base talk Taylor Swift's rival in commercial success is only The Beatles, agree?

[JaXXXon]

6 minutes ago, The Music Industry said:

That's such a funny, immature and totally ignorant and uniformed meme all at once. Like, the girl released three albums in the past 12 months and people track how many times her music was listened to privately at home and those same albums were purchased in additional separate copies which also included numerous variants and special editions while other artists from the past released ONE version and only one purchase of that album counted towards the sales while their private listening sessions were unaccounted for in a market where 50% of people pirated ILLEGAL copies that never counted towards album sales and here you are claiming that's nonsense. You need to grow up. 

Edited November 4, 2023 by JaXXXon

[Cruel Summer]

6 minutes ago, LittleStarmen said:

So a person using spotify for FREE listening to  Bad Blood generetes revenue? And we wanna pretend that equals some kind of sale? This is just too arbitrary. 

 

There is just no comparison between these eras. They wont rot away because the sucess of these past music are still here

 

regarding netfliz they paid their 15 usd subscription and may have clicked on the film and watched a few minutes resulting in a view/sale but thats still nor comparable to someone going to theatre and laying 15 bucks to watch on movie

 

If a person is listening for free, their streams are paid for by ad revenue or by a sponsoring entity (for example, Apple Music pays the royalties themselves during a free trial). Someone is still paying. 

[flashfox]

Disagree

[LittleStarmen]

I bought one copy of Confessions On A Dance Floor in 2005. Listened to death but it counted as one copy.

 

Since I subscribed to spotify I probably listened to equivalent of 15 copies of the same album since I still love it.

 

But now my consumer unit number is multplied by dozens.

 

Therefore its not comparable

[The Music Industry]

1 minute ago, JaXXXon said:

That's such a funny, immature and totally ignorant and uniformed meme all at once. Like, the girl released three albums in the past 12 months and people track how many times her music was listened to privately at home and those same albums were purchased in additional separate copies which also included numerous variants and special editions while other artists from the past released ONE version and only one purchase of that album counted towards the sales while their private listening sessions were unaccounted for in a market where 50% of people pirated ILLEGAL copies that never counted towards album sales and here you are claiming that's nonsense. You need to grow up. 

Piracy only became prominent in the late 1990s and 2000s, especially with the digital sales era. Y'all need to stop acting as if there were no gimmicks or payola in the 70s, 80s, 90s to boost sales numbers. It's absolutely ridiculous to pretend that  If anything, payola was way more generalized and accepted back then. The 4 biggest instances of payola being exposed to the public happened in 1954, 1974, 1990 and 2004. Y'all just need to find a better excuse than "Spotify payola!" and "multiple versions!!!!" to justify Taylor's success. Other artists are also on Spotify. Other artists also release multiple versions. Does that help them achieve a quarter of the current success Taylor has? 

[Cruel Summer]

Just now, LittleStarmen said:

I bought one copy of Confessions On A Dance Floor in 2005. Listened to death but it counted as one copy.

 

Since I subscribed to spotify I probably listened to equivalent of 15 copies of the same album since I still love it.

 

But now my consumer unit number is multplied by dozens.

 

Therefore its not comparable

You would have to have listened to tracks from that album about 23,000 times for that to be true, and that’s assuming you are not on a tier with ads. The average music consumer today will never contribute even a single album equivalent unit to most of the albums they hear in their lifetime, let alone multiple, via streaming.

[The Music Industry]

25 minutes ago, JaXXXon said:

I remember back in 2022 a while after Taylor had released Folklore and Evermore she had 44 million monthly listeners and Gaga - who had just released Hold My Hand - had 41 million monthly listeners 

This never happened

[FailSafe]

At least the HAG generation can't **** to the new generation now. Oldies kept on saying "back in my day, real music was like this and that" or "this *insert artist name* was everywhere, s/he's the biggest musician, sad that new generation can't produce such musicians"

 

Well guess what HAGS? Miss Taylor Swift OUTACCLAIMED, OUTAWARDED AND OUTSOLD your HAG favs and will continue to do so for decades to come 

 

[LittleStarmen]

Also so many places have spotify instead of radio playing in the background and those are being counted as sales too...

[The Music Industry]

5 minutes ago, LittleStarmen said:

Also so many places have spotify instead of radio playing in the background and those are being counted as sales too...

So why is only Taylor Swift rivaling the biggest legends if everyone's music is being played in the background and streams are so accessible

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by The Music Industry

[fijitears]

I feel she’s in her own lane tbh, but definitely not commercially higher than The Beatles and Michael Jackson. Absolutely not.

 

If anything, Taylor’s exposure mirrors that of Justin Bieber’s 2009 - 2015 eras aka “Bieber Fever”. 

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by fijitears
typo

[LittleStarmen]

5 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said:

You would have to have listened to tracks from that album about 23,000 times for that to be true, and that’s assuming you are not on a tier with ads. The average music consumer today will never contribute even a single album equivalent unit to most of the albums they hear in their lifetime, let alone multiple, via streaming.

so 1533 song streams equals one sale? 

Thats low. Id probably counted as 3 sales on the year i bought the album then... and now you can just auto play it even easier

[LittleStarmen]

2 minutes ago, The Music Industry said:

So why is only Taylor Swift rivalling the biggest legends if everyone's music is being played in the background and streams are so accessible

 

Shes not rivalling any legend but she's the biggest artist of right now.

 

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by LittleStarmen

[Both Sides Now]

Its true 

[The Music Industry]

Just now, LittleStarmen said:

Shes not rivalling any legend but shes the biggest artist of right now.

Me when I refuse to admit reality 

 

[Cruel Summer]

And I mean, when we talk about how Taylor compares to older artists commercially, if we’re going to talk about the problems of the modern album equivalent unit, let’s also talk about how before 1991, all sales across the American music industry were self-reported by vendors and stores, sometimes on literal phone calls asking how the latest albums were selling at Joe’s Record Shack. Let’s talk about how all countries were on that kind of system for some time or another. Let’s talk about inflated certifications, even more inflated press release claims, deep discounts, music clubs, and more. Let’s talk about how even today, pure sales numbers from Luminate are actually calculations that use weighted averages to help cover retailers that don’t directly report to them. No era of music has perfect stats. It’s all a disaster, and yet we can still do something to compare over time.

[Both Sides Now]

To add to this: nobody has ever had their albums chart in the Top 10 years after their release. She is in a league of her own. To compare her to Justin Bieber is ludicrous. She is a giant. 

[Taylena]

6 minutes ago, LittleStarmen said:

Shes not rivalling any legend but shes the biggest artist of right now.

Many music experts and even major publications have said that Taylor has surpassed legends like Madonna or MJ but if user LittleStarmen on ATRL.net says NO then it's a NO.   

Edited November 4, 2023 by Taylena

[LittleStarmen]

2 minutes ago, Taylena said:

Many music experts and even major publications have said that Taylor has surpassed legends like Madonna or MJ but if user LittleStarmen on ATRL.net says NO then it's a NO.   

surpassed in what?

[Cruel Summer]

Now, to actually answer the thread: in the US, yes, this is true. She is the one artist who is most likely to break some of their storied, longstanding chart records, because she is an unparalleled commercial force. On a global scale, she has a ways to go, and both Madonna and Michael Jackson, as well as Queen and Elvis, have titanic overall consumption that she’ll eventually have to contend with. It will take a long time, but she could make it to that level on an overall global scale eventually.

[The Music Industry]

2 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said:

And I mean, when we talk about how Taylor compares to older artists commercially, if we’re going to talk about the problems of the modern album equivalent unit, let’s also talk about how before 1991, all sales across the American music industry were self-reported by vendors and stores, sometimes on literal phone calls asking how the latest albums were selling at Joe’s Record Shack. Let’s talk about how all countries were on that kind of system for some time or another. Let’s talk about inflated certifications, even more inflated press release claims, deep discounts, music clubs, and more. Let’s talk about how even today, pure sales numbers from Luminate are actually calculations that use weighted averages to help cover retailers that don’t directly report to them. No era of music has perfect stats. It’s all a disaster, and yet we can still do something to compare over time.

Let's also not forget about club sales in the 80s and 90s, where you could literally get records for a few cents and it would count towards the album's units

 

[Taylena]

45 minutes ago, Eternium said:

Spotify in 2020 legalized payola. They now autoplay songs after people play other songs and if an artist chooses to take fewer royalties, they can get their songs autoplayed. After Spotify introduced this feature in 2020, certain artists received a massive jump in success on streaming. While payola on radio has been common in the past, it never counted for album charts before. Now, artists like Drake, BTS and Taylor Swift are using it to manipulate charts.

 

That’s why Taylor Swift went from being a Spotify flop to doing better on Spotify since 2020 despite Midnights, Evermore and that Phoebe Bridgers album being declines with the GP while actual hits like Reputation and 1989 couldn’t score Spotify hits to save their lives.

Is this Spotify payola also the reason why she's the only one selling 1M+ physical albums in 2023? 

[FailSafe]

10 minutes ago, fijitears said:

I feel she’s in her own lane tbh, but definitely not commercially higher than The Beatles and Michael Jackson. Absolutely not.

 

If anything, Taylor’s commercial success mirrors that of Justin Bieber’s 2009 - 2015 eras aka “Bieber Fever”. 

 

Last time I check, Bieber wasn't selling more than  250k albums on a weekly basis (in a single market)  for an entire year during his peak

 

 

 

[LittleStarmen]

This is insane talking if anything she probably has similar Adele 2012 numbers

[fijitears]

Just now, FailSafe said:

Last time I check, Bieber wasn't selling more than  250k albums on a weekly basis (in a single market)  for an entire year during his peak

 

 

 

I meant exposure wise.

 

Taylor is not toe to toe with The Beatles or Michael Jackson and that’s just common sense, no hater ****.

 

I said what I said