8 hours ago, sunny said:

Also about that article.... I dont care about west's opinion on kpop... They say the same things for over a decade now... blah blah blah... Let them be concerned with the music in America which is **** for decades now. Kpop is a niche market and it will always be, even with the global attention it has got lately. Its like anime. The END

Anime + Kpop aren't niche anymore. Interestingly, Netflix is kind of responsible for both becoming more mainstream. There's other factors, like the market consolidating in both arenas (Sony purchasing Crunchyroll, Hybe controlling the local market through fraud & expanding outward).

I also think we're about to see the Kpop Demon Hunters effect in 2026, where a lot of songs will sound like the soundtrack for that movie, and will likely include more English lyrics than necessary. We're already seeing it now; a bunch of Kpop groups just straight up release songs in English even when it sounds ridiculous (have a look at Close Your Eyes' SOB).

Not sure what the point is in pretending that this isn't the reality now. I'm sure we'll still get some great songs despite all this.

all over twitter tiktok instagram but KTRL remains silent. why?

3 hours ago, sunny said:

The copy thing is so weird when every company molds most news groups after the last one. see 2NE1-BP etc

I mean the reason CLC floped is because instead of copying 4minutes as intended, the last moment CUBE decided to make them go the cute route. They only gained popularity when they actually did it with HOGOBLIN. Stans even now accuse CUBE for this.

anyway Merry XMas with the best Xmas kpop songs

From what I've gathered the thinking is that the traditional brother/sister group molding doesnt apply to NewJeansand ILLIT because HYBE is seen as external to ADOR despite owning them and didnt have much creative input in NewJeans.

So any creative/directional overlap from an actual HYBE managed group is seen as a transgression made to undermine NewJeans, which seemed to be the main complaint raised by MHJ's side initially. Imo there is a discussion to be had on big labels like HYBE having competing groups that overlap in style/audience but it gets diluted when people just accuse ILLIT of plagiarism all the time

18 hours ago, sunny said:

But she wasnt even the center in the dance breaks. She never had her spotlight and she was the best dancer by miles

The copy thing is so weird when every company molds most news groups after the last one. see 2NE1-BP etc

I mean the reason CLC floped is because instead of copying 4minutes as intended, the last moment CUBE decided to make them go the cute route. They only gained popularity when they actually did it with HOGOBLIN. Stans even now accuse CUBE for this.*

CLC is another story... First Hobgoblin:

Songwriters	Hyuna Seo Jaewoo Big Sancho Son Youngjin

The producer and director of that comeback was HyunA.

Just like NOWADAYS comeback was made by I-DLE YuQi or PENTAGON had a whole comeback by BTOB.

SBS

But we knew what time it was they censored HYUN Whole verse

And they claimed it was for the word Kill yet Sumni the same episode wasn't censored.

6 hours ago, Asscatchem said:

all over twitter tiktok instagram but KTRL remains silent. why?

please become a real group

6 hours ago, Butters said:

From what I've gathered the thinking is that the traditional brother/sister group molding doesnt apply to NewJeansand ILLIT because HYBE is seen as external to ADOR despite owning them and didnt have much creative input in NewJeans.

So any creative/directional overlap from an actual HYBE managed group is seen as a transgression made to undermine NewJeans, which seemed to be the main complaint raised by MHJ's side initially. Imo there is a discussion to be had on big labels like HYBE having competing groups that overlap in style/audience but it gets diluted when people just accuse ILLIT of plagiarism all the time

you forgot the small detail that they debuted less than 2 years apart

On 12/25/2025 at 5:15 PM, Graffiti said:

Miss them so much

@redsing707 the downvote?

What is this? and they release something call Good Thing? Is that like a promo single or something cause 81 for them… even that Ciera downfall gif did not served drastic fall like this

32 minutes ago, Asscatchem said:

you forgot the small detail that they debuted less than 2 years apart

And the part where the "dad" is beating up the "mom", and bullying and stealing everything from the "bastard daughter" to give it to his other "legitimate daughter".

Hybe stans want to play pots and pans with their little perfect family fantasy when we got a whole Menendez brothers horror story over there.

Yeseo and Suhye to freedom, but mess at the Japanese subunit essentially becoming the group no main roles or center meanwhile the boycott still going strong… just disband atp

9 hours ago, elevate said:

Anime + Kpop aren't niche anymore. Interestingly, Netflix is kind of responsible for both becoming more mainstream. There's other factors, like the market consolidating in both arenas (Sony purchasing Crunchyroll, Hybe controlling the local market through fraud & expanding outward).

I also think we're about to see the Kpop Demon Hunters effect in 2026, where a lot of songs will sound like the soundtrack for that movie, and will likely include more English lyrics than necessary. We're already seeing it now; a bunch of Kpop groups just straight up release songs in English even when it sounds ridiculous (have a look at Close Your Eyes' SOB).

Not sure what the point is in pretending that this isn't the reality now. I'm sure we'll still get some great songs despite all this.

It is Niche it will always be, i dont know why you act as if a Kids NETFLIX film and its songs gonna make the earth turn upside down.

When we say mainstream we are talking about things that are consumed by the majority of the general public and liking them doesnt put you in a weird spot.

Sure your str8 cousin and his bros might watch One piece and used to watch naruto and bleach but talk about any non GP aproved anime and your are a weibo. Also 2-3 Anime movies have entered the USA top 10 BOX Office weekly but its not like its regular and it only happens when all anime stans gather. Put more than one monthly and their numbers will fall drastically. As for awards if you are not a Gibli you cant compete.

Comic Book movies were a niche once and became maisntream when the majority of the box office was consisted by them adn every A list was starring in one. If anime becomes like that then we talk.

Kpop wise its even harder due to racism. Sure some songs will enter the Billboard 100 and 1 or 2 might become global like golden or PSY but try to say you listen to kpop and name lovelyz etc and tell me the side looks you gonna get... As for awards lets not even go there. They only reason kpop acts are considered are for MTV and stuff who take advantage of kpop stans obsesssion.

Both kpop and anime are niche categories of their respective fields, arguing the opposite is non realistic. They used to be underground and became Niche but mainstream its farfetched.

kpop becoming more mainstream its ok but being obsessed with west validation is annoying, harmfull and futile.

---

to make it more clear, Football and basketball are mainstream, tennis is niche. Tennis is still a million dollar industry but it attracts a certain kind of audience, only few names become globally known and majority of people havent hold a racket in their lives. now compare it with the other 2 and you will get it.

Edited December 27, 2025Dec 27 by sunny

2 hours ago, Asscatchem said:

you forgot the small detail that they debuted less than 2 years apart

They're more like cousin groups if anything.

People don't talk enough about these queens' b-sides. The way these 2 EPs are excellent front to back

9 hours ago, Butters said:

From what I've gathered the thinking is that the traditional brother/sister group molding doesnt apply to NewJeansand ILLIT because HYBE is seen as external to ADOR despite owning them and didnt have much creative input in NewJeans.

So any creative/directional overlap from an actual HYBE managed group is seen as a transgression made to undermine NewJeans, which seemed to be the main complaint raised by MHJ's side initially. Imo there is a discussion to be had on big labels like HYBE having competing groups that overlap in style/audience but it gets diluted when people just accuse ILLIT of plagiarism all the time

The other issue is that newjeans was still a new group themselves… usually when a company debuts a new group and there's a somewhat overlapping image (BP vs 2NE1 for example), the older group is already at or past their 7 year contract expiration and new blood is needed.

HYBE did not need a newjeans 2.0 less than 2 years after newjeans debut when they were very much still at their peak.

2 hours ago, starstruckaj said:

Yeseo and Suhye to freedom, but mess at the Japanese subunit essentially becoming the group no main roles or center meanwhile the boycott still going strong… just disband atp

But they're still with the company?

Some taxi drivers gave him Turkish chocolate as a Christmas present. Taehyung then did a 1.5-minute live stream to show them. This is the result of that lol

RIP

2 hours ago, Gaia said:

The other issue is that newjeans was still a new group themselves… usually when a company debuts a new group and there's a somewhat overlapping image (BP vs 2NE1 for example), the older group is already at or past their 7 year contract expiration and new blood is needed.

HYBE did not need a newjeans 2.0 less than 2 years after newjeans debut when they were very much still at their peak.

There's no point in even going back and forth over this, it's just simple business and logic. They did it to stifle the girls and push their overlapping group because they didn't like that min Heejin was working outside of the SHEIN monopoly they are turning the genre into.

Yeah they got what they wanted by silencing the women involved, but now their groups' fanbases are basically maga and are now heavily aligning themselves with cyberwreckers, incels, DC gallery conservatives, and a bunch of other nasties all out of spite towards a few girl groups. Like… at this point yall are basically supporting gangsters and 4chan trolls. Let's see how well that works out for their groups over time.

I used to buy all LSFM's albums and I feel like many people supported both them and NJ, because they were different and didn't have a bunch of overlaps or "coincidences" so it's not like they cannibalized each other. And now I won't support them or any other HYBE group. Fans from other groups outside of their orbit are wary as well.

I've said this before and I'll say it again; this isn't just a NewJeans issue. Any group going forward that BSH feels threatened by is gonna get attacked by the mafia and their guard dogs

Edited December 27, 2025Dec 27 by Cyanide

Tell me why is SM always so messy

49 minutes ago, Gaia said:

The other issue is that newjeans was still a new group themselves… usually when a company debuts a new group and there's a somewhat overlapping image (BP vs 2NE1 for example), the older group is already at or past their 7 year contract expiration and new blood is needed.

HYBE did not need a newjeans 2.0 less than 2 years after newjeans debut when they were very much still at their peak.

It's not wrong, but I feel like you are all beating around the bush here.

The duplication of Newjeans is not a coincidence, an accident, or a mistake. That would imply a lack of intent. Reducing the scandal to some mere "overlapping image" is downplaying the significance of the hostility, interference, and sabotage Newjeans endured. Bang Sihyuk not only never intended for Newjeans to be that successful - that's why the Team N project was dropped in the 1st place in favor of Team S with some seasoned idols, which he believed would be more successful - but he also deliberately planned and engineered their downfall when they did become successful.

This is an act of malice with premeditation. There is plenty of circumstantial evidence of Hybe discriminating against Newjeans, from Bang Si-hyuk's personal remarks (mocking Ditto's success in DMs) or actions (him showing the Newjeans girls the cold shoulder and ignoring them, creating a hostile work environment) to documents and testimonies (all the interferences with brand deals and awards, the CFO saying Bang Sihyuk's girl group has to be the successful one and Newjeans' success is problematic, the CEO saying he wants to ruin Newjeans and MHJ's reputation), and many other things like deliberate miscommunication, personal information leaks, negative mediaplay or the alleged smear campaign.

Hybe is not a meritocracy with independent labels fairly competing against each other, where some accidents can happen. It's an authoritarian system with a cult of personality centered on Bang Sihyuk, who makes all the decisions as the president of the company, president of the board of directors, and biggest shareholder. BSH decides which groups are successful and which aren't. Internal promotions or opportunities are decided based on loyalty, not performance or competence. Only the groups he has a hand in creating are getting pushed. All sublabel directors have been replaced by his minions.

Belifb Lab CEO Kim Taeho is also Hybe COO, the 2nd most powerful man in the company, and a longtime Bang Sihyuk associate, who has been with Hybe and before that Bighit for 10 years. Kim Taeho didn't haphazardly stumble upon Min Heejin's debut plan for Newjeans, contact list, demos, work in progress, etc. He and Bang Sihyuk co-conspired to steal all of this for themselves to replicate through Belift Lab. While they would continue to interfere with Newjeans activities through the shared services department at Hybe that handles all the communication, pr, hr, legal, brand deals, partnerships for all the sublabels. Before finally moving against Min Heejin publicly, orchestrating her removal to fully take control of the Newjeans property and freeze them entirely.

This is not a singular story about "sister groups" copying each other or artists getting bullied at work. It's a multifaceted story about a conglomerate using all its power to crush dissidents like Newjeans and MHJ who dare to challenge Bang Sihyuk as the King of Kpop.

Edited December 28, 2025Dec 28 by geniecantstophypeboy

1 hour ago, Zack said:

Tell me why is SM always so messy

It's the PD of the shows picks.
Now the bigger problem is the Gayo is a festival where they often cover others songs, the bigger problem is Heart2Hearts spent their whole year of covering SM whole catalog.

Edited December 27, 2025Dec 27 by Xalric

oh she snapped here