4 minutes ago, Cheers said:

Going to Toronto this summer. Going to keep spreading the gospel of Mother McRae

As you should. I don't hear her music in the wild here as much as I should.

15 minutes ago, makeawish said:

a lot of the songs from think later suffer from this, they seem a bit too compact like they're trying to get them over and done with too quickly, things like hurt my feelings and run for the hills could stand an extra minute to them

i love the bass on uh oh tho, it's a great rhythm track, great chorus, i feel like the whole thing was very undersold, plus 10.35 ended up becoming a big hit over here not long after so it was left to rot

That's Ryan Tedder's influence. She had short songs before, but with think later it was almost like they had a hard cap for all her songs. Greedy being 2:11 is actually nuts. I've watched so many interviews of Ryan, and he's very intentional about making songs shorter and sticking to the current trends.

I'll never understand Uh Oh being released as a single, sent to radio when a lot of her singles then didn't go to radio, but not having a MV. Like why not go full out or just leave it as a promo single.

10:35 ending up as a hit in Europe was so random to me. It was meant to just be promo for the Atlantis Dubai, and it's quite a generic song. I'm sure Tate and her team were gagged when it outstreamed every song on her debut.

5 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

That's Ryan Tedder's influence. She had short songs before, but with think later it was almost like they had a hard cap for all her songs. Greedy being 2:11 is actually nuts. I've watched so many interviews of Ryan, and he's very intentional about making songs shorter and sticking to the current trends.

the thing that maddens me about greedy is that i'm sure he thinks he was proved right by it being so massive but it still sounds more wrong than anything else i mentioned, i'm at least grateful that the SCTW material ended up being more 2.45 - 3 mins which gives you a bit more to work with

7 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

10:35 ending up as a hit in Europe was so random to me. It was meant to just be promo for the Atlantis Dubai, and it's quite a generic song. I'm sure Tate and her team were gagged when it outstreamed every song on her debut.

it makes much more sense in a european context and esp in the uk, similar stuff a lot more anonymous than that is clogging up the chart week on week whereas that's a really good example of that kind of basic dance banger, tiësto is enough of a name to get it some coverage and tate's voice gives it personality, the album was garbage but its worth comparing 10.35 with hot in it for the tate vs charli head to head

7 minutes ago, makeawish said:

it makes much more sense in a european context and esp in the uk, similar stuff a lot more anonymous than that is clogging up the chart week on week whereas that's a really good example of that kind of basic dance banger, tiësto is enough of a name to get it some coverage and tate's voice gives it personality, the album was garbage but its worth comparing 10.35 with hot in it for the tate vs charli head to head

When that song effortlessly ended her debut, I was so scared her team was going to give up and just have her be a vocalist for DJ records. She has the kind of voice that would have worked for that. Also Ava Max having the biggest female song on that album is so ironic

14 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

When that song effortlessly ended her debut, I was so scared her team was going to give up and just have her be a vocalist for DJ records. She has the kind of voice that would have worked for that. Also Ava Max having the biggest female song on that album is so ironic

i feel like both 10.35 and the tune with regard (both of which i really like) were basically someone saying "she's flopping, get her on a dance track and save her career", it all could have ended very differently if greedy hadn't been a hit tho i suspect it's not something she likes doing that much

3 hours ago, Sharon Stone said:

As you should. I don't hear her music in the wild here as much as I should.

oh hell no they're in a crisis

2 hours ago, makeawish said:

i feel like both 10.35 and the tune with regard (both of which i really like) were basically someone saying "she's flopping, get her on a dance track and save her career", it all could have ended very differently if greedy hadn't been a hit tho i suspect it's not something she likes doing that much

Greedy saved her in so many ways, but also her ambition and relentlessness. The way she performed her ass off on every stage in 2023, she wanted it bad! It was so refreshing to see someone hungry for it again. I have so much respect for her and Sabrina. They made effort cool again.

44 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

Greedy saved her in so many ways, but also her ambition and relentlessness. The way she performed her ass off on every stage in 2023, she wanted it bad! It was so refreshing to see someone hungry for it again. I have so much respect for her and Sabrina. They made effort cool again.

the thing i remember thinking so much when greedy was out was that you could never count her out, like how many people have a viral hit like YBMF and you just never hear from them again? the first album could easily have sunk like a stone but even then it did just enough to buy her some time and she's what, 18 or 19 at this point, moved to LA on her own to make it, she really committed to the whole thing and threw everything into it.

sabrina has a similar thing, in that she was always doing just enough to hang around but never quite break thru, but in a way that worked in her favour because she had time to develop as an artist, she'd already done four albums before 'emails i can't send' which sounds like the work of someone who already knows what she's about, tate really had to bring it together on the fly much more

btw, you broke me first will hit 2 billion on spotify this week, still one of her best songs

4 minutes ago, makeawish said:

the thing i remember thinking so much when greedy was out was that you could never count her out, like how many people have a viral hit like YBMF and you just never hear from them again? the first album could easily have sunk like a stone but even then it did just enough to buy her some time and she's what, 18 or 19 at this point, moved to LA on her own to make it, she really committed to the whole thing and threw everything into it.

sabrina has a similar thing, in that she was always doing just enough to hang around but never quite break thru, but in a way that worked in her favour because she had time to develop as an artist, she'd already done four albums before 'emails i can't send' which sounds like the work of someone who already knows what she's about, tate really had to bring it together on the fly much more

I always knew she would rebound after YMBF even though she seemed to have stalled with her debut. Her being so young, with a loyal fanbase she had been building for years + being so talented, driven and ambitious, it was only a matter of the right song and promo. I think the difference between her and Gayle, Lauren Spencer Smith, Benee who had their viral TikTok hit and faded away, was that they never had a fanbase.

Tate and Sabrina were similar in that instance, except that Sabrina had a much larger following. She just needed the right songs/narrative/promo to propel her. Though I'll admit I never thought she could be this massive. I thought if she didn't click with a mega following, Disney, driver's licence drama it would never happen for her. Then a perfect storm of Era's tour, Nonsense Outros, Feather church scandal + autoplay and an undeniably catchy song with Espresso, and she became a mega star.

I still think that Tate has never had the kind of concerted multimedia push Sabrina had with espresso and in the SnS era in general and I wonder how big Tate could be if her team were able to fire on all cylinders.

On 5/9/2026 at 1:54 PM, Sharon Stone said:

As you should. I don't hear her music in the wild here as much as I should.

Strange thing i've noticed, I heard Just Keep Watching 3 times this week. At grocery stores, Dollar Tree and the liquor store. Which is weird because Canadian radio never played JKW here. I feel like it's been added to most playlists on the internet based radios/playlists retailers/hospitalities use.

Outside of hearing Tate's singles on FM radio in my car, where they were obviously huge, the only tracks I ever consistently heard in retail spaces like Walmart were 10:35, she's all i wanna be, and occasionally you broke me first. So I'm really hoping JKW and maybe something from SCTW ideally Revolving Door, start getting added to more retail and hospitality playlists.

That kind of exposure matters because big chains don't just tune into FM radio. They use curated, GP/adult‑friendly playlists from companies like Mood Media or PlayNetwork, and that's where Tate needs more presence to reach the broader casual‑listener market.

2 hours ago, Raphy said:

Strange thing i've noticed, I heard Just Keep Watching 3 times this week. At grocery stores, Dollar Tree and the liquor store. Which is weird because Canadian radio never played JKW here. I feel like it's been added to most playlists on the internet based radios/playlists retailers/hospitalities use.

Outside of hearing Tate's singles on FM radio in my car, where they were obviously huge, the only tracks I ever consistently heard in retail spaces like Walmart were 10:35, she's all i wanna be, and occasionally you broke me first. So I'm really hoping JKW and maybe something from SCTW ideally Revolving Door, start getting added to more retail and hospitality playlists.

That kind of exposure matters because big chains don't just tune into FM radio. They use curated, GP/adult‑friendly playlists from companies like Mood Media or PlayNetwork, and that's where Tate needs more presence to reach the broader casual‑listener market.

Interesting, I've been wondering whether Just Keep Watching would get a random resurgence since it has been surprisingly the most stable single. I find it odd that she isn't already on all the retail playlists. I hear Olivia, Sabrina, Chappell, Taylor significantly more than Tate. Whenever I'm in the UK, I hear Tate so much more in the wild than in Canada. Canada should support its only pop princess more.

5 hours ago, Sharon Stone said:

Whenever I'm in the UK, I hear Tate so much more in the wild than in Canada. Canada should support its only pop princess more.

you do hear her everywhere here, esp from greedy onwards but YBMF and 10.35 have long since become radio staples.

i think where you don't hear her is on what passes for adult contemporary radio, it's different than what you'd get on the north american continent (eg radio 2 played the hits from brat when they were out) but it's still been very difficult for tate to cross over when the really big acts like taylor, ariana and sabrina have done so, probably cos she's not quite at that level and also is more obviously a hot young popstar, those stations are a bit cosier and more british

This random upload of Get What I What has 1m views in a month and the account has only 300 subscribers. It seems like TM4 is moving in a different direction artistically, so I doubt the unreleased songs will ever see the light of day, but it seems like such a waste. A mixtape or EP with some of the best leaks would be a low stakes way to put them out. Just Keep Watching and Siren Sounds are proof that these songs could do some damage. I still think Favourite One could have been a greedy level smash.

2 hours ago, makeawish said:

you do hear her everywhere here, esp from greedy onwards but YBMF and 10.35 have long since become radio staples.

i think where you don't hear her is on what passes for adult contemporary radio, it's different than what you'd get on the north american continent (eg radio 2 played the hits from brat when they were out) but it's still been very difficult for tate to cross over when the really big acts like taylor, ariana and sabrina have done so, probably cos she's not quite at that level and also is more obviously a hot young popstar, those stations are a bit cosier and more british

She doesn't get a lot of play on adult contemporary radio in US as well. You broke me first is her highest peaking song on AC at 15. Even on Hot AC, her songs take forever to climb. The Morgan Wallen duet was one of her fastest-climbing songs there.

One of the downsides of her 2000s pop rebrand is that she's missing out having a multi format radio hit. That's what gives songs like Ordinary and Beautiful Things insane longevity. We've said this so many times, but a mid-tempo single would be ideal. But even for her dance pop songs, I'm not sure why none of them are ever sent to rhythmic. It's hard for songs to smash on only one format nowadays.

8 hours ago, Sharon Stone said:

But even for her dance pop songs, I'm not sure why none of them are ever sent to rhythmic.

this is where tate does get played here, the dance stations pick her up, but they aren't all that important, there are no chart points to be accumulated from radio in the uk so what exposure you get really comes from the big national broadcasters, of which only radio 1 and capital play her a lot

Tedder thinks Tate is heading for stadiums, and TM4 is phenomenal so far - on another level of writing and inspiration

i mean ryan is going to say that anyway lmao but i do wonder if there's a strategy to properly break the USA and push her up that extra tier. i think we're pretty clear that it's been a bit slapdash so far and one of the things that makes me wonder if it isn't going to happen is...the presence of ryan tedder? not in terms of quality, i think he's really underrated and great at what he does, but i do get the sense that he hasn't quite reckoned with the pop landscape as it is.

a lot of the problems tate has had are just baked in with her - too normie and with an identity not rooted enough in fairly meaningless but also annoyingly important pop cultural trivia that she's simply not prepared to give much of a sh*t about - and working with emil haynie i think is a really good way of bringing her into a more alt-ish identity as far as that's likely to go with her (i don't think it's credible to push that too hard at this stage).

but tedder himself has always been good for a hit or two with the big stars but they don't have him hanging around too much. i can see why she's grown to rely on him cos he was a really important collaborator who had the right idea at the right moment but i can never help but think, couldn't there be more material with ILYA? maybe not a full album with haynie but certainly more than the odd song?

the thing with ryan perhaps goes for grant boutin as well, who has been good at working on a retro sound with her but he doesn't necessarily have the kind of sparkle about him that gets people talking, i do want to see her move on a bit

2 hours ago, makeawish said:

i mean ryan is going to say that anyway lmao but i do wonder if there's a strategy to properly break the USA and push her up that extra tier. i think we're pretty clear that it's been a bit slapdash so far and one of the things that makes me wonder if it isn't going to happen is...the presence of ryan tedder? not in terms of quality, i think he's really underrated and great at what he does, but i do get the sense that he hasn't quite reckoned with the pop landscape as it is.

a lot of the problems tate has had are just baked in with her - too normie and with an identity not rooted enough in fairly meaningless but also annoyingly important pop cultural trivia that she's simply not prepared to give much of a sh*t about - and working with emil haynie i think is a really good way of bringing her into a more alt-ish identity as far as that's likely to go with her (i don't think it's credible to push that too hard at this stage).

but tedder himself has always been good for a hit or two with the big stars but they don't have him hanging around too much. i can see why she's grown to rely on him cos he was a really important collaborator who had the right idea at the right moment but i can never help but think, couldn't there be more material with ILYA? maybe not a full album with haynie but certainly more than the odd song?

the thing with ryan perhaps goes for grant boutin as well, who has been good at working on a retro sound with her but he doesn't necessarily have the kind of sparkle about him that gets people talking, i do want to see her move on a bit

I think she has genuinely broken the US with SCTW. Remember that *** for tat debuted in the top 3 with no music video or radio, as a surprise single. The scattered promotion of all the singles really skewed how big SCTW was in the US. If the radio strategy was more organised it would have had 3 hot 100 top 10s and 3 no1s on pop radio.

If anything what's holding her back from massive streaming debuts and more dominance as a global superstar is that she doesn't have Asia and Latam and she isn't doing mega numbers in the Anglosphere to make up for it.

I think her being normie is more relevant to her peak as a celebrity/public figure than her success. Considering Noah Kahan is smashing and selling out stadiums right now and his normie core.I know it's different for a pop girl but still.

As for collaborators Emile is certainly the more promising partner for her both in terms of sound and artistic cred, but the reality is that Tedder has produced the biggest songs on all her pop albums so far. Though I'm definitely rooting for her to work with more interesting collaborators, her songs with Ryan seem to connect more. I think Grant is interesting partner. He seemed more like the brains behind sports car, but he's not as visible so doesn't really bring any hype. Theoretically I like ILYA for her more than Ryan but he did IOIO which was disappointing to me, and guilty conscience which is nice but not necessary better than the Tedder offerings.

14 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

I think her being normie is more relevant to her peak as a celebrity/public figure than her success. Considering Noah Kahan is smashing and selling out stadiums right now and his normie core.I know it's different for a pop girl but still.

yeah i'm not sure it impacts her numbers as such but when there's such a distinct lack of sympathy for someone it just means that you have to tread extra carefully cos the wolves are always ready to attack. i had a very rare go on pop twitter recently and was surprised, not by them not liking her cos i expect that but more by how very deeply unpleasant the discourse was around her, you'd think she'd gone full nicki or something (this is ofc what the internet is like but post greedy they just thought she was an airhead)

10 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

As for collaborators Emile is certainly the more promising partner for her both in terms of sound and artistic cred, but the reality is that Tedder has produced the biggest songs on all her pop albums so far. Though I'm definitely rooting for her to work with more interesting collaborators, her songs with Ryan seem to connect more. I think Grant is interesting partner. He seemed more like the brains behind sports car, but he's not as visible so doesn't really bring any hype. Theoretically I like ILYA for her more than Ryan but he did IOIO which was disappointing to me, and guilty conscience which is nice but not necessary better than the Tedder offerings.

i don't necessarily disagree with any of this - one of the things about growing to love tate's music overall was learning that actually in practice i don't actually give a sh*t about the hipster quotient of her collaborators, they're all great at what they do and she's good enough to carry it all off anyway. and i do actually agree about ILYA and grant - i do really like guilty conscience but ngl IOIO is a bit sh*t - it's more the sense that, as i often think about comparisons to ariana's career, that there comes a time to put some things to one side and try and stretch yr legs a bit.

in practice so close to what is one of my favourite albums of the last few years and i played the others to death as well (i often feel mildly guilty about how much i really enjoy the first one), but there's a part of me that wants that level of credibility for her, partly because it's so much more difficult to carry this stuff while not really having any of the pop media ecosphere onside and also just because i'd like to shove it in some people's stupid mouths lmao.

Edited May 19May 19 by makeawish

5 minutes ago, makeawish said:

yeah i'm not sure it impacts her numbers as such but when there's such a distinct lack of sympathy for someone it just means that you have to tread extra carefully cos the wolves are always ready to attack. i had a very rare go on pop twitter recently and was surprised, not by them not liking her cos i expect that but more by how very deeply unpleasant the discourse was around her, you'd think she'd gone full nicki or something (this is ofc what the internet is like but post greedy they just thought she was an airhead)

Oh yeah she's absolutely torn to shreds on pop twitter just as much as Gracie & Sombr. Post greedy she was constantly getting dragged too. Every time there was a viral praise tweet, there would be 10-15 even more viral drags. The Morgan collab just gave people a reason to justify their irrational hate for her. But I think Stan twitter is irrelevant. As long as she doesn't loose the Gen Z masses on TikTok she's good. Shes never been well liked/respected in pop spaces since day 1 of her career, which must suck for her, but ultimately doesn't move the needle

21 minutes ago, makeawish said:

one of the things about growing to love tate's music overall was learning that actually in practice i don't actually give a sh*t about the hipster quotient of her collaborators, they're all great at what they do and she's good enough to carry it all off anyway.

Same here. I genuinely enjoy the music she's releasing. Although I will say that her current work has a fast food quality to it where I am obsessed and then the songs burn out quickly, and that's perhaps not sustainable. It's why she has to release so frequently. The fanbase (including me lol) is already itching for new music.

29 minutes ago, makeawish said:

but there's a part of me that wants that level of credibility for her, partly because it's so much more difficult to carry this stuff while not really having any of the pop media ecosphere onside and also just because i'd like to shove it in some people's stupid mouths lmao.

Definitely this too lol. Sometimes I think it must be jarring for her to have experienced having so much credibility and acclaim as a child dancer and to pivot into a music career that became successful but didn't have the acclaim. Even as a fan it's weird to hear the way she's spoken about now when she was adored and practically worshiped as a dancer. Unfortunately I think she's one of those artists that may never get the credibility. It seems like a lot of pop intellectuals have already made up their minds about her.

17 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

Although I will say that her current work has a fast food quality to it where I am obsessed and then the songs burn out quickly, and that's perhaps not sustainable

i know what you mean but also i think she's reached the top tier version of that now. think later is great but i always felt like the production tended twds a more generic quality at times whereas i really do never tire of SCTW, it really is bop after bop and she elevates the whole thing with general tateness both in lyrics and performance. one of the reasons i worry about her making another album in this lane is that it will be so hard to top, the man's best friend to her short n sweet i fear

all I'm going 2 say is GET READY for T8palooza. She's coming for super stardom. Everything will start aligning.

T8chella is also a huge possibility atm (not as headliner obviii)

4 minutes ago, Cheers said:

all I'm going 2 say is GET READY for T8palooza. She's coming for super stardom. Everything will start aligning.

T8chella is also a huge possibility atm (not as headliner obviii)

I know she's gonna serve at T8palooza She never wastes an opportunity.

I would love T8chella but am I delusional for thinking she should hold out until she can headline.? Considering Benson Boone was 3rd on the lineup in 2025, and Charli was 2nd, I think she's in this weird in between slot where she's bigger than the standard sub-headliner but isn't quite headline ready yet. At the same time it'll be nice to see her with a Coachella level production.

5 minutes ago, Sharon Stone said:

I know she's gonna serve at T8palooza She never wastes an opportunity.

I would love T8chella but am I delusional for thinking she should hold out until she can headline.? Considering Benson Boone was 3rd on the lineup in 2025, and Charli was 2nd, I think she's in this weird in between slot where she's bigger than the standard sub-headliner but isn't quite headline ready yet. At the same time it'll be nice to see her with a Coachella level production.

It would give her a huge boost. Look what happened with Chappel and Sabrina.