1 hour ago, Almodusa said:

I mean… Gaga is obviously saying yes to all these interviewers who are asking her about coming back to their countries for her next tour. It'll be awkward if she said no.

"nah, that country is a dump. I won't be going, sorry."

If the RT score ends up matching Katy's...

 

 

3 hours ago, TrymeB said:

Best thing to do is to laugh it off at this point

6 hours ago, Dylangaga said:

All these ROTTEN tomatoes. 

 

NOT in my Garden of Eden

We are gonna harvest rotten apples instead 

 

9 minutes ago, Dylangaga said:

If the RT score ends up matching Katy's...

 

 

I mean, one is a group project and the other is led by one person, Katy Perry... 

Me trying to browse ATRL in peace

 

Gaga pinning Happy Mistake under her music for TikTok.

 

It ain't happening there.

 

53 minutes ago, Sheep said:

People keep misreading FAD, both critics and audiences, I'll thread it in a month or two once spoilers are less of a big deal

 

  Hide contents

The musical sequences are there because a: Arthur can't express himself well and that was consistent from the opening of the 2019 film b: Lee was a psych major who became obsessed with him after a tv movie and specifically preyed on him using his connection to music which was one of the defining characteristics of Joker at his only public appearance in the first film.

 

The music comes out of him when he's struggling to cope with reality or express himself, he literally dances and sings after killing people. Lee used this link as an attack vector to push him towards insanity. I don't know how much more clear the film could have made this between the close to you scene and the last scene with Lee on the stairs. She's manipulating him, he knows it too which is what prompts the complete deconstruction of the Joker persona. The song choice of gonna build a mountain was so important because its a nice sentiment but she was promising him NOTHING, which was her entire role in the film. She was encouraging his delusions and weaponizing his loneliness. He even knew this on some level which was the point of the Joker & Lee show sequences.

 

People keep asking for less musical sequences and more romance but that's the entire damn point. We don't see more of Lee because there wasn't much to see, they weren't really in love. Even the s*x scene was stiff and emotionless and grey. I don't know how much more they could have done to draw this line(and parallel to his mother in the first film) than to show her as a crazy fan trying to become the mother of a powerful man's child.

 

The folie a deux in question in the title is arthur and his shadow, that was the entire point of the opening cartoon. The circumstances that shaped him into a murderer evaporated the second he became a symbol for resistance against the elites, leaving him the same sad and mentally ill person being systematically abused, just with some clown makeup on. It can be argued that this makes the 2nd film a retread but the fact that this time he ends up taking responsibility for his crimes and then literally getting what he deserves is infinitely more satisfying than the ending of the first film.

 

A lot of this dissonance be attributed to it being marketed as a different kind of story, but the first film was marketed as an origin story for the criminal mastermind Joker, who was made abundantly clear not to have ever existed in either films.

 

It sucks that that's entertainment was cut but assuming it was going to replace her betrayal of him, it would have been backwards after Arthur comes back down to reality to have a giant mega musical sequence. It makes more sense for him to be begging for the music to stop.

 

Spoiler

Agree with everything you say here. But as I said on Monday night, if this was going to be the end result anyway, they should've made the ride more thrilling. 
 

What if they actually broke out of prison, were on the run, and Lee manipulated him to wreak more havoc? 
 

Why cut scenes that establish Lee as even more of a stalker/predator? (Telling the old lady to go to hell, building more towards her final look, the elevator scene, her reading books about serial killers/child abuse). 
 

Why didn't they use Arthur's imagination more to create more interesting plot lines? Obviously them dancing on the court room stairs with her pregnant was supposed to be in his imagination. 
 

Why cut That's Entertainment on the stairs? She betrayed him anyway, so at least give us a satisfying, absolutely INSANE finale before that result instead of a 30 second snooze fest conversation. 

All of these choices could've been made without forgoing the fact that Lee didn't actually love Arthur. 

 

To me the editing and script were the biggest downfalls of JFAD. There's a really strong concept but it's not developed correctly. And if it was done that way to appease fans of the first movie, that was a major f*ck up, because the cardinal sin of offing Arthur was already going to be committed. So why not take bigger swings in the process? 

 

Edited October 3, 20242 yr by frankvert

Browsing the pages I've missed definitely is way quicker when most of it is

 

Spoiler

spoiler tags

 

DWAS is just so good. I heard it on the radio and whew. The way it felt like a HIT!

 

Although I agree with Grace Randolph's review of JFAD and enjoy her style of commentary / humor, she can absolutely shut the f*ck up, sit there, and eat her food. It's because of influencers like her, who expressed concerns about where Toad was taking the Arthur/Lee relationship dynamic, that we got a limp, neutered mess. I wish he went with the big swing he seemingly initially sought to take, before studios / tastemakers / stakeholders allegedly raised concerns.   

Edited October 3, 20242 yr by frankvert

Anyway, we should be focusing on DWAS in 2 days with the vinyls shipping. 

1 minute ago, justin. said:

Anyway, we should be focusing on DWAS in 2 days with the vinyls shipping. 

apparently it only sold 3k. We have no power as a fan base anymore. Something happened between Chromatica and now where a lot of die hards aged out of stanning or felt betrayed by the nurtec ads and stuff or something  

RT:  53 (-1) from 74 reviews 

MC: 50 (-1) from 29 reviews

2 minutes ago, justin. said:

Anyway, we should be focusing on DWAS in 2 days with the vinyls shipping. 

Are people even gonna but it tho

Her usa fanbase is pretty much nonexistent

 

Spoiler

17 minutes ago, frankvert said:

Agree with everything you say here. But as I said on Monday night, if this was going to be the end result anyway, they should've made the ride more thrilling. 
 

What if they actually broke out of prison, were on the run, and Lee manipulated him to wreak more havoc? 
 

Why cut scenes that establish Lee as even more of a crazy stalker? (Telling the old lady to go to hell, building more towards her final look, the elevator scene, her reading books about serial killers/child abuse). 
 

Why didn't they use Arthur's imagination more to create more interesting plot lines? Obviously them dancing on the court room stairs with her pregnant was supposed to be in his imagination. 
 

Why cut That's Entertainment on the stairs? She betrayed him anyway, so at least give us a satisfying, absolutely INSANE finale performance before that result instead of a 30 second snooze fest conversation. 

All of these choices could've been made without forgoing the fact that Lee didn't actually love Arthur. 

 

To me the editing and script were the biggest downfalls of JFAD. There's a really concept but it's not developed correctly. And if it was done that way to appease fans of the first movie, that was a major f*ck up, because the cardinal sin of offing Arthur was already going to be committed. So why not take bigger swings in the process? 

Honestly I feel like most of the criticisms could have been addressed by redoing the biggest flaw with the first movie and beating you over the head with the fact that Lee was calculated and 100% the antagonist of this story. A montage of her studying the TV movie to plan her infiltration into his life would have done more to wrap things up than what we know was shot and cut. But then again this was one of the things that made it feel the most like a comic book movie to me the first time around, we knew from the first 20 minutes of Joker that he hallucinated relationships with people, we didnt need it to be shown, then explained, then shown again that his relationships to his neighbor or the Waynes were fake, the filmmaking was strong enough to stand without it and I believe it was here too. I guess it could have made it more digestible though, people are definitely taking the wrong messages away from this one. I thought Joaquin's performance was top tier even for him and effortlessly conveyed all of this stuff without the typical superhero movie dialogue where the plot is explained to you instead of acted out.

 

I still feel very strongly that a big musical sequence at the end would have been antithetical to both characters because it would mean that Arthur is still struggling to see reality or that Lee wasn't calculated the whole time and was just as crazy as him. I would really really love to see it included as a bonus on streaming or the physical release though because it looked like the centerpiece of the film.

 

Edited October 3, 20242 yr by Sheep

1 minute ago, TrymeB said:

RT:  53 (-1) from 74 reviews 

MC: 50 (-1) from 29 reviews

Why are you guys still updating

The self torture 

RACE TO 1B

 

Day 47

480.799.422 (+11.363.556)

 

Daily average required

8.511.485 (-46.001)

 

61 days left

 

 

Spoiler

Current daily average

10.229.775 (+24.647)

 

Expected to hit 1B on

98 (=)

 

1 minute ago, IBeMe said:

apparently it only sold 3k. We have no power as a fan base anymore. Something happened between Chromatica and now where a lot of die hards aged out of stanning or felt betrayed by the nurtec ads and stuff or something  

Well, damn. Nvm 

 

 

Rumors swirling that Joaquin requested Gaga scenes to be cut 

 

Joaquin Phoenix enemy of the gays

4 minutes ago, IBeMe said:

apparently it only sold 3k. We have no power as a fan base anymore. Something happened between Chromatica and now where a lot of die hards aged out of stanning or felt betrayed by the nurtec ads and stuff or something  

Yeah and it was kinda predictable too, you canrlt keep paying dust to your fanbase and expect them to be always there for you

But she can always gain their support back by doing a decent era with lg7

1 hour ago, IBeMe said:

apparently it only sold 3k. We have no power as a fan base anymore. Something happened between Chromatica and now where a lot of die hards aged out of stanning or felt betrayed by the nurtec ads and stuff or something  

or, hear me out, chromatica was just plain bad 

9 minutes ago, IBeMe said:

apparently it only sold 3k. We have no power as a fan base anymore. Something happened between Chromatica and now where a lot of die hards aged out of stanning or felt betrayed by the nurtec ads and stuff or something  

I'm surprised that the combination of Dawn of Chromatica, Love For Sale, and now Harlequin hasn't consolidated a massive fan following!

 

Just now, Khris said:

or, hear me out, chromatica was just plain bad 

Not really is pretty decent

Her cancelling everything and just dissapearing is what made a lot of people mad

3 minutes ago, Khris said:

or, hear me out, chromatica was just plain bad 

Said no real fan ever