We view a complete shutdown of JKR topics as the only way to allow those who enjoy the varied IPs and games, to be able to discuss them without conversations delving into her hateful views, or continuing to assail LGBTQ members with topics about her hate. This will safeguard the respect and dignity of all members of our community as best we can. It's long been the official stance of ATRL that trans rights are human rights, trans women are women, trans men are men, and that this forum should be a place that's welcoming to all, regardless of race, religion, gender identity, age, or ability; it's unfortunate that the community so often disagrees. 🏳️⚧️ 🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️ Link to comment
suburbannature Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Honestly, it's for the best. There's an undercurrent of transphobia on this site, perpetuating both harmful and nonfactual tropes about trans people as well as the "otherism" happening within the LGBTQ community on a larger scale. Allowing these topics to go on for pages has only resulted in the creation of echo chambers for these users' willful ignorance. Link to comment
Hector Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 I thoroughly agree with this. Along with any topics about trans athletes in sports, it never ends up well on this site. Link to comment
Fuecoco Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 We’re not even allowed to talk about Harry Potter? Link to comment
Phantom Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 (edited) I'm not sure I'm entirely on board with this (simply because though exhausting, I find that the wave of ZTPs following these threads serve a sort of out-with-the-trash kind of utility), but I get it. I'd also like to discuss if something like this can be in place for the likes of Shapiro, Walsh, Owens, Crowder etc. and other RW demons that have begun being posted a LOT more often on this site now. I still think we should allow threads mocking them (and I think the drags in JKR threads @ her provide a very small, but necessary catharsis for a lot of users, aside from also flushing out the bigots), but overall discussion around these figureheads needs to be limited as well, imo. I'd like to write more about this in detail. Perhaps I can DM you @Ryan or post in the ATHT? Regardless, I think I can see why this is in place, and it makes sense. I'd like to still be able to report, discuss, and mock her abject bigotry but it does strike me that a lot of people just find ways to support it instead... Edited March 30 by Phantom Link to comment
ejo Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Period! Now when is my sis' unfair suspension getting lifted? Link to comment
Poxy Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Thank you. I couldn’t stomach anymore of those “There are some points to what she said“ or “She spilled! “ type of posts. Link to comment
GotMyBlueprint Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Phantom said: I'd also like to discuss if something like this can be in place for the likes of Shapiro, Walsh, Owens, Crowder etc. and other RW demons that have begun being posted a LOT more often on this site now. Yeah, very weird that people like these and Trump, etc, can be freely discussed still but that Author is where a line is drawn Edited March 30 by GotMyBlueprint Link to comment
ATRL Administrator Ryan Posted March 30 Author ATRL Administrator Share Posted March 30 13 minutes ago, Fuecoco said: We’re not even allowed to talk about Harry Potter? Discuss Harry Potter to your heart’s content. Just don’t bring up JKR. Link to comment
ATRL Administrator Ryan Posted March 30 Author ATRL Administrator Share Posted March 30 14 minutes ago, Phantom said: I'm not sure I'm entirely on board with this (simply because though exhausting, I find that the wave of ZTPs following these threads serve a sort of out-with-the-trash kind of utility), but I get it. I'd also like to discuss if something like this can be in place for the likes of Shapiro, Walsh, Owens, Crowder etc. and other RW demons that have begun being posted a LOT more often on this site now. I still think we should allow threads mocking them (and I think the drags in JKR threads @ her provide a very small, but necessary catharsis for a lot of users, aside from also flushing out the bigots), but overall discussion around these figureheads needs to be limited as well, imo. I'd like to write more about this in detail. Perhaps I can DM you @Ryan or post in the ATHT? Regardless, I think I can see why this is in place, and it makes sense. I'd like to still be able to report, discuss, and mock her abject bigotry but it does strike me that a lot of people just find ways to support it instead... you can PM me, Lee & Bloo or post your thoughts here. Whichever you prefer. Link to comment
ATRL Administrator Ryan Posted March 30 Author ATRL Administrator Share Posted March 30 12 minutes ago, ejo said: Period! Now when is my sis' unfair suspension getting lifted? Working on it Link to comment
family.guy123 Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Can we just get rid of the civics section then? Like, this is a music website and the “news” reporting here is just a joke. It’s just a bunch of Twitter links Link to comment
JustLikeHoney Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 TBH I learned a lot from @Communion from one of his posts. It totally turned me off to that lady. But if the posts are causing people to feel bad about themselves because of some people being transphobic then I get it. It's for the best. Link to comment
Archetype Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 (edited) When are y’all going to ban threads about notorious bigot homophobe racist (hates dark skin people) violent criminal Trump supporter who cooks her cat and sacrifices chickens for religion Azealia Banks? Edited March 30 by Archetype Link to comment
DanDuke Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 (edited) I think silencing people to talk about or discuss a particular issue is quite authoritarian. I don’t agree with JKs views, but debating and challenging viewpoints and societal norms (especially ones that have accelerated rapidly) is a healthy part of humanity. If we are going to ban threads about JK, then surely we should also ban threads about Kanye West, Azealia Banks and other very problematic celebrities who have also actively attacked minorities. Ultimately though, this is a music forum so I don’t really care that much but I do think we need to be careful because this decision may lead to larger censorship, which may lead to us all living in an echo chamber. Disagreement is healthy. Edited March 30 by DanDuke Link to comment
Frozen99 Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 so, the way to deal with it, is to shut it down altogether. i don't discuss JKR or even visit the civics section but this is beyond stupid, what's next, are you gonna ban threads about azealia banks? you have all this ZTP... 1 minute ago, DanDuke said: I think silencing people to talk about or discuss a particular issue quite authoritarian. I don’t agree with JKs views, but debating and challenging viewpoints and societal norms (especially ones that have accelerated rapidly) is a healthy part of humanity. If we are going to ban threads about JK, then surely we should also ban threads about Kanye West, Azealia Banks and other very problematic celebrities who have also actively attacked minorities. Ultimately though, this is a music forum so I don’t really care that much but I do think we need to be careful because this decision may lead to larger censorship, which may lead to us all living in an echo chamber. Disagreement is healthy. ...exactly, you basically said what i meant. debating but especially EDUCATING is the most important thing, @Communion is a great champ of that. this ban is stupid. Link to comment
CaptainMusic Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 8 minutes ago, DanDuke said: I think silencing people to talk about or discuss a particular issue is quite authoritarian. I don’t agree with JKs views, but debating and challenging viewpoints and societal norms (especially ones that have accelerated rapidly) is a healthy part of humanity. If we are going to ban threads about JK, then surely we should also ban threads about Kanye West, Azealia Banks and other very problematic celebrities who have also actively attacked minorities. Ultimately though, this is a music forum so I don’t really care that much but I do think we need to be careful because this decision may lead to larger censorship, which may lead to us all living in an echo chamber. Disagreement is healthy. The problem is that very few people’s viewpoints are changed in those threads, there’s always a number of transphobic comments in them and members agreeing with or praising her when it’s beyond clear she has a vendetta against trans people. Threads should be allowed so people can continue to expose their transphobic views and in turn get banned, otherwise now we’ll just have more bigots posting. Link to comment
Century Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 I'm going to miss my weekly dose of watching transphobic gays get the lashings they deserve but this is a totally fair decision Link to comment
Bimbo Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 5 minutes ago, CaptainMusic said: Threads should be allowed so people can continue to expose their transphobic views and in turn get banned, otherwise now we’ll just have more bigots posting. My thoughts exactly. Link to comment
AbeHicks Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Ban discussion of Azealia Banks too then. Link to comment
Allday Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 does this mean no harry Potter topics too? however seems fine with me Link to comment
Suilen Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 As a trans person, I agree with the ban. Sure, there are plenty of posts in her threads that condemn her, but then you have users that post stuff like "She's entitled to her opinion", and like... Would you say the same about a homophobic person? Doubt it. And if you fooled yourself into thinking that Joanne is "fighting for women's rights" or that "she's not really transphobic, she's just concerned", then it's on you and not on trans people or real allies having to explain over and over again why it's not the case. If people can't have some emphathy to their fellow LGBTQ+s even though there are plenty of shared experiences, then I don't know what else can help, so thank you for this measure, even if it's not perfect. Link to comment
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