Cbreezy Posted May 7 Posted May 7 2 minutes ago, period sis said: The physical album tracklist is highkey what the album should've been. Just add Linda Martell Interlude into YA YA and it's golden. The short, album "nothing" songs like Flamenco, My Rose, and Desert Eagle should've been cut or tacked as bonus tracks. As art as those songs are, they do nothing but lengthen up the album and push regular people away. I hear that. One day (today?) it'd be cool to have a transparent convo in this Base about how (IMO) the extra long tracklist for CC was Bey's way of acclimating to the streaming-era cheat-code of: "longer albums = more streams = bigger sales = longer longevity" It's not foolproof and some acts have flopped or dropped like a rock with lengthy albums (Usher's latest and those Future/Metro Boomin albums), but generally it works. Especially for acts whose music people are checking for anyway (like Bey). She dropped an album with a preceding hit and drummed up a ton of buzz/press/dialog about a genre shift. So, even on the merit of curiosity listens alone, she stands to open big and sustain on the charts longer with a long album than she would with a 10 track release. I can't be convinced that the perfectionist in Bey saw some of those short "nothing" songs as essential to the story she was telling with CC. IMO, it was her "premium" and "artsy" way of doing exactly what we critique Chris Brown for and successfully pulling off what Taylor also pulled off (but besting her at it, as Bey's album earned universal acclaim whereas TS' own fans dragged hers). And btw, I'm not mad at any of this at all. I'm actually here for the shenanigans. I like that Bey seems to "get it" and IMO it's a way of her moving with the times beyond just the music itself. Spoiler If we're really allowed to "go there" and obviously this is a safe space to do so, I think a big part of her huge first week sales were due to the length of the album. More tracks = more streams. It was very advantageous, especially given the faux pas with the short pre-order frame for the physicals. Not to mention to f**k ups with the physicals too. Granted I too revelled in the big opening, there was so many "see! don't ever doubt Bey!" posts on here that IMO didn't factor the strategic moves made into the equation. The true test would have been (and will, perhaps, be with Act II) if she dropped a short 10-track album. In a way, it doesn't matter much so long as Bey continues to play the game. Be that another super long album with Act III or big features for the added streams. Hell, maybe both.
Pepo Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Levi's Jeans is the only skip of the album imo. I loathe that guy's voice. 1
BnPac Posted May 7 Posted May 7 (edited) 3 hours ago, kimberly said: from an academic perspective, Lemonade and Cowboy Carter are the superior albums. I do agree on Lemonade but why do you think so for CC? Strictly academically speaking, CC has songs like 2MW, Just for fun (which are lower than any lows on Ren) and is bloated by some of those interludes and short songs. Not to mention the transitions on some songs needed better work, she is still belting in Ya Ya when Oh Louisiana starts. It has very brilliant moments : American Requiem is a slap, Daughter, the run from 2H2H to Sweet but as a cohesive product, it falls short to Ren and imo it's not just because Ren is fun music. Renaissance to me is crisp, is neat, flawless from beginning to end and the transitions between the songs are seamless. CC is a great album but strictly academically speaking, I feel like it does not compare to the musical rigorousness and tightness that is Renaissance. The latter is also way more experimental, songs like Alien Superstar, Cozy, Pure/Honey and American Has A Problem among others put her musical genius in full display. Edited May 7 by BnPac 2
Rafael Posted May 7 Posted May 7 I love CC sooo much but I already reduced it to 14 tracks + 1 interlude (Oh Lousiana... so it won't f*ck up Ya Ya) on my playlist. It took me months to be able to cut a Renaissance song from my playlist. 2
cloudbusting Posted May 7 Posted May 7 1 minute ago, Pepo said: Levi's Jeans is the only skip of the album imo. I loathe that guy's voice. one day we Posty's Rags haters WILL win the war, just know that 1
BnPac Posted May 7 Posted May 7 15 minutes ago, Pepo said: I can survive the no visuals thing, but choosing not to perform her music is where I draw the line... Tbh that's where I am. I do find videos and her visual components a big part of her legacy and I think she's missing on building iconic moments with it and strengthening her music but if they are out of the pictures, she could at least give us what made most of us into stans in the first place : one or 2 performances per era wouldn't kill her tbh. 1
Beyoncei Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Cowboy Carter is an incredible Beyoncé album. It's nothing short of a masterpiece and my personal favourite album by her. There was so much love for the album initially (when it was getting top reviews from critics and breaking chart records). Now all of a sudden, it's the quality of the album or it's too long? The album is top tier. The problem is Beyoncé is too elusive and the general public don't hear enough about her. The reason for the initial success of a Beyoncé album is the fact she is making headlines for releasing a "new album", coupled with social media buzz of its singles etc. She is trending more or whatever. Once the hype goes down, the people are diverted back to what's popular, Kim K's new dog, hot new male pop singers lovely new song, bla bla bla. Look at Ariana, always in the news, MET gala, announcing 6 singles will be released from her new album… The buzz is there. Beyonce is far too elusive with her music, it's always a surprise and hardly ever a conventional rollout. Us as die hard Beyoncé fans are also human, and some navigate towards other popular or underground artist we have started to stan during the absence of new music from our ultimate fave. She basically just needs to get off her arse! 2
Burn Posted May 7 Posted May 7 8 minutes ago, Beyoncei said: The problem is Beyoncé is too elusive dd; it's so funny you should say this because on my way home from work earlier I randomly thought that Beyoncé is more of an Elusive Chanteuse than Mariah 1
Cbreezy Posted May 7 Posted May 7 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Pepo said: I can survive the no visuals thing, but choosing not to perform her music is where I draw the line... As someone who gravitated to Bey **because** of her performance abilities as far back as DC, it is definitely hard processing that she essentially doesn't perform outside of touring nowadays. At the same time, in knowing that Bey can't cheat time nor Mother Nature (in that her most agile performing days *may* be behind her), I'm actually more surprised that she's not using this stage of her career to ramp up her edited/curated output. A music video and pre-recorded content will always grant her the ability to put her very best foot forward and can benefit from all the cuts, edits, and takes needed to ensure she shows up as "Beyonce" to the masses. Something not available with truly live performances. One thing I always keep front and center is that the likes of Netflix and YouTube (dwindling consumption and all) are way more mass-watched than any "live performance" ever will be. So, I'd love to see Bey harness that as she strives to uphold the image of performance perfection she has built around herself. Edited May 7 by Cbreezy 1
Slamless Posted May 7 Posted May 7 i've been gone from this base because I wasn't ready for any lashings but now that its been over a month, I really did not like cowboy carter and am a little shocked at how little I cared for it for a Beyonce album wtf Riverdance is that song tho 2
FLAallday Posted May 7 Posted May 7 The fact that Tina has done more promo than Bey might as well call it Cowboy Celestine 1
Beyoncei Posted May 7 Posted May 7 4 minutes ago, Slamless said: i've been gone from this base because I wasn't ready for any lashings but now that its been over a month, I really did not like cowboy carter and am a little shocked at how little I cared for it for a Beyonce album wtf Riverdance is that song tho Girl now you know that's not true. You just need Bodyguard to become the summer hit of 2024, like it deserves and you'll fall in love again. X
cloudbusting Posted May 7 Posted May 7 3 minutes ago, FLAallday said: The fact that Tina has done more promo than Bey might as well call it Cowboy Celestine the way the first half had me thinking Turner for some reason might as well be since the era is about as alive as she is 3
kimberly Posted May 7 Posted May 7 21 minutes ago, BnPac said: I do agree on Lemonade but why do you think so for CC? Strictly academically speaking, CC has songs like 2MW, Just for fun (which are lower than any lows on Ren) and is bloated by some of those interludes and short songs. Not to mention the transitions on some songs needed better work, she is still belting in Ya Ya when Oh Louisiana starts. It has very brilliant moments : American Requiem is a slap, Daughter, the run from 2H2H to Sweet but as a cohesive product, it falls short to Ren and imo it's not just because Ren is fun music. Renaissance to me is crisp, is neat, flawless from beginning to end and the transitions between the songs are seamless. CC is a great album but strictly academically speaking, I feel like it does not compare to the musical rigorousness and tightness that is Renaissance. The latter is also way more experimental, songs like Alien Superstar, Cozy, Pure/Honey and American Has A Problem among others put her musical genius in full display. the same arguments you made for RENAISSANCE apply to Self-Titled, as well. what I mean by "academically" is the context with which you engage with the album, the references, the history of it all. while RENAISSANCE does have some of that, it's hidden in the samples and songwriting credits for the most part. with Lemonade and Cowboy Carter, you're getting it spoon-fed to you. and Cowboy Carter of course has the "reclaiming country" angle, which is a much more popular genre than house music. and, let me make it clear, ANYTHING Bey puts out is "academically" way, way ahead of anyone else in pop music. she is a true student of music and historian. so RENAISSANCE and Self-Titled are, too. but Lemonade and Cowboy Carter have more to dissect, marginally. 3
Weld_E Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Can someone explain the history/lore behind the twins that perform with Bey? How did they come to be and why did she decide to have them in all her tours since?
ScorpiosGroove Posted May 7 Posted May 7 to me ya ya feels like what live beyoncé feels like. like it's a beyoncé performance in song form. the same can be said about daughter's operatic moment, it's as if she took a coachella i care moment and put it in an album (yeah she featured operatic vocals before but they've always been reduced to backing vocals, never been at the forefront of an album track) that's why i love both immensely 2
ScorpiosGroove Posted May 7 Posted May 7 7 minutes ago, Weld_E said: Can someone explain the history/lore behind the twins that perform with Bey? How did they come to be and why did she decide to have them in all her tours since? she took them under her wing during 4 and kept them ever since nowadays she keeps them around bc they're are basically jobless without her and she has a charitable heart (except for us )
BnPac Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Spoiler I think some of you do not pay enough attention to what other fans say or do not read it. Which is OK but there is also no reason to rewrite history. Everyone finding the album too long now did when it was released. As a matter of fact, that was my first post in the album's thread, I also said I found the interludes cumbersome but maybe it was my listening on YTB. True Spotify made it better but still the sentiment remains. @AxelFox didn't fully like the album and has been pretty vocal about it. @Mitsouko tried very hard to like it and found some songs to vibe to, I even checked up on him to see if there was some songs about it that he managed to like. @Machete straight up hated it but that's not surprising. Just like pretending those of us who liked the album only did it because it was new, pretending all the fanbase was on board because of critics and charts is stupid since the most fights breaking in the critics' thread and the album's thread were about people not liking it being praised or liked more than Renaissance precisely because they felt it lacking in some aspect. And those fans not being too vocal out of respect for people enjoying first week do not make them fake. 4 minutes ago, Weld_E said: Can someone explain the history/lore behind the twins that perform with Bey? How did they come to be and why did she decide to have them in all her tours since? They were a somewhat popular dancing duo in France on the underground scene so I guess she saw one of their videos and decided to hire them. She seems however considerably close to them, they have the utmost respect for her and I remember one saying she helped with their expenses or administrative issues (I don't remember which), I think they naturally formed a bond and that's why she has them on all her tours. 1
Cbreezy Posted May 7 Posted May 7 Not quite at the doom and gloom stage that some of y'all are at, simply because I like to be experience-led. We all basically experienced this very stage in the window between the Rennie album release and the RWT announcement. The hot-takes were equally bad if not worse. From "she's lazy" to "she's retired" to "it's all over". So, IMO, it's kinda futile doing the same with CC when we know there's almost certainly a "something" coming. The main issue, for me, is the not knowing and of course this gap of nothingness. With summer rapidly approaching, it's becoming clear that a stadium tour this year is next to impossible on her usual stomping ground (US, Europe). Making a late 2024 start in Oceana, Asia, LATAM most plausible. Or some kind of US residency most feasible. The visuals still not dropping also is annoying given that it's the one promotional pillar that could tide us over ahead of whatever her live plans are.
ShouldersSideways Posted May 7 Posted May 7 With this being act ii you know she's gonna have them front and center glitching out to random songs like American Requieum 6
Blue Rose Posted May 7 Posted May 7 3 minutes ago, ScorpiosGroove said: she took them under her wing during 4 and kept them ever since nowadays she keeps them around bc they're are basically jobless without her and she has a charitable heart (except for us ) I feel like she brought them back for the Renaissance tour because she was having male dancers and they were the perfect liaison between her and the new guys. The Twins were the dance captains for the boys. However they brought a lot to the show so im happy she did. And i see them teach classes, that's all they can do. Half of the Renaissance dancers are currently doing the same
Triton Posted May 7 Posted May 7 1 hour ago, Burn said: I'd rather have another #1 single than visuals just something about seeing Bey on top is so pleasing to me Well neither are happening anytime soon so….. 1 3
Recommended Posts