Vroom Vroom Posted January 2 Posted January 2 On 12/31/2023 at 5:31 PM, Communion said: @Vroom Vroom @Bloo @ClashAndBurn I think how other Dems poll poorly like Biden does once named vs how "Generic Dem" does proves an interesting point, and one that favors progressives' concerns. That our concern with Biden isn't personal. It's not rooted in some hatred of him as a person (though I think there's obviously quirks to him as a personality that have manifested in his presidency, like his vehement Zionism being over-the-top for even a Dem and largely rooted in his own personal views). The "backbench" we have are largely mealy-mouthed establishment Dems who have no political vision. I think 2020 showed us people don't just respond to policy; however, how politicians respond to the political consensus of a coalition impacts how people "perceive" their character, which is also huge part of politics. Biden and Sanders consolidated the field in 2020 due to building high levels of trust with two distinct coalitions of voters (and the chances of people like Beto, Buttigieg, Kamala, Warren, etc. all ended up collapsing the moment that they ended up losing trust with the voters they were aiming for). A huge part of why Biden beat Trump is because he built trust amongst young progressives by claiming to adopt much of Sanders' agenda, and the driving force for his poor polling now is largely due to young voters/voters of color not voting / voting 3rd party due to that trust being broken. That most big-name Dems *similarly* are seen as fakes and phonies like Biden is now is not then evidence to accept Biden's flaws and failures (which are almost guaranteed to hand Trump the presidency), but demand Democrats as a party recognize the desires of actual voters. Biden CAN win. He just can't win while enabling genocide. Biden CAN win. He just can't win while giving millions to ICE to snatch immigrants out of their homes in the middle of the night. Biden CAN win. He just can't win while ignoring mass economic suffering due to corporate greed and trying to run on a dead-end economic message of Bidenomics. I agree it's not as simple as replacing Biden with another Dem just as corrupt and regressive as him. It's not his age or demeanor that is the issue. It's something existential at the core of the Democratic party, which is why partisan VBNMW Democrats who don't see Biden's refusal to shift leftward and course correct for the reckoning as it is are those who'll actually enable a Trump win. This was essentially my comment to @Breathe On Moi. I WANT Biden to win. That's why it TERRIFIES me that he and so many in his administration are blatantly refusing the only viable pathway we have to defeat Trump (embracing the progressive policy desires of the actual Dem base). Well said All of the current big name democrats (Harris, Newsom, Clinton) are in the same moderate establishment lane that Biden is in. Switching him out for one of them will change nothing or potentially make things worse depending on how the public responds to their candidacy The only well known progressive democrat is Sanders. The second Sanders announced that he would not challenge Biden again, Biden became the best option for dems to win. I respect Marianne for trying to be the progressive challenger, but Bernie is the only one that could fill that lane in 2024 The last time a president decided not to seek reelection, it ended up being a massive disaster for democrats. LBJ could have still lost to Nixon, but he would have had a better chance than Humphrey after that disastrous primary
BorderBoy Posted January 2 Posted January 2 He supports genocide against civilians in Gaza and has degraded Palestinians so many times. He deserves absolutely no popularity. 1
Sannie Posted January 2 Posted January 2 And yet he and his party had the most successful mid-term election cycle for an incumbent in decades. And yet his party continues to clean up in elections nationwide. When are people going to stop relying on polls that have shown time and time again they no longer know how to poll properly?
Communion Posted January 2 Posted January 2 31 minutes ago, Sannie said: And yet he and his party had the most successful mid-term election cycle for an incumbent in decades. So you're saying it's even worse that the DNC is forcing Biden onto voters when the Democratic Party is more popular than Biden is?
Communion Posted January 2 Posted January 2 32 minutes ago, Sannie said: And yet he and his party had the most successful mid-term election cycle for an incumbent in decades. And yet his party continues to clean up in elections nationwide. When are people going to stop relying on polls that have shown time and time again they no longer know how to poll properly? Also this is brazen, Fox News-style disinformation. Genuine VBNMW brain rot. The same polls that accurately predict Democrats winning over and over in Congressional races are also the ones showing Biden is unpopular. You're beyond parody at this point. You're proving Biden could - to steal a line - shoot somebody in the middle of Times Square and yall would still defend him. 2
John Slayne Posted January 2 Posted January 2 Another thing people always forget to talk about is that Biden barely scraped enough votes to beat Trump. The 'he already beat Trump once!' argument is extremely thin in my opinion when many swing states were won by a couple thousand votes. Biden losing any popularity should concern and alarm you.
ATRL Moderator Bloo Posted January 2 ATRL Moderator Posted January 2 2 hours ago, Sannie said: And yet he and his party had the most successful mid-term election cycle for an incumbent in decades. And yet his party continues to clean up in elections nationwide. When are people going to stop relying on polls that have shown time and time again they no longer know how to poll properly? As @Communion mentioned, the polls literally showed that the Red Wave wasn't going to happen. It was mostly pundits that said "polls can't be trusted" that promoted the idea that a Red Wave was a foregone conclusion. 1
ClashAndBurn Posted January 2 Posted January 2 Really impressive. Only Genocide Joe could surrender the youth and crater among black people in such a humiliating fashion.
nadiamendell Posted January 2 Posted January 2 9 minutes ago, ClashAndBurn said: Really impressive. Only Genocide Joe could surrender the youth and crater among black people in such a humiliating fashion. Wow. It's even worse than I thought.
Armani? Posted January 3 Posted January 3 Wow, bombing children is unpopular. Who would have guessed 1
Infinity Posted January 3 Posted January 3 On 12/30/2023 at 12:02 PM, DemDam92 said: And of course Mariah was stupid enough to take a pic with him and post it Mariah likes to stay out of politics but I think she just saw it as an honor to go to the White House, not really as an endorsement of Biden who is fanning the flames of war/ethnic cleansing in Gaza.
ClashAndBurn Posted January 3 Posted January 3 13 minutes ago, Infinity said: Mariah likes to stay out of politics but I think she just saw it as an honor to go to the White House, not really as an endorsement of Biden who is fanning the flames of war/ethnic cleansing in Gaza. Nah, if the American music industry and the Democratic Party were a Venn Diagram, they’d be a nearly perfect circle. The atrocities in Gaza that Biden is giving his explicit approval and support of won’t cost him unless their comfortable lives at home are impacted in some way. It’s not in their interest to speak out against Palestinian children being bombed to death by the American munitions that Joe Biden is illegally circumventing Congress to provide to Israel.
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