celeb news Billy Porter shares his issue with Harry Styles being the first solo man on Vogue

[Relampago.]

14 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said:

Yes because indigenous men get featured on the cover of Vogue so often. Bffr

??? What are these strawman arguments you’re building?  I get you’re Bully Porter’s biggest stan but being intentionally obtuse is not helping your case. 

 

You know exactly what I’m saying. Billy says “you’re using my community” which has to refer to gays and not the other queer members of the LGBTQ because he dragged non-binary people and given his history of standing on trans women’s shoulders. He implies that having a gay and only a gay was the right choice, and we all know it’s cause he wanted the cover but that’s not the way the cookie crumbles. 

 

He can want gay representation all he wants, but he can do so without being the star rep himself. Like would he have dragged Sam Smith too if he had gotten the cover? Probably. Cause it’s not Billy Porter on that cover.

[Escape]

Wasn't that cover several years ago?

[venuss]

The way some people abuse the dislike button when someone doesn't praise their fave 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by venuss
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[feelslikeadream]

I understand part of his critique, but what I don't really understand is what he would prefer Harry do instead; does he want him to be more traditionally masculine? If so, why? Why would a queer person want to uphold gender stereotypes?

[Gui Blackout]

1 minute ago, More Than A Melody said:

4. Harry is breaking gender roles. He's not a trailblazer, but he is breaking gender roles

Queer and gender nonconforming people are breaking gender roles. Harry Styles wearing a blouse and a pink suit is not. And that's the whole point here.

[More Than A Melody]

Just now, venuss said:

The way some people abouse the dislike button when someone doesn't like their fave 

 

 

 

 

 

I dislike comments I disagree with. The function the entire button was implemented for.

 

Perhaps keep your comment on topic, like, how the cover came out exactly 32 months ago and he's still talking about it, even though the last time he had to backtrack, for instance

[DoubleRainbow!]

Who asked 

[GraceRandolph]

2 minutes ago, feelslikeadream said:

I understand part of his critique, but what I don't really understand is what he would prefer Harry do instead; does he want him to be more traditionally masculine? If so, why? Why would a queer person want to uphold gender stereotypes?

He doesn’t have a problem with Harry dressing any way he wants, he is just using Harry as an EXAMPLE of a bigger issue. Why are people not getting this?

[GraceRandolph]

Just now, More Than A Melody said:

I dislike comments I disagree with. The function the entire button was implemented for.

 

Perhaps keep your comment on topic, like, how the cover came out exactly 32 months ago and he's still talking about it, even though the last time he had to backtrack, for instance

You’re abusing the feature. 

[Abracadabra]

1 minute ago, GraceRandolph said:

A lot of Gen Z act like Harry invented this though. 

Perhaps some, but I honestly think that's more of a narrative being set by people who are mad about him dressing this way while still leaving his sexuality ambiguous. Even if he is straight, the reaction he gets from some is interesting to me because there is such a long history of famous men doing the same thing yet it didn't get the same reaction. I get feeling frustrated that there are queer artists not getting the same attention or admiration, but lbr... Harry getting the cover of Vogue wasn't some act of disrespect or spite to the queer community, it's because he's one of the biggest stars in the world and would sell more magazines. That's just the reality of it. The media and fashion industry has also largely embraced artists like Sam Smith and Lil Nas X since they started dressing in a more gender-noncomforming way. If Billy Porter was as big of a star as Harry, they wouldn't have any qualms about putting him on the cover, they just want to sell magazines.

[More Than A Melody]

Just now, Gui Blackout said:

Queer and gender nonconforming people are breaking gender roles. Harry Styles wearing a blouse and a pink suit is not. And that's the whole point here.

Breaking gender roles means breaking gender roles.

 

It means not following gender roles. If a woman does something typically masculine, she's breaking gender roles. If a man does something typically feminine, he's breaking gender roles. Sexuality and gender of the person doing it have no correlation whatsoever with the action in and of itself. Prince broke gender roles and he was a straight man. 

[gotportugal]

49 minutes ago, LCTV said:

How to say " I'm just jealous Harry got the cover and I didn't " in a lamer way.

 

[Gui Blackout]

2 minutes ago, feelslikeadream said:

I understand part of his critique, but what I don't really understand is what he would prefer Harry do instead; does he want him to be more traditionally masculine? If so, why? Why would a queer person want to uphold gender stereotypes?

I don't think his critique, and many other people's as well, is not with what Harry wears, he can wear whatever he wants. The issue is with mainstream media raving and holding him in a pedestal while ignoring queer/gender nonconforming people who are actually doing the things.

[Bloo]

You can't argue for tearing down toxic masculinity and gatekeep which men are okay to step outside of traditional masculine gender expression.

[onapearl]

He has a point, but coming from him it comes off as him being jealous that he didn't get that spot instead.

[WEEKND]

Swallowing semen publicly on the Atlantis cruise wasn’t going to get him the cover and frankly neither is calling Anna a ***** 

[GraceRandolph]

Just now, Bloo said:

You can't argue for tearing down toxic masculinity and gatekeep which men are okay to step outside of traditional masculine gender expression.

That’s not the point Billy is making. Show me ONE TIME Billy ever said Harry shouldn’t step outside traditional masculine expression. He didn’t. He has a problem with the disproportionate attention and praise thrown Harry’s way for doing it compared to men like him. Is it gate keeping tearing down traditional masculine expression if you defend the average straight white guy being able to be the face of this?

[More Than A Melody]

1 minute ago, Gui Blackout said:

I don't think his critique, and many other people's as well, is not with what Harry wears, he can wear whatever he wants. The issue is with mainstream media raving and holding him in a pedestal while ignoring queer/gender nonconforming people who are actually doing the things.

He's critiquing Harry himself. He's saying that Harry is "using my community" while being straight. Even though

 

1. Harry never said he was straight, as a queer man, he shouldn't label someone's sexuality just for the sake of his own argument.

2. All Harry does is wear what he wants and make his little music. He a ton of money to LGBT charities and created a safe space for hundreds of thousands of LGBT fans. There's so many ways to ask for queer representation, but Billy doesn't care about queer representation, he just cares about Billy representation

[GraceRandolph]

1 minute ago, More Than A Melody said:

He's critiquing Harry himself. He's saying that Harry is "using my community" while being straight. Even though

 

1. Harry never said he was straight, as a queer man, he shouldn't label someone's sexuality just for the sake of his own argument.

2. All Harry does is wear what he wants and make his little music. He a ton of money to LGBT charities and created a safe space for hundreds of thousands of LGBT fans. There's so many ways to ask for queer representation, but Billy doesn't care about queer representation, he just cares about Billy representation

Do you think Harry would have as many fans if he came out as gay?

[starsailor]

[Bloo]

Just now, GraceRandolph said:

That’s not the point Billy is making. Show me ONE TIME Billy ever said Harry shouldn’t step outside traditional masculine expression. He didn’t. He has a problem with the disproportionate attention and praise thrown Harry’s way for doing it compared to men like him. Is it gate keeping tearing down traditional masculine expression if you defend the average straight white guy being able to be the face of this?

Unless I'm mistaken, this line feels directed at Harry:

Quote

You’re using my community – or your people are using my community – to elevate you. You haven’t had to sacrifice anything.

There is a very valid point about how the art and expression of marginalized communities get squandered or overlooked in favor of the majority. That's 100% true. However, I interpreted this comment in the OP as being directed at Harry which just feels like a misdirect. Regardless, Harry isn't a revolutionary and I don't think anyone else is calling him that. Simply acknowledging that he is defying gender roles doesn't mean he's a revolutionary because what he's doing now has been done ad nauseam by past artists (e.g., Elton John off the top of my head).

[Brunette Ambition]

he needs to get a job

[mystery]

Gee I wonder why Vogue would want superstar Harry Styles on their cover instead of Billy Porter... it has been years now it is time to let it go.

[feelslikeadream]

6 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said:

He doesn’t have a problem with Harry dressing any way he wants, he is just using Harry as an EXAMPLE of a bigger issue. Why are people not getting this?

 

4 minutes ago, Gui Blackout said:

I don't think his critique, and many other people's as well, is not with what Harry wears, he can wear whatever he wants. The issue is with mainstream media raving and holding him in a pedestal while ignoring queer/gender nonconforming people who are actually doing the things.

Hmm, OK, like I understand why he would take issue with Harry's reception and how his privilege essentially engenders that reception. But I also don't really think it's fair to say he has no issue with Harry when he says, "You’re using my community – or your people are using my community – to elevate you. You haven’t had to sacrifice anything."

 

Yes, the part inside the dashes speaks to forces outside of Harry personally, but he still very much calls Harry out specifically in this quote. And that part is weird to me. Harry has surely sacrificed "something" by his choices—he's a celebrity and requires goodwill from audiences, some of which he's certainly alienated through his choices (see: ATRL ). Regardless, Billy framing representation via degree of sacrifice just isn't a paradigm that really works for me.

[More Than A Melody]

Just now, GraceRandolph said:

Do you think Harry would have as many fans if he came out as gay?

Well, he's obviously not gay, so this is a moot point anyway. Most of his stans think he's some flavor of bi, and most people who just listen to his music casually (which are... most people, online fanbases represent a tiny minority) probably think he's straight.

 

IDK if he'd lose fans, honestly. Tyler The Creator thrived even more after coming out and his fanbase was more potentially toxic than Harry's. That has nothing to do with the idea of Harry "using" the LGBT community. IDK what he even meant by that, because he's talking about it in the context of getting the Vogue cover, and there's nothing inherently gay about being on the cover of Vogue nor are most consumers of Vogue Magazine gay men. All he did was wear a dress in the cover of Vogue, so in that context... how was that "using" the LGBT community? A man in a dress = gay? Since when?