canvey916

I mean, even if Miriame Kaba doesn't explicitly identify as a socialist, her work is clearly descended from Angela Davis and Ruth Wilson Gilmore's (and she's worked with both, IIRC). If you're actually committed to a movement of working-class ascendancy - one that includes the whole multiracial working class - then it shouldn't need to be explained why it's a problem for millions of those working-class people to live under a hyper-militarized police state that kills and dispossesses them with impunity. But even if some leftist read Kaba and still needed those connections spelled out for them, what's stopping them from turning to the wealth of overtly-socialist abolitionist work that's been done by Davis, Gilmore, et al.? AOC and Zohran have the same internet the rest of us do. If they wanted to understand abolition-as-socialism, they would. But they don't, because when push comes to shove, they're perfectly fine sacrificing a large swathe of the working class for their own careerist objectives. There's really no other explanation for something like this: (As the follow-up tweet notes, they're not actually Flock-branded, but rather the NYPD's own in-house version. Which is...just as bad.)

Sorry, what?? Probably the most well-known and cited abolitionist work is Angela Davis's "Are Prisons Obsolete?" Followed by George Jackson's "Soledad Brother" and, more recently, Ruth Wilson Gilmore's "Golden Gulags." Davis, Jackson, Gilmore: all Black, all Marxists. Who exactly are these non-socialist Black abolitionists you're talking about?? And let's not pretend that actual, card-carrying Marxism is some kind of litmus test for democratic "socialists" today. AOC, Bernie, and Zohran aren't out here talking about seizing the means of production and nationalizing the Fortune 500. FDR, who's constantly invoked as the soc-dems' north star, was hardly some revolutionary vanguard - and DSA routinely rallies around politicians who don't even identify as DSA, let alone actual Marxists or socialists. So it's a little funny to hear anyone reject abolitionism for having "insufficiently-Marxist" origins.

Police departments having complete impunity to rob, assault, and kill poor Americans - including, recently, a Black one-year-old child - is just "stupid culture war bullcrap"? Fascinating...

Soc-dems get a little bit of momentum and immediately pivot to bootlicking and Sister Souljah moments. That's really all this "woke 1.0" discourse is: a pathetic and cowardly retreat from principled and necessary policies, throwing vulnerable communities under the bus to placate the wealthy and privileged. Zohran, AOC, Chi, and a thousand Ryan Grim-types are speaking about policing and "wokeness" the same way James f***ing Carville does. Milquetoast-liberal wolves in sheep's clothing.

Meanwhile, in the Israeli "left"...

Of course that's where their "concern" lies…

Definitely a bad-faith invitation. If I'm Hasan I'm printing out this tweet and reading it aloud the moment I'm introduced:

I have no idea what Cori Bush's campaign coffers are looking like right now, but if she has the money I need her to come out hard against Bell and his little Klan Kween Kampaign manager. A full ad blitz of "all skinfolk ain't kinfolk" teas.

See, if you had just said this without all the "Dem plantation" **** we wouldn't be having this conversation. The Black establishment absolutely deserves contempt, and it should be combatted without needlessly insulting or alienating regular Black people who do not have the power, influence, or wealth that Clyburn and co. have. (Particularly when that community is more receptive to progressive policies than any other demographic in the country.) Some of us can hold more than one thought in our heads at the same time! Some of us can despise the post-Reagan CBC's rightwing heel-turn and understand that there are still plenty of older Black people in this country who were born on literal plantations, to disenfranchised and dispossessed sharecroppers; people who have been hearing that "Dem plantation" line for decades from Republican white supremacists who were pissed about the Civil/Voting Rights Acts and devoted (somewhat successfully) to undoing it; and people who will (understandably, to anyone with an ounce of empathy) recoil when they hear that same language today. Crockett was rightfully scorched for implying Latinos were slaves, so why should it be acceptable to talk that way about millions of everyday Black citizens? All that accomplishes is giving more fodder for the Clyburns of the world to hide behind. But the fact that you've taken this pretty straightforward opinion and twisted it into some grand conspiracy that only you can "clock," where I'm some secret Clyburn fanboy trying to rope the Civics board of ATRL into ~idpol~? And that you've gleaned all this from a handful of comments in my 160-odd posts here? Touch some grass, girl.

But you didn't say that, did you? You trotted out the age-old "Dem plantation" trope, used by Republicans to smear the Black community at large. These conversations are not just limited to Black public figures, they're frequently extended to make declarative generalizations about "Black voters." Happens pretty regularly on the main elections thread… Uh, I never claimed that DSA leftists only go after Black liberals. (I assume you meant liberals.) I specified, pretty damn clearly, that the problem was the intentionally inflammatory Dirtbag Left rhetoric, not the substance of the discussion itself. Are you capable of understanding the difference? The only "imaginary scenarios" here are the ones you've invented by poor reading skills and this performative, faux-militant act you put on. I'm sure you think you're the next George Jackson, but really it's giving Joseph McCarthy: "Are you now or have you ever been an IDPOLer?"

Wtf lol. I've never had a kind word to say about either of them: I think they're both corporate shills, Zionists, and politically worthless to my community. And I've never said anything to the contrary. If you've convinced yourself that I'm some kind of undercover KHive, then I guess I can only wish you luck in combatting the voices in your head. Long overdue? Girl, that conversation is had every day. Every. Single. Day. It's pretty much the obsession of the white online left. Black leftists, meanwhile, are trying to have real-life conversations with our parents, grandparents, and neighbors, in our own f**king communities. How exactly are those efforts helped by other leftists adopting the lexicon of an alt-right shock-jock? Do you think those Black leftist women you mentioned won their elections by knocking on doors and shouting, "hey you woke DEI idpol-ing KHiver, I see you've got a centrist Dem's sign on your porch, have you considered not being a dumb slave?" Being part of the diaspora doesn't preclude you from being anti-Black (and more specifically, bigoted towards the ethnic group of Black Americans). Citing your racial identity is exactly the kind of identity reductionism that you claim to hate...and, ironically, the very sort of thing that sell-outs like Clyburn do. Anyway, back to my super-secret underground KHive knitting circle, where we make macramés of Kamala and whisper "#RepresentationMatters" as a closing prayer. We'll have to find a new meeting space now that the Government Hooker has exposed us!

"Why won't these stupid SLAVES vote for us?!" It's always f**k Clyburn in my house, but the same goes for those "leftists" who think it's cute to mimic the rhetoric of 4chan alt-rightists. Y'all are getting way too comfortable; at the rate you're going, by mid-2027 you'll be accusing Black folks of "chimping out." I can't say I've ever seen this kind of inflammatory rhetoric used by the DSA crowd against latino, working-class white, or arab communities, despite their collective voting patterns being objectively more right-wing. Overseers were almost exclusively white, by the way. You might have meant "drivers," but they were working in the same fields as the enslaved people they "drove," so that comparison doesn't hold much for Clyburn either.

IShowSpeed's "World Cup content is based on hating Argentina"?? Argentina fans were calling him slurs and making monkey gestures on his livestream, but he is the one hating? These DARVO tactics are so shameless.

Firstly, players are always going to get more attention than fans. Secondly, if the Paraguay song was ignored, it was probably because all the attention was on that Paraguayan senator who said those disgusting things about Mbappe. She got dragged for filth all around the world, deservedly, as did the many Paraguayans who came to her defense on social media. (It should be noted: the Paraguayan government condemned her remarks, with both a presidential statement and a formal parliamentary motion, while Argentina's government adamantly defended the national team during its scandal 4 years ago.) Anyway, here's some Afro-Argentines speaking about their experiences with both interpersonal and systemic racism in Argentina: https://apnews.com/article/immigration-entertainment-discrimination-migration-race-and-ethnicity-0d18920b22e0eab19f28202c591ef0ea Some notable passages/quotes: On the census issues: "The state doesn't have the slightest idea of the [number of Afro-Argentines] because...the state is not taking it seriously." On the damage caused by the belief (held by multiple Argentinian presidents in the last quarter-century) that Afro-Argentines don't exist: "[Activist] Maria Magdalena Lamadrid...a fifth-generation Afro-Argentine, was kept from leaving the country by a customs officer who insisted there are no Black Argentines and asserted her passport was fake." On widespread casual racism: 1. "Angeles Martinelli, a white Argentine, married a Senegalese immigrant and soon faced racism head-on. She recalled people asking her, 'What's a beautiful woman doing with a monkey?'" 2. "Bravo said many upper-class Argentines remain ignorant about the problem of race...'People saying we are not racist because we do not have Black people. Well, what's the difference between the Ku Klux Klan and you?'" On violent hate-crimes: "But [Ntaka] said he became more vocal after he was beaten up by skinheads in Argentina. It wasn't so much the beating that affected him as the admonition to: 'Go back to your country.' He couldn't get it out of his head. 'But this is my country,' he told himself. 'I am Argentine.'"

Much of the recent discourse about Argentina's racism has come up because of widely-viewed incidents where Argentinians say/do racist s**t to non-Argentinian Black people. Your football team sang a horrifically racist chant about Black Frenchman. Your fans came to the United States for the World Cup and made monkey noises at Black American YouTubers. After yesterday's match the memes from Argentina fans about Afro-Spaniards - Nico Williams, Yamine Lamal, and Lamal's toddler brother - were HEINOUS. Your president before Millei said despicable things about Brazil's Afro populace. I could go on...but the idea that someone can be obscenely racist to Black people in other countries, then act like victims when those Black people call that racism what it is? Insanity. Also insanity? Claiming that racism is only a part of North American culture. "If it doesn't come from the Champagne region Yanks it's not champagne racism, just sparkling wine slurs." Please read a book. No one is using your racism as a distraction. We (Black people in America) talk about American racism all the time. All. The. Time. Nowhere did Samuel L. Jackson, or any of the Black people agreeing with him, say or imply that Argentina's racism somehow nullifies America's problems. Ironically, that's exactly what many in this thread and elsewhere are doing: throwing out whataboutisms by the dozen and acting like the prevalence of anti-Blackness elsewhere somehow absolves your own. Deflections, deflections, and more deflections.

The idea that Samuel L. Jackson - a Black man raised in Jim Crow-era Tennessee, a Black Power political activist while studying at a Morehouse, and a literal usher at Martin Luther King's funeral - isn't qualified to speak out about anti-Blackness simply because he's American…is utter absurdity. And no one, aside from Native Americans, has criticized, condemned, challenged, and fought against (literally) U.S. racism as much as Black Americans. From Nat Turner to Malcolm X to Ferguson. So Argentines pointing out America's past and present racism isn't really a "gotcha." We know damn well what this country is: that's why yours feels so familiar.

I mean, it was only two years ago that the national football team filmed themselves singing a disgustingly racist chant about Black French players... https://www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jul/16/wesley-fofana-french-fa-appalled-argentina-team-celebrations-copa-america And the responses from Argentina's political establishment and football association were astonishingly gross: https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5647005/2024/07/20/fallout-from-argentina-chant/?eafs_enabled=false Obviously the internet isn't real life, but every time I've seen this scandal brought up online (or any of the countless racist incidents involving fans) the response from Argentinians is...not good.

I'm still gonna hate him for voting to censure Rashida Tlaib, but it's good that the anti-AIPAC energy is strong enough to force this pivot.

Plenty of Black leftists tried to sound the alarm about Fetterman given his attempted lynching, and for that we were called all your favorite buzzwords: IDPOL, woke, etc. Those same Black leftists sounded the alarm about Platner once his Reddit posts came to light, as did many Arab and Muslim leftists in light of his Blackwater/military history, and the same Fetterman defenses were trotted out: At this point, if David Duke endorsed M4A some white "progressives" would embrace him, and immediately start shouting down any non-white person, leftist or otherwise, who reacted with the appropriate revulsion.