base talk 143: Not that bad?

[Big Bad Wolf]

Okay, so I just listened to 143 in full for the first time. And I won't lie, is it a generic run of the mill pop album? Absolutely. 
 

Of course a lot of the hate Katy is getting is because of the circumstances surrounding Dr. Luke and their history together.
 

But with all of the scathing reviews, you think this album wouldn't be on par with what ATRL seems to enjoy generally, like I swear if artists like Kylie Minogue or Ava Max released this album, a lot of y'all would be saying you love it and would be calling these songs "pure pop perfection"

 

A lot of us are just here for the messiness of Katy bombing even worse than Hitless & Smilelines. 
 

Agree?

[ChooseyLover]

I've just seen you today slandering JoJo and Joni Mitchell and now praising this album and I just can't take you seriously.

[Nico Robin]

She gave us bops, some cute melodies with super undercooked production but I'll be using it for the next few weeks. The critical reception for it is justified to some degree but not to the extend we experience right now

Edited September 20 by Nico Robin

[UrMom]

I agree with this take.

 

Yeah, it was a mistake going back to Dr. Luke, and "Woman's World" was trash, but the rest of the album is a totally competent dance pop album if you can overlook the producer (which I can understand is a big ask).

[PoisonedIvy]

4 minutes ago, Big Bad Wolf said:

 

Agree?

 

[Reginald]

4 minutes ago, Big Bad Wolf said:

Kylie Minogue or Ava Max released this album

I will admit that Crush is an Ava-Kylie-coded bop, but that's the only track I can see myself regularly revisiting as a guilty pleasure 

[JackOfHearts]

Both your options are true.

It's a standard pop album, sure, I feel like that's the point you're trying to make, but… it's also the worst one released this year? It's frickin soulless. It is a shell. A husk. Maybe the effort was there (debatable) but damn, the output was not up to par. But sure, at least its a standard pop album.

[yonsé]

3 minutes ago, ChooseyLover said:

I've just seen you today slandering JoJo and Joni Mitchell and now praising this album and I just can't take you seriously.

not rly slander when shes critizicing a very racist move by miss joni.

 

 

---

 

to be on topic, the album isnt THAT bad. its just boring. she hasnt grown at all since TD and most people are over her type of pop.

[Big Bad Wolf]

7 minutes ago, ChooseyLover said:

I've just seen you today slandering JoJo and Joni Mitchell and now praising this album and I just can't take you seriously.

JoJo was nothing more than a teen popstar for a very short period of time (commercially speaking). I'm not familiar.

 

Regarding Joni, I do like the handful of songs I know from her, like Blue, Hejira, Lady of the Canyon, etc. But, the minstrel album is completely off putting to say the least. And I feel like anytime I see people defending her for it, they're pretty vague and beat around the bush without giving a clear explanation or analysis.

Edited September 20 by Big Bad Wolf

[TaylorsSquad]

I do think it's just a soulless Pop Album. It's a damn shame Katy didn't know how to grow as an artist  and she deserves all the lashings for running back to Dr. Luke but I don't think the Album is that bad. 

[ChooseyLover]

Just now, yonsé said:

not rly slander when shes critizicing a very racist move by miss joni.

 

 

---

 

to be on topic, the album isnt THAT bad. its just boring. she hasnt grown at all since TD and most people are over her type of pop.

Agreed, but using it as a gag out of the blue without even knowing who Joni Mitchell is or the context of the situation... I don't understand why some users slander artists without even knowing who they are. Joni Mitchell apologized for it and she's very beloved by the people in the industry who should be offended by it so...

 

Also calling out bigotry having a Lana del Rey pfp, I'd just sit that one out.

[Relampago.]

It's so lifeless and dry, from the lyrics, to the vocals, to the production, it's hard to even realize you're listening to music even if it isn't necessarily offensive to the ears. 

 

Music is art, even with an Ava Max album you can hear some vigor and passion in her voice, even if she's not writing Joni Mitchell level lyrics with FKA Twigs production. There's something behind it. 

 

I LOVE generic music as much as the next guy, but 143 takes it so far it's almost uncanny. Like a completely AI made album, there's a lack of depth to it that just makes it impossible to latch onto anything about it. 

[Flower]

It's absolutely not that bad lmao. It's actually her most cohesive album? Obviously it doesn't have any high highs (except Gorgeous for me) but the smooth transition is one I wanna praise on. 

[thatsmydemi]

It isn't that bad. It's a great 6.5 album. Her best album since PRISM. 

[Big Bad Wolf]

1 minute ago, ChooseyLover said:

Agreed, but using it as a gag out of the blue without even knowing who Joni Mitchell is or the context of the situation... I don't understand why some users slander artists without even knowing who they are. Joni Mitchell apologized for it and she's very beloved by the people in the industry who should be offended by it so...

 

Also calling out bigotry having a Lana del Rey pfp, I'd just sit that one out.

Please tell me the context of her dedicating an album to blackface. I'm genuinely curious.

 

And just because she apologized for it, doesn't mean she's absolved from criticism or dislike for the people it offends.

 

I asked a genuine question because I was curious. I found the responses unsatisfactory so I didn't reply. And Lana has never ever used her platform to support such highly offensive and bold bigotry, no matter what you assume of her and her character. 

[LoveInStereo]

It's the worst album of the year, no question. If I had to compare it to another panned release - C,XOXO at least felt like Camilla was inspired & finding her own voice. As odd as the lyrics were, there was a vision & she committed to it. When Katy sang "trippy trippy daddy" on Gimme Gimme, I got viscerally mad. That doesn't mean anything even in an abstract sense. It's just word salad to fill in syllables. These are the worst songs of her career by a landslide & makes an absolute mockery of the pop genre

[ChooseyLover]

9 minutes ago, Big Bad Wolf said:

JoJo was nothing more than a teen popstar for a very short period of time (commercially speaking). I'm not familiar.

 

Regarding Joni, I do like the handful of songs I know from her, like Blue, Hejira, Lady of the Canyon, etc. But, the minstrel album is completely off putting to say the least. And I feel like anytime I see people defending her for it, they're pretty vague and beat around the bush without giving a clear explanation or analysis.

JoJo is really talented and has a very extense catalogue of music far beyond those two hits. If you are a music lover, which I'm sure you are, you wouldn't mind lack of commercial success and you would be a bit curious when it comes to artists that have a cult following. The blackface stuff is off-putting and worth discussing but from a different perspective rather than petty stan wars, times have changed a lot and we don't live in the same society 50 years later.

Edited September 20 by ChooseyLover

[UnusualBoy]

The album is just generic and souless pop songs but not a piece of trash like some of the critics and the obnoxious hags from here say.

[єѕℓαм]

Literally Crush and maybe Nirvana are the only listenable songs on the album and they are not even that great tbh

[ChooseyLover]

6 minutes ago, Big Bad Wolf said:

Please tell me the context of her dedicating an album to blackface. I'm genuinely curious.

 

And just because she apologized for it, doesn't mean she's absolved from criticism or dislike for the people it offends.

 

I asked a genuine question because I was curious. I found the responses unsatisfactory so I didn't reply. And Lana has never ever used her platform to support such highly offensive and bold bigotry, no matter what you assume of her and her character. 

Open a thread dedicated to it and more knowledgeable people on the issue will tell you all you need to know.

 

To stay on topic: yes, it's really bad and the worst mainstream release of the year.

[Expensive Taste]

The album isn't bad; is it the best of her career? Not really, it's quite far from that, to be honest. But the hate train she's experiencing is going too far; it's honestly ridiculous.

[tjspy]

I am one of the few not hating on Katy, and I hated the album 

[gimmelaugh]

It sounds like a standard pop album to me  

I do admit that I personally would definitely like it more if Ava released this cause I love Ava's voice and I

think it would be more interesting vocally if Ava did it 

[vuelve88]

It's definitely up there with classics like Camp Rock 2: Live Walmart Soundcheck by Demi Lovato. 

[CovalentBondage]

11 minutes ago, ChooseyLover said:

JoJo is really talented and has a very extense catalogue of music far beyond those two hits. If you are a music lover, which I'm sure you are, you wouldn't mind lack of commercial success and you would be a bit curious when it comes to artists that have a cult following. The blackface stuff is off-putting and worth discussing but from a different perspective rather than petty stan wars, times have changed a lot and we don't live in the same society 50 years later.

Educate the masses on JoJo. 

 

trying not to think about it is a masterpiece.