CoolNebraskaGuy Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 minute ago, Raspberries said: Joanne (2016): 3.5M (+430k daily on Spotify) Smile (2020): 2.8M (+540k daily on Spotify) They are very similar-sized considering Joanne had a nearly 4 year head start Recurrent stream wise they're both irrelevant, but yeah NRO / HIH have more replay value than MR. Pretty sure Joanne sold more albums in the UK than Smile did around the world, though. Smile was a colossal flop, Joanne at least scanned platinum in the US and had a top 10 song 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumbsparce Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 That night she performed some old Disney song at the Oscars. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjorn Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 We ALL know when. After Born This Way era and when ARTPOP began. The decline in quality was astonishing 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvadaKedavra Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 (edited) Gaga needed a rest after Paparazzi. She was too overworked and gettin lost in the Game of Fame. She went from quirky sweet visionary to Egocentric diva losing the plot and that added to her downfall. Even if she was iconic in the fame monster era. She needed a rest. She needed a resto to plan things better It was too much. Too fast. Then after the proper rest from Debut..... treat The Fame Monster as a PROPER ERA. Not an EP. a Proper spooky gothic album with promo. Good ideas. Maybe a mixture of The Fame Monster and the best songs from BTW like bloody mary Something better executed Edited March 13 by AvadaKedavra 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prézli Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 When she sold Born This Way for one dollar. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooke Candy Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 The ARTPOP ERA crashing was the end of Lady Gaga 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bicassie Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 After artpop it died Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domination Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 Some of y’all need to learn what it means to “lose your edge”. It does not mean “when did Lady Gaga start flopping.” The only answer is Sound of Music at the Oscars. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberries Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 2 hours ago, CoolNebraskaGuy said: Recurrent stream wise they're both irrelevant, but yeah NRO / HIH have more replay value than MR. Pretty sure Joanne sold more albums in the UK than Smile did around the world, though. Smile was a colossal flop, Joanne at least scanned platinum in the US and had a top 10 song Pure sales They have moved similar units when time or release is factored in - and one had the Super Bowl and a documentary 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VioletsandRoses Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 1 hour ago, Raspberries said: Pure sales They have moved similar units when time or release is factored in - and one had the Super Bowl and a documentary Joanne charted for 49 weeks while smile did 4 weeks? Didn’t even reach the top 10 in most markets and is certified in 2 countries vs 10. Joanne did 1.3m pure sales while smile did around 200k Sold more singles too digitally doesn’t make sense? I never witnessed the Artpop mess but I guess it’s because of that. Applause was a hit and Dwuw was a moderate hit but it was nowhere near the success she had. People were over the same weird aesthetic and stuff. Joanne came out and was very watered down. Chromatica was much better but the basic bloodpop production ruined it. Maybe she’ll fix her mistakes this era 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lg6chromatica Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 20 hours ago, Raspberries said: Joanne and Smile are similar sized eras (minus the tours obv cuz Smile was released during COVID) Don't even try it. Joanne - 201k (#1 - 65 weeks on the BBH200) Smile - 55k (#5 - 6 weeks on the BBH200) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GagaChina Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 sadly she's losing the conquering power in 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achilles. Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Quote lose (one's) edge. To lose the skills, conviction, or energy that helped make one a success before. The one-two punch of scrapping the original Edge of Glory video concept, followed by pushing You & I as a single. I don’t really remember the full details of the EOG video situation, but iirc she had a high-concept video planned and not only dropped that, but also cut multiple members of her creative team. It marked the beginning of the end. Per the above definition, parting ways with essential creative voices was a literal loss of skills. She also arguably lacked the conviction to stand by her intended concept. By the tail end of the Born This Way era, she had endured plenty of backlash from conservatives, some backlash from fans, lost part of her creative team, and flopped with Judas. The behind the scenes messiness was bleeding over into the public sphere. Pushing You & I as a single felt like a hail mary decision from the record label to try to salvage the era. And you can’t really say an act has an edge if they fumbled so badly the label has to intervene to course-correct. She’d already lost her edge by ARTPOP. A lot of that album campaign was just reactionary lashing out. The conviction was gone and the energy had long since shifted. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BraveNewSeth Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) 9 hours ago, Domination said: Some of y’all need to learn what it means to “lose your edge”. It does not mean “when did Lady Gaga start flopping.” The only answer is Sound of Music at the Oscars. Thank you. I was just about to comment this. ARTPOP may have flopped/underperformed critically and commercially but her music and image still had an undeniable edge to it, even if her “cool” factor had all but faded. Sound Of Music at the Oscars was pure sanitized Gaga, but at least it did a good job of repairing her image which was what it was intended to do. Edited March 14 by BraveNewSeth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie.Valdez Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Yes, the Oscars performance she started to cater to the AC , Hot AC audiences, those audiences don’t digest edginess often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gesamtkunstwerk Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 During end-BTW, start ARTPOP. When she fired her creative director and manager, it was clear that Gaga herself took more control over her image and career and it didn't pay off. It's not that Gaga is untalented in any way, but those people really elevated her to something special. I think she got surrounded by yes-men, which happens to a lot of superstars at their peak point, which often lead to their decline. They would've at least told her not to get puked on during a performance and hump R. Kelly on stage hopefully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funnyfatty Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 10 hours ago, Raspberries said: Pure sales They have moved similar units when time or release is factored in - and one had the Super Bowl and a documentary Not you comparing 400k stats and saying the Snot is the better performing album while saying that Pure Sales don’t matter anymore when there is a difference of 1m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starfish Posted March 14 Author Share Posted March 14 3 hours ago, Achilles. said: The one-two punch of scrapping the original Edge of Glory video concept, followed by pushing You & I as a single. I don’t really remember the full details of the EOG video situation, but iirc she had a high-concept video planned and not only dropped that, but also cut multiple members of her creative team. It marked the beginning of the end. Per the above definition, parting ways with essential creative voices was a literal loss of skills. She also arguably lacked the conviction to stand by her intended concept. By the tail end of the Born This Way era, she had endured plenty of backlash from conservatives, some backlash from fans, lost part of her creative team, and flopped with Judas. The behind the scenes messiness was bleeding over into the public sphere. Pushing You & I as a single felt like a hail mary decision from the record label to try to salvage the era. And you can’t really say an act has an edge if they fumbled so badly the label has to intervene to course-correct. She’d already lost her edge by ARTPOP. A lot of that album campaign was just reactionary lashing out. The conviction was gone and the energy had long since shifted. Thank you for understanding the question. I was thinking more about her extreme personality shift when I made the thread. Of course it's more likely that she was a fake all along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallumDavies Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Before ARTPOP. I think the video for Applause is a great example. Sure it was ‘creative’ but it didn’t have the same weight as her previous work. It somehow felt thin in comparison. I think that’s true of her creative output since then. She hasn’t done anything with the pure creative vision and power as Paparazzi, Alejandro, Bad Romance etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourHonesty Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 The entire BTW era should be a pop music case study tbh. It’s crazy how she went from being seen as thee pop culture visionary in 2010 to playing catch up with literally everyone else by 2013. I think it started with the Express Yourself controversy. It was the first blow to her mystique as this singular icon who outshone all her peers in terms of creativity, originality, artistry, classical talent, etc. Everything that unfolded afterward slowly continued that deconstruction, all culminating in her losing the plot entirely with DWUW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digitalism Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) People will say artpop But it was during born this way when she started firing everybody and started managing everything with the haus of gaga. Judas video being cheap and the makings of the edge of glory video being mess were signs that she had lost it. Imo she was afraid people were turning on her because of the express yourself thing, the born this way being too gay and the 0.99 album. So she stopped trusting people outside her inner circle which was a horrible idea. Edited March 14 by Digitalism 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberries Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 12 hours ago, lg6chromatica said: Don't even try it. Joanne - 201k (#1 - 65 weeks on the BBH200) Smile - 55k (#5 - 6 weeks on the BBH200) And? Joanne had terrible longevity after its run. Smile's got a huge boost from Harleys going viral a few times When all is said and done, they are similar sized eras when accounting for the head start Joanne had 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberries Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 6 hours ago, Funnyfatty said: Not you comparing 400k stats and saying the Snot is the better performing album while saying that Pure Sales don’t matter anymore when there is a difference of 1m Pure sales in 2016 vs pure sales in 2020 is a huge difference though lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leptine Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 46 minutes ago, Digitalism said: People will say artpop But it was during born this way when she started firing everybody and started managing everything with the haus of gaga. Judas video being cheap and the makings of the edge of glory video being mess were signs that she had lost it. Imo she was afraid people were turning on her because of the express yourself thing, the born this way being too gay and the 0.99 album. So she stopped trusting people outside her inner circle which was a horrible idea. Please be serious, the 'Judas' music video was far away to be cheap with different sets, several change of haute couture outfits including Versace and Christian Lacroix and starring the most popular tv actor of that time If anything that is one of her best videos. Not sure what the Amazon commercial decision of selling the album at that price has to do with her edge, once again a decision made by that company. The 'Express Yourself' thing didn't have any impact outside of middle age Madonna stans boards with the song staying #1 for weeks. Y'all truly stay saying anything senseless to fit your dumb narratives. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digitalism Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Leptine said: Please be serious, the 'Judas' music video was far away to be cheap with different sets, several change of haute couture outfits including Versace and Christian Lacroix and starring the most popular tv actor of that time If anything that is one of her best videos. Not sure what the Amazon commercial decision of selling the album at that price has to do with her edge, once again a decision made by that company. The 'Express Yourself' thing didn't have any impact outside of middle age Madonna stans forum with the song staying #1 for weeks. Y'all truly stay saying anything senseless to fit your dumb narratives. You started your post by saying the judas video isn't cheap which makes anything you said invalid. You're either a blind stan or know nothing about film making. Edited March 14 by Digitalism 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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