1 hour ago, TizTiz said:

But, unlike anytime in Fifth Harmony until their last and probably best album, she instead had more creative control than any new artist. Most new artist had to prove themselves, ppl were giving Normani so many chances because she already proved herself in the group and ppl, genuinely, wanted her to be bigger than life. 
 

Her having to make pop music that she doesn't believe- Girl, RCA was literally throwing her bone after bone, and that won't do that for artists that have proved themselves years ago. Making a pop song, that was actually a moderate hit and a stride in the right direction and complaining because 'I don't like pop music' is the exact inflated sense of entitlement she and Chloe continue to suffer from. 
 

Just because you were contracted to make a song you don't like doesn't mean to spend six years finding yourself and wasting money. Artist, new & old, experienced & untalented, will always be contracted to do what they don't want to do for the sake of the label having their own vision and making money. It isn't like she wasn't given complete creative control and benefited from it. If creating pop music is so egregious & God forsaken when contacted, one you agreed to, then leave & find a label to support your vision. 
 

Building upon "Wild Side" & "Fair" in a timely fashion, with a plan for release ready to go, would've helped, but Normani hasn't played the game since "Motivation" and has complained every since. Even throwing "Take My Time" in the mix, but reverberating your disdain is a head scratcher. 
 

Beyoncé played the game and look how her career completely excelled during "I Am. . . Sasha Fierce", Usher going in a commercial area with "Yeah!" while still capitalizing on the strict R&B market. Chris Brown has perfecting Pop, R&B, Dance & Hip Hop with "F.A.M.E.". Finding the correct balance of the pure at heart and the label's request is not anything new that she's being forced to do, and since she was hitting the mark with "Motivation" and not "Waves", she should've paid attention.  She would be further along in her career and further along in her growth. 
 

So what I mean by 'playing the game' is doing what the ppl who have been in the industry for years and turning that their profit in exchange for the creative freedom. 

Lets be honest they only gave her "creative control" because they moved onto Doja for Black Pop Star position. Look I would love for her to be a Pop star diva but she obviously doesn't want that she wants to be an r&b girlie. So us harping on the what ifs isn't gonna do us fans any good. And she's never gonna be the social media person fans want, because thanks to racist stans now she's extremely traumatized and thanks to assholes with a normani hate boner I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

I have high hopes for her being a mega star but I'm not getting hypertension over this. I'm gonna always support her because I'm a supporter but if Normani wants it she's gonna get it. I know we wanted her to be in a Beyonce or Rihanna lane but I would be happy if she gets a Kelly or Ciara career. They have great careers that work for them. So if Normani gets a successful career she's happy and content with that's a great thing to me. Sad things didn't work out the way we all hoped for but hey at this point it is what it is.

32 minutes ago, nocturnalbabe said:

Lets be honest they only gave her "creative control" because they moved onto Doja for Black Pop Star position. Look I would love for her to be a Pop star diva but she obviously doesn't want that she wants to be an r&b girlie. So us harping on the what ifs isn't gonna do us fans any good. And she's never gonna be the social media person fans want, because thanks to racist stans now she's extremely traumatized and thanks to assholes with a normani hate boner I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

I have high hopes for her being a mega star but I'm not getting hypertension over this. I'm gonna always support her because I'm a supporter but if Normani wants it she's gonna get it. I know we wanted her to be in a Beyonce or Rihanna lane but I would be happy if she gets a Kelly or Ciara career. They have great careers that work for them. So if Normani gets a successful career she's happy and content with that's a great thing to me. Sad things didn't work out the way we all hoped for but hey at this point it is what it is.

She has to hire someone that's gonna use her socials because without it it's not working. She stated that she wanted Beyonce type of career. 

5 minutes ago, nocturnalbabe said:

Lets be honest they only gave her "creative control" because they moved onto Doja for Black Pop Star position. Look I would love for her to be a Pop star diva but she obviously doesn't want that she wants to be an r&b girlie. So us harping on the what ifs isn't gonna do us fans any good. And she's never gonna be the social media person fans want, because thanks to racist stans now she's extremely traumatized and thanks to assholes with a normani hate boner I don't see that changing anytime soon.

 

I have high hopes for her being a mega star but I'm not getting hypertension over this. I'm gonna always support her because I'm a supporter but if Normani wants it she's gonna get it. I know we wanted her to be in a Beyonce or Rihanna lane but I would be happy if she gets a Kelly or Ciara career. They have great careers that work for them. So if Normani gets a successful career she's happy and content with that's a great thing to me. Sad things didn't work out the way we all hoped for but hey at this point it is what it is.

Few things:

 

• Let's stop quoting ppls comments as if a question or request is being posed, then relying on remarks, such as harping on topics or raising hypertension levels, to translate well. I find this mostly happens in this thread when said quote isn't replied to in a sigh of agreement! 
 

• The creative control on the video, live performance and aesthetics of "Motivation" was granted to Norman for agreeing to release the song at the labels request to move on a Pop direction. They thought the song would be a step into a more lucrative direction, while also catering to Contemporary R&B & Urban fan bases, as they were correct. 
 

• Their focus on Norman having success in Pop & R&B was not fettered by Doja Cat, in the slightest of any way. Doja Cat first Pop song/crossover hit was "Say So", released as an official single months after "Motivation" debut. If we'd compare, it would "Juicy", released the same day, only peaking higher on Rhythmic & R&B/Hip-Hop Airplay charts. 
 

• Being traumatized for racist comments on Social Media is completely normal. R&B and Pop girls are constantly berated with racist, sexist, political, angry comments- they've either turned them off or hired a SM manager. The first time she ran an ad as her promotional post, it was completely blurred and didn't even mention her name or album title. She hasn't had anyone post anything in 2 weeks, not even announcing "All Yours" being released as the official 3rd single, nor confirming her performance until it was cancelled. That's not on any racist comments, that's just plain ignorant❗️

 

• We all want her to do well, exceed beyond the road that's been laid out to hinder her, but if she doesn't care to correct her unprofessional ways, why should continue to make excuses for her, time after time? Even RCA have given up hope. But, let's not say she'll have a career like Kelly's. She hasn't even shown her strengths to be a contender with the new girls, that she is miles ahead of. 

52 minutes ago, TizTiz said:

Few things:
 

• She hasn't had anyone post anything in 2 weeks, not even announcing "All Yours" being released as the official 3rd single, nor confirming her performance until it was cancelled. That's not on any racist comments, that's just plain ignorant❗️

 

I just want to comment on this part, I am in total agreement with you that Normani should be more active on social media or get a social media manager because it's been years but first off Teyana Taylor also wasn't officially announced by BET nor did she announce it on her socials. Most of the performers didn't confirm their performances on their socials. I actually think Victoria was the only one who did. Second of all singles are usually classified as singles because they get videos and are officially sent to radio. Technically 1:59 is the first single, Candy Paint the "second single" hasn't even been sent to radio and the music video might never be released and the only reason we think All Yours is the third single is because it pops up separately as a single outside of the album. There's nothing to suggest that this will ever be a single outside of that so there's nothing for her to post in regards to that. I think I would be annoyed if she announced it was a single and then for her to treat it like this which is like every other album track 

1 hour ago, remming said:

 

I just want to comment on this part, I am in total agreement with you that Normani should be more active on social media or get a social media manager because it's been years but first off Teyana Taylor also wasn't officially announced by BET nor did she announce it on her socials. Most of the performers didn't confirm their performances on their socials. I actually think Victoria was the only one who did. Second of all singles are usually classified as singles because they get videos and are officially sent to radio. Technically 1:59 is the first single, Candy Paint the "second single" hasn't even been sent to radio and the music video might never be released and the only reason we think All Yours is the third single is because it pops up separately as a single outside of the album. There's nothing to suggest that this will ever be a single outside of that so there's nothing for her to post in regards to that. I think I would be annoyed if she announced it was a single and then for her to treat it like this which is like every other album track 

Singles are classified as to what purpose they'll serve: Lead Single, Radio single, Promotional single, Stand alone single. A lot of times, the label or artist sees no need to send to radio or receive a video, performs, and sometimes, not even mentioned besides be released to streaming and iTunes. 
 

A few weeks ago, I commented that it makes no sense when labels don't create particular single covers to differentiate the purpose and continuity of singles and how they pertain to the album and era. It's common now day when lead singles are released in close proximity to the albums release date, but is declining, slowly, since hard copy singles are on the rise. 
 

With RCA tacking "Wild Side" on the album, being the only single promoted with a music video, live performances, radio play, remixes and promotional run, it's the only acting single, let alone lead single. Of course, "1:59" is looked at as the official lead single, but the song was not promoted, besides being sent to US Urban Radio, reducing it to mere Radio single, by their actions. 
 

Besides random email alerts and dancing on TikTok, "Candy Paint" & "All Yours" are promotional singles. Though they are eligible to stream out her official YouTube page and sold digital only, they are not promoted in any kind of way. Promotional singles usually thrown out there to gather up some kind interest in what's going on. "All Yours" is in different playlists on Apple. "Candy Paint" was supposed to be a follow single well over a year ago, it's no wonder there's was no pouch for the song outside of her official social media pages and playlisting. 

We want MV's but will they even help the album? Candy paint challenge didn't took off, they paid views for the audio and it didn't help neither, the song is 2yo and we already heard it. Scrap that… 

You have take my time in your album and it's summer time, just make it a single and see what happens. Then later on, during fall focus more on All yours. 
 

The album got released 3 weeks ago and the era already seems dead. 

should candy paint even be the next single? It's old news at this point. I think they should pivot to All Yours and Big Boi and be done with the era. 

On 7/6/2024 at 12:23 AM, New Edition said:

I will say something I might get in trouble for. But I'm saying this as a Black person who's been noticing stuff as of late.

 

Black people and especially African Americans are the ones hating on her the most. Sometimes I wonder which demo hates on her more, African Americans or Camila stans. And I honestly don't know because they both seem to have the same vitriol for her. (YT gay Twinks are definitely in second place)

 

That's just a fact. Now as for why her own people seem to be so *ucking hard on her I have no idea. Maybe because they got in their heads that she was trying to replace Beyonce or something and they attacked. I remember as well as anyone should when people who hated Normani faked stanned Chloe (Beyonce's protege) just to try to get Normani out of here. Then they turned on Chloe for Halle when Chloe didn't deliver. Now they're bullying Halle. For the life of me, why is this the audience you want to cater to when they're leading the cyber bullying train?

 

But Normani has made it clear, she wants to make Black music for Black people in America because this is who she is, this is where she's from. When she was in 5H she was cut from her roots. Now she wants to make music for the audience and be accepted by them. That's why she's been very vocally against pop music and very vocally talking about how this direction and sound is her true self. But there are two problems with this.

 

1) Again, the African American audience are almost in line with Camila fans leading the charge in bullying her for whatever reason. When you go into some of these forums or watch the youtube videos it's like damn people are gleeful at the idea of her failure. I call this crabs in a bucket mentality.

 

2) She wants to appeal to Black people but isn't doing any promo directed at the audience, like others have said. Maybe the audience would actually warm up to her and quit treating her like a punching bag if she did do more promo they see as catered to them.

 

And I'll add another problem.

 

3) There's somewhat of a litmus test in terms of how 'Black' you are and whether or not you get accepted into these spaces as Black women. For a Black women to qualify as someone worth following you have to look and also ACT the part. I think especially for dark-skinned women, the expectation is that you'd be acting like a Sexxy Red always fighting with folks and getting on the blogs like JT. Normani is very quiet, keeps to herself, and a bit bougie, and there's nothing wrong with that, but she doesn't fit the 'type' that gets the audience talking, which is why some Black people may already not be inclined to accept her.

 

I actually think that the smartest thing for Normani to have done was to keep a more multicultural, multi-national approach with her music and audience targeting, but that's neither here nor there. It's completely understandable that she wants to appeal to the Not Like Us/Shade Room audience but if she wants to do that she needs to do it correctly and go all in with the right media outlets. She's fumbling completely right now.

I always thought that the Barbz were behind it all, though I can see the herd mentality trickling into the black community.

do we think she's performing at the vmas this year (do y'all think she will be healed by that time)? 

27 minutes ago, NormaniQueen said:

do we think she's performing at the vmas this year (do y'all think she will be healed by that time)? 

We don't really know the severity of her injury, but her saying "bad accident" makes me think she'll be down and out for a while. I'm not expecting her to perform at the VMAs. It's good to see her enjoying herself tho despite everything

24 minutes ago, 2ne1k said:

We don't really know the severity of her injury, but her saying "bad accident" makes me think she'll be down and out for a while. I'm not expecting her to perform at the VMAs. It's good to see her enjoying herself tho despite everything

right, i was just curious because i saw something say that she (and a bunch of other artist) was in negotiations to perform at the vmas this year. 

If she aiming for a VMA and plans to only rely on a performance that's gonna take place in 2 months and do nothing until then even tho her album is flopping, she def never gets it

Edited July 7, 20242 yr by Givemeyourcoat

I know you can go out while injured, but I wish Normani and her team were more conscious of the optics.

Edited July 7, 20242 yr by 40_L3VE

4 hours ago, Givemeyourcoat said:

If she aiming for a VMA and plans to only rely on a performance that's gonna take place in 2 months and do nothing until then even tho her album is flopping, she def never gets it

This wouldn't be an issue if she performed more. For someone who says they are visual artist it's rare to see her on stage for the last several years. 

Edited July 8, 20242 yr by lovely88

5 hours ago, NormaniQueen said:

do we think she's performing at the vmas this year (do y'all think she will be healed by that time)? 

She had to beg them to perform wild side, and that song was a moderate hit. So I think she wouldnt even be booked in the first place. 

Again. Can somebody show us the begging? When did she beg? Is this an alternate timeline I've dropped into?

 

1 hour ago, Luizzz said:

She had to beg them to perform wild side, and that song was a moderate hit. So I think she wouldnt even be booked in the first place. 

Now as much as a disappointment this release has been we dont need to reimagine the past. She never "begged" to perform she stated that they hadn't contacted her to perform. Thats it and that's all. The fans were the ones making noise and tagging/mentioning the MTV twitter in order to get them to book her. Plus, that still didn't work anyway as Swae Lee and Alicia Keys dropped out which opened up a spot for her. 

36 minutes ago, justifymythreads said:

Now as much as a disappointment this release has been we dont need to reimagine the past. She never "begged" to perform she stated that they hadn't contacted her to perform. Thats it and that's all. The fans were the ones making noise and tagging/mentioning the MTV twitter in order to get them to book her. Plus, that still didn't work anyway as Swae Lee and Alicia Keys dropped out which opened up a spot for her. 

Wasn't it Lorde dropping out that did?

how do i get mani to booked for the vmas so she can do a 1:59/all yours medley, QUICK

 

I am extremely curious as to what they have planned for the Candy paint video like why can't we have that while she recovers like do they have something special planned likeeeeeee we need something to Motivate  the fan base again 

 

12 hours ago, justifymythreads said:

Now as much as a disappointment this release has been we dont need to reimagine the past. She never "begged" to perform she stated that they hadn't contacted her to perform. Thats it and that's all. The fans were the ones making noise and tagging/mentioning the MTV twitter in order to get them to book her. Plus, that still didn't work anyway as Swae Lee and Alicia Keys dropped out which opened up a spot for her. 

She didn't "beg" per se, but I do vividly remember her not being booked very close to the show and the sentiment from Mani and/or her management (and possibly even Cardi) being "if y'all want her to perform at the VMAs. let MTV know" and the fans flooded their socials. 

 

There was definitely an air of "it's not fair, she should be performing".

 

As it panned out, someone dropped out of the lineup (Bebe Rexha or similar) and Mani magically then got the slot.

 

Possibly a coincidence, but I doubt it. 

 

Some could argue that it was all a plan to drum up buzz around her performance, but I can't see how the optics of her performance being "fan-demanded" helps her cause in any way. Especially when her lesser talented peers are booking the slots with ease. 

 

So, while she didn't "beg", it didn't feel like she had the clout nor leverage to make booking the show a given. 

 

And looking at how things are now, it's hard to see how she's in any better predicament now.

 

On 7/5/2024 at 6:58 AM, Cbreezy said:

I agree about Club Shay Shay, but she absolutely SHOULD be on The Breakfast Club and similar. 

 

This points to a bigger issue I've always had with her promo: she doesn't sufficiently cater to the BLACK audience. 

 

Yes, she came from a Pop group. But the entire "Normani is that b*tch" / and even the hate is very much Black Twitter-led. Yet, she/her team "appear" to have made it almost a point of duty to not do Black press like "that-that". Despite ironically making the Blackest music with everything post Motivation and espcially this album. 

 

She has never been on any of the following:

 

* The Breakfast Club

* Angie Martinez

* Hot 97 (she always opts to speak to Ebro on Apple Music)

* V103 

* Angela Yee

* The Shade Room  and Similar (There's a Tasteful Way to Engage)

* Essence: Magazine or Festival

 

Instead, she approaches her promo like a Pop act:

 

* VMAs

* Apple Music

* Elle, The Cut, etc. Basically a bunch of Becky magazines that don't speak to her core demo.

* Zach Sang

* Fashion Events

* Z100 (Motivation, Wild Side)

 

I actually have no issues with her Pop promo, I just think she's uniquely positioned to COMBINE both lanes for maximum benefit. Z100 will never care to talk to a Summer Walker for example but will wilfully chat with Mani because of the 5H connection. Same way, Black platforms would gladly take her on, especially as that's the music she's anchoring her sound in. 

 

In throwing her a bone, all of the above makes what happened with the BET Awards sad because it's a step in the right direction.

 

I've stanned and studied enough acts over time to know that when you have the Black audience on lock, they often ride with you til the wheels fall off. It's a very valuable audience to cultivate and actively water. 

 

In Lydia also managing Coco Jones, I hope they take notes from that playbook. Because Coco is so anchored in the Black cultural space that her name / brand awareness actually supersedes any commercial expectation around her music. The Black audience simply know and like...her. And because, IMO, we largely dictate the "cultural cool" and inform trends, that then leads to broader recognition (e.g. her Grammys). Normani could and should benefit from that.

All the other shows you mentioned I agree, however her going on the breakfast club with ill equipped "hosts" who never do any research and constantly try to bait guests for sound bites is the reason I don't want her anywhere near that platform. It could actually do more harm than good. Would love for her to cater to her r&b and Black audience more but she needs a different platform. I get what you're saying but honestly Apple Music does more for R&B and Hiphop than spotify. Also the magazines and fashion events actually do work well with her target demo tbh. She also did the Essence Festival back in 2018/2019, it's just that her issue is she had no product to promote until a month ago. What they are doing is currently leveraging the relationships she already has while trying to build new ones, hence the sadly canceled BET Awards performance. Trust and believe she wants to be in those spaces too but she isn't gonna be doing herself any favors by trying to cater to an audience like TSR and TBC when that audience always has something negative to say about her.

4 hours ago, Cbreezy said:

She didn't "beg" per se, but I do vividly remember her not being booked very close to the show and the sentiment from Mani and/or her management (and possibly even Cardi) being "if y'all want her to perform at the VMAs. let MTV know" and the fans flooded their socials. 

 

There was definitely an air of "it's not fair, she should be performing".

 

As it panned out, someone dropped out of the lineup (Bebe Rexha or similar) and Mani magically then got the slot.

 

Possibly a coincidence, but I doubt it. 

 

Some could argue that it was all a plan to drum up buzz around her performance, but I can't see how the optics of her performance being "fan-demanded" helps her cause in any way. Especially when her lesser talented peers are booking the slots with ease. 

 

So, while she didn't "beg", it didn't feel like she had the clout nor leverage to make booking the show a given. 

 

And looking at how things are now, it's hard to see how she's in any better predicament now.

 

Honestly regarding that situation, I think that was a Brandon **** up. He clearly was trying to leverage Normani's goodwill and relationships to benefit anitta as well, hence her also being added as well. That man ****** up a lot of things if we're being honest, becaus why was she in rehearsals so much? it's clear negotiations were happening and they fell through. the fan demand, plus the dropout helped her get that spot.

15 minutes ago, AntiHarmony said:

All the other shows you mentioned I agree, however her going on the breakfast club with ill equipped "hosts" who never do any research and constantly try to bait guests for sound bites is the reason I don't want her anywhere near that platform. It could actually do more harm than good. Would love for her to cater to her r&b and Black audience more but she needs a different platform. I get what you're saying but honestly Apple Music does more for R&B and Hiphop than spotify. Also the magazines and fashion events actually do work well with her target demo tbh. She also did the Essence Festival back in 2018/2019, it's just that her issue is she had no product to promote until a month ago. What they are doing is currently leveraging the relationships she already has while trying to build new ones, hence the sadly canceled BET Awards performance. Trust and believe she wants to be in those spaces too but she isn't gonna be doing herself any favors by trying to cater to an audience like TSR and TBC when that audience always has something negative to say about her.

I'm with you and I guess to a degree we're - by and large - wanting the same thing for her: to combine a presence in both lanes. 

 

But I'd much rather she makes a concerted effort at turning the tide of even those trickier platforms in the Black space than avoiding them altogether. If she doesn't want to go on TBC, then go on Angela Yee (who is always well researched and an altogether more warm and relatable vibe for female acts).

 

With Apple Music, I get it and they probably offer all sorts of incentives for acts working with them (playlisting, social posts, exposure on the platform). But I have literally seen promo-hungry acts talk to Ebro one week on Apple and literally talk to him again on his Hot 97 show with his co-hosts. Normani should be doing the same. I don't know a soul who actually listens to Apple's radio shows, but I know a bunch of people who actively listen to Hot 97 and Power 105.1 for their R&B/Hip-Hop fix.

 

And again with TSR, I get it. No one is saying she ought to be in the comments popping off. But trust me, it's not out of the ordinary for PR and marketing teams to seed content...something, anything with those kind of platforms. Video previews, pictures of her "leaving the studio" etc. Strike smart strategic partnerships with key Black media. It's beneficial to her profile and the audience she is building ...especially releasing the sound of music she releases.

 

I've seen it over and over with the CIara's, Kelly Rowland's and co. They consistently released R&B music only to pander to mainstream press when it comes to promo (Elle, Vogue, Pop sites and co) either to avoid sharks at Black media or to assert some kind of premium. The irony being that none of the target audience at those Becky publications actually give a damn about whatever new slow jam bedroom bop they just dropped. Thus, their releases would never move the needle. Obviously there were other factors at play, but just doing an analysis of their own campaigns, it was clear as day why they struggled to build base or community. 

 

My hope with Normani's entire career was to take the best of her idols and course-correct the mistakes they made too. 

 

Maybe it's the era I come from (being raised on the MJ and an early Bey), I just don't believe in coddling artists. 

 

This is literally a DREAM job that so many girls would do anything for a shot at. So, I defer to my original point of acts like Mani not being in a position to "cherry-pick" what promo they do. At least not to this extent. Because at the moment, the way she is moving is very counterproductive. 

 

Trust and believe Tyla's team probably didn't want her on TBC for the exact reasons of what happened when there, but guess what? She did it. She actually garnered a bunch of headlines (for better or worse), got praise for how she generally handled it (almost like a "right of passage") and now stands to return there for a make-good interview that everyone will tune into whenever it happens.

 

Mani attempting to curate a premium press run at such an elementary and success-starved stage of her career objectively does not make any sense on her part.

 

honestly, all i need is the candy paint music video and i'll be fine. i'm not going to be putting any pressure on her in terms of promoting or performing, as she is still healing from the bet rehearsals injury. i think the candy paint video is going to garner the same (if not better) positive attention/reactions as the motivation video (i just know it's going to eat). does anyone know who shot the video? 

Edited July 8, 20242 yr by NormaniQueen