news 2024 US Election Megathread 🇺🇸🏛️

[Communion]

6 hours ago, GhostBox said:

Biden wants the US to accept refugees from Gaza. 
Trump on the other hand 

 

 

but again no meaningful difference 🤷

You're genuinely out of your depth. 

 

Palestinians don't want to come to America. They want America to stop bombing them. 

[Kassi]

This is so funny to me nn.

Love when my ops turn on each other 

 

 

 

 

[Kassi]

 

 

[Eat The Acid]

18 hours ago, GhostBox said:

Yes we know she doenst care about what happens to her fans here in the United States if Trump wins again. We get it. Rich woman who has enough money to go wherever she pleases if things get bad will be fine. 

Really? Can't you see the similarities of 2016 all over again? Democrats shaming people for being unhappy with a horrible candidate instead of advocating for them? Like shouldn't you be using your time writing letters, making phone calls, calling dems out on Twitter for their horrible policies, genocide, and inaction - instead of shaming voters here on ATRL who have validity in not voting for genocide??? Cardi B has a right not to vote and her voice will cement what so many 18-30 year olds are considering - staying at home. Many dems questioning it - may feel comfortable and not vote now seeing Cardi a huge celebrity also saying that's OK. And guess what? It is. Until you and your party do better - Trump will win. 

[VOSS]

Rudy served at his 80th birthday bash  

 

 

And just an hour after posting this…

 

[GhostBox]

great pics 😂

[karron0624]

1 hour ago, Eat The Acid said:

Really? Can't you see the similarities of 2016 all over again? Democrats shaming people for being unhappy with a horrible candidate instead of advocating for them? Like shouldn't you be using your time writing letters, making phone calls, calling dems out on Twitter for their horrible policies, genocide, and inaction - instead of shaming voters here on ATRL who have validity in not voting for genocide??? Cardi B has a right not to vote and her voice will cement what so many 18-30 year olds are considering - staying at home. Many dems questioning it - may feel comfortable and not vote now seeing Cardi a huge celebrity also saying that's OK. And guess what? It is. Until you and your party do better - Trump will win. 

Doesnt that go both ways though. Both sides can learn from 2016 and the consequences of not voting/putting up a bad candidate. I.e if trump does win and project 2025 does happen, "dems should have put up a better candidate" only goes so far when your group spent the entire time downplaying it saying that this is "fearmongering." Samething happened in 2016. Hillary said if trump wins we would lose roe v wade, leftist spent the whole time arguing that it was fearmongering for it to happen exactly as she said.

 

That being said, i do agree that no one is owed a vote. However, if you were warned and you ignore the risks, i dont believe you have a right to really complain about an outcome you knew could occur. I.e leftest cant complain about roe when they knew roe was on the ballot in 2016 and sat out (and same with women who swapped to the republican ticket that year). 
 

In 2024, there is a lot more than just Roe on the ballot. If you choose to be a single issue voter and sit out, throw your support on a third party because of Gaza, that is your right, and no one deserves to tell you that your vote is wrong. However, if that is enough to sway Trump to win, (instead of your chosen third party candidate, because i dont know who you are voting for, if anyone), and Trump implements Project 2025, or anything else you were warned about, you can't come back and blame democrats when you didnt support them. (I guess you can blame the third party candidate for not gathering enough votes to win, assumming they dont win that is).  After all, you had knowledge of the decisions, you had the ability to make a choice, and you made that choice knowing the full consequences of if your choice does not pan out.

[Communion]

1 hour ago, VOSS said:

Rudy served at his 80th birthday bash  

 

I hate being such a homosexual that I read this sentence, looked at the photos in the tweet, and my first thought was "I don't know if he's serving there, mama". 

[Communion]

27 minutes ago, karron0624 said:

Doesnt that go both ways though. Both sides can learn from 2016 and the consequences of not voting/putting up a bad candidate. I.e if trump does win and project 2025 does happen, "dems should have put up a better candidate" only goes so far when your group spent the entire time downplaying it saying that this is "fearmongering." Samething happened in 2016. Hillary said if trump wins we would lose roe v wade, leftist spent the whole time arguing that it was fearmongering for it to happen exactly as she said.

 

That being said, i do agree that no one is owed a vote. However, if you were warned and you ignore the risks, i dont believe you have a right to really complain about an outcome you knew could occur. I.e leftest cant complain about roe when they knew roe was on the ballot in 2016 and sat out (and same with women who swapped to the republican ticket that year). 
 

In 2024, there is a lot more than just Roe on the ballot. If you choose to be a single issue voter and sit out, throw your support on a third party because of Gaza, that is your right, and no one deserves to tell you that your vote is wrong. However, if that is enough to sway Trump to win, (instead of your chosen third party candidate, because i dont know who you are voting for, if anyone), and Trump implements Project 2025, or anything else you were warned about, you can't come back and blame democrats when you didnt support them. (I guess you can blame the third party candidate for not gathering enough votes to win, assumming they dont win that is).  After all, you had knowledge of the decisions, you had the ability to make a choice, and you made that choice knowing the full consequences of if your choice does not pan out.

The issue here is that you can't benefit from polarization and then be mad when it changes the traditional context politics used to exist in.

 

A non-insignificant number of voters blame Biden for the overturning of Roe. Not because they think he literally undid it himself, but how polarization has changed the dynamics of voting and party identification. It's now not two parties competing for the same voters - its parties trying to rally up their base. And when Democrats fail to appropriately and measurably prevent harm that Republicans perpetuate, it's seen as a failure by some Dem voters on Democrats to protect us as their voters and their base.

 

This is why you'll have to shoot me to get me to stop talking about class because it's self-evident over and over that such is the defining issue in ideology.

 

People removed from the lives of ordinary Americans keep claiming to understand the interests and motivations of regular Americans yet ending up wrong.

"HILLARY TOLD US ROE WAS IN DANGER - AND SHE WAS RIGHT!!". She also claimed it would motiviate people to the polls... she was wrong.

"HILLARY WAS PROVEN RIGHT WHEN SHE SAID THE SUPREME COURT WAS ON THE LINE". And her claim it'd get people to vote for her... was wrong.

 

If Democrats claim politics is about winning elections but don't want to actually understand how to win elections, they're simply not a viable political party.

[byzantium]

2 hours ago, karron0624 said:

Doesnt that go both ways though. Both sides can learn from 2016 and the consequences of not voting/putting up a bad candidate. I.e if trump does win and project 2025 does happen, "dems should have put up a better candidate" only goes so far when your group spent the entire time downplaying it saying that this is "fearmongering." Samething happened in 2016. Hillary said if trump wins we would lose roe v wade, leftist spent the whole time arguing that it was fearmongering for it to happen exactly as she said.

This argument worked for 2020.  Dems once again put up a bad candidate, but in remembrance of 2016  people voted for that bad candidate.  This year is now the third time in a row Dems are shoving a deeply unpopular candidate down our throats and at some point people say, "enough".  The American people could not possibly be more vocal in our desire to not have Joe Biden (and Trump) as the candidates, but here we are.  I don't think you can blame people for disengaging from two parties that for 3 elections in a row have not been listening and representing them.  

 

2 hours ago, karron0624 said:

That being said, i do agree that no one is owed a vote. However, if you were warned and you ignore the risks, i dont believe you have a right to really complain about an outcome you knew could occur. I.e leftest cant complain about roe when they knew roe was on the ballot in 2016 and sat out (and same with women who swapped to the republican ticket that year). 

This gatekeeping of who does and does not have rights needs to stop.  Every American has the right to complain about the tragedy that our politics has become. 

 

 

3 hours ago, karron0624 said:

In 2024, there is a lot more than just Roe on the ballot. If you choose to be a single issue voter and sit out, throw your support on a third party because of Gaza, that is your right, and no one deserves to tell you that your vote is wrong. However, if that is enough to sway Trump to win, (instead of your chosen third party candidate, because i dont know who you are voting for, if anyone), and Trump implements Project 2025, or anything else you were warned about, you can't come back and blame democrats when you didnt support them. (I guess you can blame the third party candidate for not gathering enough votes to win, assumming they dont win that is).  After all, you had knowledge of the decisions, you had the ability to make a choice, and you made that choice knowing the full consequences of if your choice does not pan out.

The democrats are not worried about the prospect of a Trump victory and the implementation of Project 2025.  The Democrats would rather lose in a way that feels comfortable than win in a way that feels novel.  And for that every American can absolutely blame them.  There are many (emphasis on MANY) people in the Democratic Party that could be running and whipping the floor with trump right now.  Right now in my state, Tammy Baldwin is 10 points ahead of her republican rival (which in WI is the largest lead I think I have ever seen).  People do not have an issue with the Democratic Party so much as they do Joe Biden, and the fact that the party has all the data showing this and are still willing to put our democracy on the line is something that we can and should be blaming them for.  

[Eat The Acid]

3 hours ago, karron0624 said:

Doesnt that go both ways though. Both sides can learn from 2016 and the consequences of not voting/putting up a bad candidate. I.e if trump does win and project 2025 does happen, "dems should have put up a better candidate" only goes so far when your group spent the entire time downplaying it saying that this is "fearmongering." Samething happened in 2016. Hillary said if trump wins we would lose roe v wade, leftist spent the whole time arguing that it was fearmongering for it to happen exactly as she said.

 

That being said, i do agree that no one is owed a vote. However, if you were warned and you ignore the risks, i dont believe you have a right to really complain about an outcome you knew could occur. I.e leftest cant complain about roe when they knew roe was on the ballot in 2016 and sat out (and same with women who swapped to the republican ticket that year). 
 

In 2024, there is a lot more than just Roe on the ballot. If you choose to be a single issue voter and sit out, throw your support on a third party because of Gaza, that is your right, and no one deserves to tell you that your vote is wrong. However, if that is enough to sway Trump to win, (instead of your chosen third party candidate, because i dont know who you are voting for, if anyone), and Trump implements Project 2025, or anything else you were warned about, you can't come back and blame democrats when you didnt support them. (I guess you can blame the third party candidate for not gathering enough votes to win, assumming they dont win that is).  After all, you had knowledge of the decisions, you had the ability to make a choice, and you made that choice knowing the full consequences of if your choice does not pan out.

BUT what are you talking about! Because nobody here would even consider voting Republican. People here are open to voting Democrat. So no one gives a rats ass what republicans do girl. So keep your both sides to yourself and bad faith arguments. If democrats want to be the left and liberal section of government - then start acting like it and start appealing to the voters that will get them elected. Who cares what republicans do. At the end of day - many voters will not vote in good conscience for Joe Biden while he's committing genocide and for that fact - not even if he stops because he's tarnished now. It's over for him for progressives. 

[GraceRandolph]

"Instead, Mr. Biden's losses are concentrated among moderate and conservative Democratic-leaning voters, who nonetheless think that the system needs major changes or to be torn down altogether. Mr. Trump wins just 2 percent of Mr. Biden's "very liberal" 2020 voters who think the system at least needs major changes, compared with 16 percent of those who are moderate or conservative."

 

The Biden campaign is an unmitigated disaster.

[Kassi]

49 minutes ago, byzantium said:

 Dems once again put up a bad candidate, but in remembrance of 2016  people voted for that bad candidate.  This year is now the third time in a row Dems are shoving a deeply unpopular candidate down our throats and at some point people say, "enough".

This is patently false.

 

Before the 2016 election, Hillary, a former first lady and Senator, was considered one of the most popular figures across the US. She had like a 60% favorable ratings at one point. Only Obama had more star power. The negative coverage during the 2016 campaign did her in -- basically imagine she's a pop girl at the top of her game and they're trying to take her down type of coverage. The email story should not have gone on as long as it did.

 

 

(Hint: Notice how her ratings also took a dive during the 2007 primary season)

 

The media can and does make anyone unpopular. So this argument doesn't gel.

[karron0624]

2 hours ago, Eat The Acid said:

BUT what are you talking about! Because nobody here would even consider voting Republican. People here are open to voting Democrat. So no one gives a rats ass what republicans do girl. So keep your both sides to yourself and bad faith arguments. If democrats want to be the left and liberal section of government - then start acting like it and start appealing to the voters that will get them elected. Who cares what republicans do. At the end of day - many voters will not vote in good conscience for Joe Biden while he's committing genocide and for that fact - not even if he stops because he's tarnished now. It's over for him for progressives. 

I didnt say republican, i said third party? So that is just you misunderstanding. And i agreed with your second point? But i also said you fully understand the consequences if your candidate (third party) or democrats dont win.

 

There actually wasnt a both sides argument in my statement so i'm not sure what you're reading or trying to interpret, but try again. ✌️

[karron0624]

2 hours ago, Eat The Acid said:

BUT what are you talking about! Because nobody here would even consider voting Republican. People here are open to voting Democrat. So no one gives a rats ass what republicans do girl. So keep your both sides to yourself and bad faith arguments. If democrats want to be the left and liberal section of government - then start acting like it and start appealing to the voters that will get them elected. Who cares what republicans do. At the end of day - many voters will not vote in good conscience for Joe Biden while he's committing genocide and for that fact - not even if he stops because he's tarnished now. It's over for him for progressives. 

Also, not trying to be rude, but i think you genuinely misunderstood my point and what i was getting. Simply put, you can vote for whoever you want and no one should shame you for it, but if something results from your sctuons you can't really complain. The whole paragraphs which i hate writing was to clear up any misunderstandings, but may have complicated it even more. If it did apologies.

 

 

[karron0624]

3 hours ago, byzantium said:

This argument worked for 2020.  Dems once again put up a bad candidate, but in remembrance of 2016  people voted for that bad candidate.  This year is now the third time in a row Dems are shoving a deeply unpopular candidate down our throats and at some point people say, "enough".  The American people could not possibly be more vocal in our desire to not have Joe Biden (and Trump) as the candidates, but here we are.  I don't think you can blame people for disengaging from two parties that for 3 elections in a row have not been listening and representing them.  

 

This gatekeeping of who does and does not have rights needs to stop.  Every American has the right to complain about the tragedy that our politics has become. 

 

 

The democrats are not worried about the prospect of a Trump victory and the implementation of Project 2025.  The Democrats would rather lose in a way that feels comfortable than win in a way that feels novel.  And for that every American can absolutely blame them.  There are many (emphasis on MANY) people in the Democratic Party that could be running and whipping the floor with trump right now.  Right now in my state, Tammy Baldwin is 10 points ahead of her republican rival (which in WI is the largest lead I think I have ever seen).  People do not have an issue with the Democratic Party so much as they do Joe Biden, and the fact that the party has all the data showing this and are still willing to put our democracy on the line is something that we can and should be blaming them for.  

Sorry for the triple post yall, didnt see this one:

 

First paragraph: I dont disagree with you, and i specifically said that no one is owed a vote. Progressives dont have to vote for democrats, and if they feel as if there is a better candidate for them, vote for that candidate. (I would rather have a clear three or four party system anyways).

 

second Paragraph: It's not gatekeeping. That would be constantly bringing up someone elses life, and comparing it to your own life to show why you have a moral authority on something. If you don't support a candidate, you can't complain when said candidate doesnt win. I.e if you vote for Jill Stein and Joe loses, complaining that Joe didnt win is.. well dumb. Quite frankly you should be complaining that Jill didnt win. (And more people should actually try to encourage her to win versus just doing a "protest vote for Jill."

 

Third paragraph: only disagree that they arent worried about project 2025. The rest I agree with, and I don't necessarily think it contradicts anything i said?

[GhostBox]

Biden is against the NRA and has passed gun reform laws and wants to ban assault weapons.

 

trump tonight is speaking at the NRA convention saying he will undo every gun safety provision, and begging for their money. 

 

but again. No meaningful differences between the two. 

 

 

[Communion]

9 minutes ago, karron0624 said:

Sorry for the triple post yall, didnt see this one:

 

First paragraph: I dont disagree with you, and i specifically said that no one is owed a vote. Progressives dont have to vote for democrats, and if they feel as if there is a better candidate for them, vote for that candidate. (I would rather have a clear three or four party system anyways).

 

second Paragraph: It's not gatekeeping. That would be constantly bringing up someone elses life, and comparing it to your own life to show why you have a moral authority on something. If you don't support a candidate, you can't complain when said candidate doesnt win. I.e if you vote for Jill Stein and Joe loses, complaining that Joe didnt win is.. well dumb. Quite frankly you should be complaining that Jill didnt win. (And more people should actually try to encourage her to win versus just doing a "protest vote for Jill."

 

Third paragraph: only disagree that they arent worried about project 2025. The rest I agree with, and I don't necessarily think it contradicts anything i said?

dddd sister, *you* were the one who complained all those years ago about the tax burden on people who make over $150k wrt to Medicare For All.

 

Being poor isn't virtuous and no one has claimed it to be so - people who want to eradicate poverty don't think it's somehow a more inherently moral position to be in. It's basic economic and material fact that healthcare in most developed nations works as the healthy subsidizing the unhealthy and this is usually done through a progressive taxation, often exempting the poorest of citizens from said taxation. 

 

This is why policy has largely evaded the thread on here, replaced by mindless cheerleading and back-and-forth bickering.

Because some of you claim to be policy oriented yet are seemingly ashamed of the policy you claim to find good.,

 

 I don't think you're evil for thinking people who make $30k and who make $150k should pay the same tax for M4A. I just think it makes you financially illiterate?

Edited May 19 by Communion

[bunnyeyes]

Biden isn't winning not because young people won't vote for him but because young people won't campaign for him. People underestimate the power of youth-led voter registration and door to door campaigning across all age groups.

[GhostBox]

31 minutes ago, bunnyeyes said:

Biden isn't winning not because young people won't vote for him but because young people won't campaign for him. People underestimate the power of youth-led voter registration and door to door campaigning across all age groups.

Wild thing about 2020 is the republicans were doing the normal door to door campaigning while the Dems didn't. The Dems were taking covid a lot more serious than the gop was at the time. So the Biden campaign didn't much have a ground game. 
 

so while what you said can be true,  any ground game they do have this time which so far we are seeing is huge (lots of campaign offices opening up everywhere)  already is gonna be very helpful in very tight races. 

Edited May 19 by GhostBox

[GraceRandolph]

31 minutes ago, bunnyeyes said:

Biden isn't winning not because young people won't vote for him but because young people won't campaign for him. People underestimate the power of youth-led voter registration and door to door campaigning across all age groups.

There was a recent Jacobin article about this. Biden is such a disastrously weak candidate that any on the ground mobilization efforts will be difficult due to his age, Gaza, and inflation concerns. Plus the Dems don't have a core message outside of Roe to really galvanize support.

[Communion]

7 minutes ago, GhostBox said:

Wild thing about 2020 is the republicans were doing the normal door to door campaigning while the Dems didn't. The Dems were taking covid a lot more serious than the gop was at the time. So the Biden campaign didn't much have a ground game. 
 

so while what you said can be true,  any ground game they do have this time which so far we are seeing is huge (lots of campaign offices opening up everywhere)  already is gonna be very helpful in very tight races. 

You're just ******* making **** up at this point. Arizona had one of the largest GTVO operations, largely led by progressive Latino-oriented orgs on the ground. The Biden campaign in the summer of 2020 attempted to signal moving away funding from voting outreach to backlash that then led to growing operations in swing states. COVID concerns over door-knocking didn't justify eliminating phone-banking and texting.

 

Genuinely no one can post a factual without you posting the exact opposite in defense of Biden, no matter how wrong.

Edited May 19 by Communion

[byzantium]

3 hours ago, Kassi said:

This is patently false.

 

Before the 2016 election, Hillary, a former first lady and Senator, was considered one of the most popular figures across the US. She had like a 60% favorable ratings at one point. Only Obama had more star power. The negative coverage during the 2016 campaign did her in -- basically imagine she's a pop girl at the top of her game and they're trying to take her down type of coverage. The email story should not have gone on as long as it did.

 

 

(Hint: Notice how her ratings also took a dive during the 2007 primary season)

 

The media can and does make anyone unpopular. So this argument doesn't gel.

So what are the dems's excuse with Joe? 

[GraceRandolph]

 

33 minutes ago, byzantium said:

So what are the dems's excuse with Joe? 

The Dems are going to say the media was too hard on his age, even though it's a legitimate criticism and it's painful to watch the man speak. Dems never self reflect after losses they just blame.

[GhostBox]

1 hour ago, Communion said:

You're just ******* making **** up at this point. Arizona had one of the largest GTVO operations, largely led by progressive Latino-oriented orgs on the ground. The Biden campaign in the summer of 2020 attempted to signal moving away funding from voting outreach to backlash that then led to growing operations in swing states. COVID concerns over door-knocking didn't justify eliminating phone-banking and texting.

 

Genuinely no one can post a factual without you posting the exact opposite in defense of Biden, no matter how wrong.

 you can ramble all you want as you always do but it's a fact the Biden campaign did not have the biggest ground game (definitely compared to the Trump camp) in 2020. I mean it wasn't a big secret. It had the dem base bed wetting that we were gonna lose because of it. I also never said they didn't try to sway away from this choice (or that there weren't small bright spots ) but largely they still stuck to the "don't get covid stay safe"  plan.  I even complained about it myself 💀

 

It was also reported on. 

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/08/04/trump-joe-biden-campaign-door-knockers-391454

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1242803

 
^just a few of many articles on the matter 

 

Thankfully this election is  different and the Biden campaign is full swing on all fronts 

 

Edited May 19 by GhostBox