discussion Canadian Parliament and Zelenskyy give standing ovation to Nazi officer (14th SS)

[Monday Night Messiah]

Here's Jewish newspaper The Forward reporting on Yaroslav Hunka, a 98-year-old man who fought with the Nazis in the First Ukrainian Division (i.e. 14th Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS).

 

Zelenskyy joins Canadian ovation for veteran who fought with Nazis – The Forward

 

While mainstream news reports failed to mention this fact, AP confirmed that the man was indeed recognized (see fourth photo's caption).

 

Zelenskyy speaks before Canadian Parliament in his campaign to shore up support for Ukraine | AP News

 

Why is this okay?

[réveuse]

Uhm, yikes. What Russia is doing IS bad but respecting nazis? Nope.

[Monday Night Messiah]

2 minutes ago, réveuse said:

Uhm, yikes. What Russia is doing IS bad but respecting nazis? Nope.

Twitter bottoms are already making excuses, saying "we have to understand nuance."

[Bosque]

… you do realize that Ukraine was occupied by Nazi Germany… right? But I’m sure all those brave Twitter users would have definitely resisted occupation back then and preferred to die for their oh-so-deeply held values. 

it’s always funny how some users are more concerned with what a 98-year old did during WW 2 (when he was literally 18 years old and drafted as a foot soldier) than the current illegal war waged against Ukraine.  

Edited September 24, 2023 by Dephira

[Monday Night Messiah]

1 minute ago, Dephira said:

… you do realize that Ukraine was occupied by Nazi Germany… right? But I’m sure all those brave Twitter users would have definitely resisted occupation back then and preferred to die for their oh-so-deeply held values. 

it’s always funny how some users are more concerned with what a 98-year old did during WW 2 than the current illegal war waged against Ukraine.  

Two things can be true at the same time. Nobody here is denying that what Russia's doing is wrong because it is wrong. But to actively praise Nazis and remove details of them being Nazis in news reports is unethical.

[Mean Trees]

56 minutes ago, Dephira said:

… you do realize that Ukraine was occupied by Nazi Germany… right? But I’m sure all those brave Twitter users would have definitely resisted occupation back then and preferred to die for their oh-so-deeply held values. 

it’s always funny how some users are more concerned with what a 98-year old did during WW 2 (when he was literally 18 years old and drafted as a foot soldier) than the current illegal war waged against Ukraine.  

SS were paramilitary and a voluntary force. Applauding a man who voluntarily fought against the Allied forces because of a situation in 2023 is ridiculous but I'm not surprised to see some ATRLers justify such behavior.

[whitehotforever]

[Bosque]

33 minutes ago, Mean Trees said:

SS were paramilitary and a voluntary force. Applauding a man who voluntarily fought against the Allied forces because of a situation in 2023 is ridiculous but I'm not surprised to see some ATRLers justify such behavior.

For the love of god pick up a history book - sis, I….

[Mean Trees]

29 minutes ago, Dephira said:

For the love of god pick up a history book - sis, I….

The 14th Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS (1st Galician) (German: 14. Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS [galizische Nr. 1];^[2] Ukrainian: 14а Гренадерська Дивізія СС (1а галицька), romanized: 14a Hrenaderska Dyviziia SS (1a halytska)), known as the 14th SS-Volunteer Division "Galicia" (German: 14. SS-Freiwilligen Division "Galizien", Ukrainian: 14а Добровільна Дивізія СС "Галичина", romanized: 14a Dobrovilna Dyviziia SS "Halychyna") prior to 1944,^[1] was a World War II Nazi Germany military formation made up predominantly of military volunteers with a Ukrainian ethnic background from the area of Galicia,^[3] later also with some Slovaks.^[3][4] Formed in 1943, it was largely destroyed in the Lvov–Sandomierz offensive, reformed, and saw action in Slovakia, Yugoslavia, and Austria before being renamed the first division of the Ukrainian National Army and surrendering to the Western Allies by 10 May 1945.

 

 

And you can read this man's own words...

 

English translation

 

https://twitter.com/Panopticonomy/status/1705855919324582282/photo/2

 

 

Archive of the orignal from 2011 - https://archive.ph/nFkWM

 

The nerve of you to tell anyone to read a book.

 

[Communion]

3 hours ago, Dephira said:

… you do realize that Ukraine was occupied by Nazi Germany… right?

This literally goes against the accepted historical view of the Holocaust that those who fought for and alongside the Nazis, even just as partisans, were still responsible for the crimes against humanity that they helped the Nazis commit.

 

It literally also goes against the documented recounts of history by Jewish Ukrainians that pogroms unfolded throughout Ukraine even before any German officials reached the border, much like in other parts of the Baltics.

 

You're literally dabbling in Holocaust denialism because you're most concerned about optics in 2023.

 

Ukraine committed immeasurable violence against Jewish people during WWII. Trying to shroud it is an offensive "double genocide theory" criticized by Jewish scholars that tries to equate the Soviet Union to Nazi Germany and defend what was done is a form of Holocaust denialism.

 

You can make the argument for why the West should and needs to continue to aid Ukraine against Russia's illegal invasion without erasing other crimes against humanity.

Edited September 24, 2023 by Communion

[ZIVERT]

ATRL isn’t ready for the nuance of this conversation. The Soviets had just finished committing their own genocide against Ukrainians, called the Holodomor. But honoring nazis is BAD.
 

Quote

It is unclear whether Zelenskyy knew that Hunka fought with the unit. In 2021, the Ukrainian president joined the governments of Israel and Germany in denouncing a march honoring SS Galichina in Kyiv.

Edited September 24, 2023 by ZIVERT

[suburbannature]

Does this somehow make the invasion of Ukraine less atrocious?

[Communion]

18 minutes ago, suburbannature said:

Does this somehow make the invasion of Ukraine less atrocious?

It feels disingenuous to try and make any of this about the invasion of Ukraine given that Canada has long been pushing Holocaust revisionism and honoring nazis before Ukraine was ever invaded by Russia, despite constant pushback from progressives and Jewish organizations.

 

Some of these monuments have been up since the 90s and been defended by local and provincial governments despite rolling outrage over them.

 

 

There's literally so many they have their own Wikipedia page!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorials_in_Canada_to_Nazis_and_Nazi_collaborators

 

Canada's nazi romanticism has been a conversation for decades ("Black Ribbon Day!!!") that trying to stifle and silence ongoing conversations under the guise that somehow it will impact public view of Ukraine against Russia's invasion is disingenuous. 

[suburbannature]

1 minute ago, Communion said:

It feels disingenuous to try and make any of this about the invasion of Ukraine given that Canada has long been pushing Holocaust revisionism and honoring nazis before Ukraine was ever invaded by Russia, despite constant pushback from progressives and Jewish organizations.

 

Some of these monuments have been up since the 90s and been defended by local and provincial governments despite rolling outrage over them.

 

 

There's literally so many they have their own Wikipedia page!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorials_in_Canada_to_Nazis_and_Nazi_collaborators

 

Canada's nazi romanticism has been a conversation for decades ("Black Ribbon Day!!!") that trying to stifle and silence ongoing conversations under the guise that somehow it will impact public view of Ukraine against Russia's invasion is disingenuous. 

I agree, but I feel that was the OP's objective in specifically naming Zelenskyy and that's why I responded how I did.

[Communion]

Apologies already being issued.

[Monday Night Messiah]

1 hour ago, suburbannature said:

I agree, but I feel that was the OP's objective in specifically naming Zelenskyy and that's why I responded how I did.

Because Zelenskyy was at this event, was one of the people who recognized and clapped for him. This whole Parliament stuff on September 22nd wouldn't have happened had Zelenskyy not arrived in Canada. So, yes, I named him. They were also claiming that this Nazi officer is a "Ukrainian hero."

[ClashAndBurn]

31 minutes ago, Communion said:

Apologies already being issued.

“There’s nothing to apologize for, because the Nazi collaborators were the heroes trying to save Ukraine from the true villains of the Soviet Union!”

 

9 minutes ago, Monday Night Messiah said:

Because Zelenskyy was at this event, was one of the people who recognized and clapped for him. This whole Parliament stuff on September 22nd wouldn't have happened had Zelenskyy not arrived in Canada. So, yes, I named him. They were also claiming that this Nazi officer is a "Ukrainian hero."

Ukraine literally recognizes Nazi collaborator Stepan Bandera as a national hero and commemorates him with a national holiday.

[Mean Trees]

That individual Rota or whatever needs to resign.

[playwithme]

Kremlin bots and genocide supporters had a field day with this, but Ukraine’s history is very complicated. Hunka was a member of the Galicia division that was fighting Bolsheviks on the eastern front, which were perceived as Ukraine’s main enemy after Ukraine endured a genocide (Holodomor) that has permanently ruined its demographics. They specifically didn’t fight British or French soldiers. The Galicia division hasn’t been convicted of any war crimes. So, the clickbaity framing “Nazi soldier” is a huge oversimplification, and it needs more nuance. After enduring Holodomor, some Ukrainians were collaborators during WWII because they perceived Bolsheviks as the bigger evil and saw the invasion as their chance to regain independence. Hence, I can totally see why some Ukrainians might view Hunka as independence fighter. Moreover, it was a mainstream ideology back then, and there was plenty of Nazi collaborators among Belorussians, Estonians, Hungarians, Romanians, Lithuanians, Latvians, and even some of the Jews. But, of course, Ukrainians are convenient scapegoats for Kremlin trolls while they are undergoing another genocide. 

[uusagii]

As expected from the PM of Indianada

[TasteOfYourLips]

17 hours ago, Dephira said:

For the love of god pick up a history book - sis, I….

You need to pick one up ASAP. Ukrainians weren't fighting against Nazis, they were fighting with Nazis during WWII. They commited majority of war crimes during Warsaw Uprising fighting against Poles with Germans.

 

OP: Pay attention how it's only Canadians apologizing not Ukrainians as per usual

[Kamil24]

not surprised

[ClashAndBurn]

6 hours ago, TasteOfYourLips said:

You need to pick one up ASAP. Ukrainians weren't fighting against Nazis, they were fighting with Nazis during WWII. They commited majority of war crimes during Warsaw Uprising fighting against Poles with Germans.

 

OP: Pay attention how it's only Canadians apologizing not Ukrainians as per usual

Not to mention the Ukraine apologists swearing up and down that the Nazis were the lesser evil  

[ZIVERT]

Tankies in this thread serving

 

[Monday Night Messiah]

1 hour ago, ZIVERT said:

Tankies in this thread serving

 

Doing a bit much. Literally nobody is saying that.