1 hour ago, Si Hoo said:

No I'm not saying that.

What I'm saying is she needs album that will be lasted as masterpiece something that tops year end lists of critics something that crosses 90s on Metacritic

I think the industry seems hopeful rn for females, more so than in 2020 when her last album came out.

 

Gaga and co aren't stupid (i know we lash them lol).

 

Remember her last album is now the third studio album in a row to not really reach full potential, she missed AOTY for C2C follow-up, and the BA nom for HoG. HMH did great for OST, but not compared to what we've seen from Gaga in that realm of release.

 

I think Gaga will bring it with her next project, she will not take 'defeats' lying down

Edited October 10, 20223 yr by Mr. Stratus

23 minutes ago, toanythingtaboo said:

Being legendary is about staying power, memorability and influence. It's not sales, acclaim or followers.

 

Naturally, there are some exceptions (i.e. "Thriller is the best selling album of all time") but mostly when people talk about someone being a legend, they cite largely intangible sentiments like "___ shaped the industry", "everyone knows ___" etc. Someone cements themselves as a legend when the naysayers are drowned out by the majority opinion over time.

 

Gaga is well on her way there. It doesn't matter what her albums sell, or are rated as. That's not where her validation comes from. There's been a very noticeable shift in aforementioned intangible sentiment on her these past 5 years. From 'fun but flash in the pan pop phenomenon' to 'oh she really is an all-round entertainer like we haven't seen in decades'. 

 

What I DO think will move her along in that journey is an acting Oscar. Because that's a symbol of validation that *not everyone gets. Metacritic etc is niche.

 

 

Very eloquently put  and I agree with most of this.

 

8 minutes ago, Mr. Stratus said:

 

Remember her last album is now the third studio album in a row to not really reach full potential, she missed AOTY for C2C follow-up, and the BA nom for HoG. HMH did great for OST, but not compared to what we've seen from Gaga in that realm of release.

This is the thing. Some of her fans think if something new did not reach the high levels she set before, then it's a failure/underperformance when it blows the competition out of the water. The fan treatment to HMH just because it's not Shallow level is sad, despite being a good song and outperforming soundtracks from other girls.

 

 

Queen of baguettes

Gaga filming JFAD after the success of this stadium tour is a good thing, the energy she had on stage was incredible and I'm sure we will see it on the movie as well.

42 minutes ago, toanythingtaboo said:

Being legendary is about staying power, memorability and influence. It's not sales, acclaim or followers.

It's sort of a combination of all of these.  Some legends rely more on stats and acclaim, whereas others can be commercial flops and be considered legends.  I would say influence and impact are the type of "sum" of these terms, and as long as Gaga is able to maintain the level of influence and impact she has, she'll be considered a legend when she's older.  She's still too young for people to openly call her a legend IMO.  It makes more sense for Bey bc she is actually older.

39 minutes ago, toanythingtaboo said:

Being legendary is about staying power, memorability and influence. It's not sales, acclaim or followers.

 

Naturally, there are some exceptions (i.e. "Thriller is the best selling album of all time") but mostly when people talk about someone being a legend, they cite largely intangible sentiments like "___ shaped the industry", "everyone knows ___" etc. Someone cements themselves as a legend when the naysayers are drowned out by the majority opinion over time.

 

Gaga is well on her way there. It doesn't matter what her albums sell, or are rated as. That's not where her validation comes from. There's been a very noticeable shift in aforementioned intangible sentiment on her these past 5 years. From 'fun but flash in the pan pop phenomenon' to 'oh she really is an all-round entertainer like we haven't seen in decades'. 

 

What I DO think will move her along in that journey is an acting Oscar. Because that's a symbol of validation that everyone gets. Metacritic etc is niche.

Absolutely agree, Cher for example doesn't even has a #1 album, not even #2, and yet some of her eras, songs and looks are more rembered than certain acts that performed better numbers wise back in the day.

 

Not to mention that especially these days, digital numbers have became very manipulable with fake streams or heavy playlist payola, fake followers, radio payola and so on.

 

This wasn't a #1 single and yet it's one of the most remembered song, video and look of her.

 

1 hour ago, ineedboxinggloves said:

Did we talk about this? Credible or not, they start filming in two months so this seems reasonable. 

It's definitely very likely that fitting has been happening these days, it has been confirmed the costumist it's the one of the first 'Joker' who was oscar nominated for it  and won twice for previous movies.

43 minutes ago, OreGuy said:

This is the thing. Some of her fans think if something new did not reach the high levels she set before, then it's a failure/underperformance when it blows the competition out of the water. The fan treatment to HMH just because it's not Shallow level is sad, despite being a good song and outperforming soundtracks from other girls.

HMH really hasn't done any better or worse then how you'd expect a solo Gaga single to perform commercially - it's even out-charted or matched ARUTW in many markets, and other girls don't try HMH on this website cause 90% OSTs bomb. HMH we just hope will age nicely like MR and be part of the Oscar conversation. 

 

I just think Gaga has high standards with side projects. I think she is at her best when she's got something to prove, even though standard are high she has had some 'losses'. I can totally see them coming in hard with LG7.

Edited October 10, 20223 yr by Mr. Stratus

1 hour ago, Marry Illusion Glory said:

I mean, yeah it would be nice if she got one "90+ album on MC that tops year end lists of critics" but is it the end-all-be-all? I don't think so necessarily. She will get one but regardless, Gaga's impact and legacy is so much bigger than that and speaks for itself. And she knows it. That's all I'll say.

 

Her relationship with critics has also been complicated for a long time but that's for another day.

That's the point, until bitter Madonna stans with their crappy publications (see Slant magazine) or other biased haters are allowed to count for Metacritic with moronic and biased reviews, she will never get that critically acclaim, there will always be publications that rate her down no matter which album she pull and vice versa you see other people getting critically acclaimed for overrated crap made by writing camps with low effort from the main artist credited.

 

Also I agree, a high Metacritic score is not the validation that she needs at every cost to fortify her legacy, I don't know a single person in real life who knows what is Metacritic.

20 minutes ago, Leptine said:

That's the point, until bitter Madonna stans with their crappy publications (see Slant magazine) or other biased haters are allowed to count for Metacritic with moronic and biased reviews, she will never get that critically acclaim, there will always be publications that rate her down no matter which album she pull and vice versa you see other people getting critically acclaimed for overrated crap made by writing camps with low effort from the main artist credited.

 

Also I agree, a high Metacritic score is not the validation that she needs at every cost to fortify her legacy, I don't know a single person in real life who knows what is Metacritic.

Idk i feel like if she's undeniable even her strongest critics will fold tbh.

Honestly i feel like her collaborators have not been up to par with Gaga as contributors in her music. She has to work with the right people, possibly the best people in music for her to put out the her best work yet. ?

TFM is her pop classic, BTW too and maybe even TF. She has them already. Before Norman Lana had BTD and Uv, before ROL Madonna had Like a Prayer, Debut, LAV and True Blue. Just cause they weren’t acclaimed on the spot doesn’t change much. Retrospective acclaim is way more impressive. Yall obsession with metacritic is silly. 

4 minutes ago, Kimi said:

TFM is her pop classic, BTW too and maybe even TF. She has them already. Before Norman Lana had BTD and Uv, before ROL Madonna had Like a Prayer, Debut, LAV and True Blue. Just cause they weren’t acclaimed on the spot doesn’t change much. Retrospective acclaim is way more impressive. Yall obsession with metacritic is silly. 

I think TF and TFM are very fine work for her as a beginner, but the rest for a mature and the caliber of artist that Gaga is it's not good enough i think. I don't care about metacritic per se, i care that she makes an imaculate album that matches her talent as a versatile singer with amazing flawless songwriting and production. 

2 hours ago, Si Hoo said:

She is not greatest musicians of all time. She has things to prove. The most urgent thing is that she needs masterpiece like Melodrama or Norman Fuckin Rockwell or Lemonade. Album that will make her go legendary level. TFM and BTW is not enough.

Those albums are not legendary at all

They're overrated only on gay forums and certain online publications, and they don't make those people legends, especially when it comes to Lorde and Lana.

 

it takes also time to an album to reach a real legendary status and becoming a cult classic.

 

'Nevermind' from Nirvana, 'Like a Prayer', 'Ray of Light', 'Thriller', 'The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill', 'Back to Black', 'Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness', 'Jagged little Pill', ecc, these are real legendary albums and they also have at least a very well known single from them, thing that the albums you mention don't.

maybe some of you don’t stan her really?  she has always been camp pop artist with edgy artistic spirit, rockstar energy and intentional wackiness and her early work captures that. You don’t need maturity to be acclaimed and iconic - literally Madonnas debut comes to mind. I can’t believe i have to explain this in Lady Gaga base. Lady ******* GaGa 

2 minutes ago, Kimi said:

maybe some of you don’t stan her really?  she has always been camp pop artist with edgy artistic spirit, rockstar energy and intentional wackiness and her early work captures that. You don’t need maturity to be acclaimed and iconic - literally Madonnas debut comes to mind. I can’t believe i have to explain this in Lady Gaga base. Lady ******* GaGa 

Idk if feel like you're the one who doesn't know her, or you just have low expectations?! 

28 minutes ago, Katniss said:

Honestly i feel like her collaborators have not been up to par with Gaga as contributors in her music. She has to work with the right people, possibly the best people in music for her to put out the her best work yet. ?

great comment

 

Since her rebrand and ASIB, think she's right under that critical acclaim level (General field grammy, 81+ on MC). Chromatica being as cohesive as it was could even be seen as critic baiting, as with th boom of poptimsim in the last 3 years they absolutely love that in a pop album - and Chromatica made the top 50 year end aggregate as a result, whereas J/AP missed.

 

My last thought:

 

I think Gaga has always had the right idea, the right concept and the right thing to say in her music, but since TFM it hasn't translated, it hasn't hit the nail quite as it could've and should've. And i believe this is because her collaborators haven't been good enough and there's nothing to be ashamed of coz every great artist needs the right people around them to reach their full potential. My 

36 minutes ago, Kimi said:

TFM is her pop classic, BTW too and maybe even TF. She has them already. Before Norman Lana had BTD and Uv, before ROL Madonna had Like a Prayer, Debut, LAV and True Blue. Just cause they weren’t acclaimed on the spot doesn’t change much. Retrospective acclaim is way more impressive. Yall obsession with metacritic is silly. 

I agree, and it's even funnier in Lana's case, her albums before Norman are not even that different from it, the genre and the way of sing it's literally the same, the lyrics are not that different either, 'Ultraviolence' was a solid album even if it wasn't high acclaimed, same for 'Honeymoon', the critics just decided to wake up for 'Norman' when she literally had valid and similar albums before.

 

Some people are obsessed with Metacritic because they let haters entering in ther minds because they have used it to their silly arguments against Gaga.

 

 

Imagine ignoring Born This Way's existence just like that.

4 minutes ago, Leptine said:

I agree, and it's even funnier in Lana's case, her albums before Norman are not even that different from it, the genre and the way of sing it's literally the same, the lyrics are not that different either, 'Ultraviolence' was a solid album even if it wasn't high acclaimed, same for 'Honeymoon', the critics just decided to wake up for 'Norman' when she literally had valid and similar albums before.

 

Some people are obsessed with Metacritic because they let haters entering in ther minds because they have used it to their silly arguments against Gaga.

 

 

Lana is my #1 fave and i agrih with you, nfr feels like a continuation not some grand revolution and i always felt like its kinda we are sorry lana, here’s the acclaim you always deserved. 

Gaga has 3 albums that can be considered her magnun opus for different reasons: TFM, BTW and ASIB, not only for the music but for how the whole eras were executed, the visuals, performances, everything, all 3 albums are solidifying their cult pop classic status always more, see also their recurrent streams.

With BTW having the edge over the other two for me when it comes to creativity in general.

 

'Chromatica' had the potential, but they chose the wrong lead single and the whole circumstances of release were unfortunate, but I think nobody has doubts that song like 'Replay' and 'Enigma' are between highlights of her career, the cover and concpet of the album were also between her best, it's not casual that majority of the fans think it was the best tour.

10 minutes ago, Kimi said:

Lana is my #1 fave and i agrih with you, nfr feels like a continuation not some grand revolution and i always felt like its kinda we are sorry lana, here’s the acclaim you always deserved. 

My thoughts exactly.

1 minute ago, Leptine said:

Gaga has 3 albums that can be considered her magnun opus for different reasons: TFM, BTW and ASIB, not only for the music but for how the whole eras were executed, the visuals, performances, everything, all 3 albums are solidifying their cult pop classic status always more, see also their recurrent streams.

With BTW having the edge over the other two for me when it comes to creativity in general.

 

'Chromatica' had the potential, but they chose the wrong lead single and the whole circumstances of release were unfortunate, but I think nobody has doubts that song like 'Replay' and 'Enigma' are between highlishts of her career, the cover and concpet of the album were also between her best, it's not casual that majority of the fans think it was the best tour.

I think ASIB showed her full potential as a vocalist, TF and TFM her full potential as a pop artist hit maker, BTW had the right idea but i feel like it didn't reach it full potential (although it has some great songs). Lastly i find Chromatica a step in the right direction, in the sense that it works as a reintroduction as pop artist, but obviously i expect a lot more for LG7.