Communion Posted October 3 Posted October 3 2 hours ago, Blade said: This reads as "ARE YOU ACTUALLY SAYING ____" when it was meant as a regular q btw I mean, in even the clip that Blue MAGA twitter is sharing, the literal quote is: Q: [lists several names involved in January 6th and their prison terms ranging from 18 years, 22 years, etc.]. Why should [the people referenced] serve longer terms than actual nazis*? As president, would you commute, if not completely pardon, all non-violent January 6th protestors? *-This is some obscure comparison of January 6th convictions to the Nuremberg trials and you're more than free to think the interviewer herself is unserious. A: "I would have to look at, look more carefully at their actual charges. When I look at January 6th, it was dangerous. People broke laws. They should be held accountable for breaking the law. Whether the sentences were reasonable, I'd had to dive more into the weed than I have done." She then begins the following sentence: "I see that a lot around January 6th as being blown up for political reasons". The clip that purposefully cuts off to avoid the literal next sentence. "Not that January 6th wasn't a harmless event. It was a serious and problematic event." Stein then goes on to say her view is that the more serious issue is campaign finance laws and getting money out of politics to begin addressing why people can be so easily persuaded into thinking elections could be rigged and fake despite the mountain of evidence we have - evidence Stein herself helped come into reality -that our elections are secure.
Blade Posted October 3 Posted October 3 Those stupid dock workers asking for a 77% increase when they ALREADY MAKE OVER SIX FIGURES Hopefully they accept the 62% being offered in the new proposal 1 2
Blade Posted October 3 Posted October 3 2 minutes ago, Vermillion said: I want her to not alienate Arab American voters as much as the next guy but it should be noted that Biden won this demographic by like 18ish pts An 18 pt shift of 2-3% of the electorate is a max 0.5% shift. Not nothing and possible decisive if Harris collapses elsewhere 3 1
GhostBox Posted October 3 Posted October 3 (edited) Listen I don't like Liz just as much as the next Democrat but she has the courage to come out and support Kamala Harris. That's brave for a conservative from her state to do. For that and just that we can be thankful for. Nothing else about her. As if her career wasn't over enough her supporting Harris seals the deal. 🤷 Edited October 3 by GhostBox 1
ClashAndBurn Posted October 3 Posted October 3 1 minute ago, GhostBox said: Listen I don't like Liz just as much as the next Democrat but she has the courage to come out and support Kamala Harris. That's brave for a conservative from her state to do. For that and just that we can be thankful for. Nothing else about her. A dog her career wasn't over enough her supporting Harris seals the deal. 🤷 Not necessarily. Harris did say she would be willing to appoint Republicans to her cabinet, and Liz Cheney might be the furthest left cabinet member she's allowed to appoint by a Rick Scott-led Senate. 1
Communion Posted October 3 Posted October 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, shelven said: She doesn't explicitly say "I'm open to pardoning the J6ers", but when asked if she's open to pardoning them or commuting their sentences, she gives a long word salad about how it depends and she'd have to review all their charges to decide if it would be fair to pardon/commute them. She then does literally say the quote in the caption about how parts of J6 have been blown up for political purposes. Like I'm sorry, but this repeated "here's what she REALLY meant!" defense is getting very old very quickly and it's literally what both Trump supporters do and what Biden supporters were doing back when they tried to defend his nonstop cognitive decline moments. It was annoying gaslighting when Trump and Biden supporters did it and it's annoying gaslighting when Stein supporters do it. And I'd like to think I'm not a hypocrite on this because I have spent literal years on this forum calling out Biden's cognitive decline in the face of defenders who tried to explain "what he really meant" (and it goes without saying I obviously despise MAGAts who do that for Trump's defense too). At a certain point, you have to start taking people's intentions at face value when they say and do nonsense things. This is the same woman who was liking social media comments a few weeks ago that point blank said that voting for Trump was still a preferable option to letting Harris win if someone doesn't want to directly vote for Stein. She's made it very clear she does not take the threat of Trump seriously. She has legitimate, valid reasons to be against the Democratic Party because of how they've treated the Green Party's ballot access attempts, but I don't get why people feel the need to keep defending her actively boosting MAGA talking points as part of that, unless my previous post is right and those defenders also actively want to see Harris lose to Trump as a "told you so" moment. Again, I'm sorry, but this is just not legitimate of a talking point. I want to take you as acting in good faith but the dissonance between the reality of words vs what you feel Stein is secretly saying raises questions. You're arguing that it is others having to infer that Stein "ACTUALLY meant this or that" but.. that's what you're doing. You're now found arguing that words you think were said - but weren't actually said - don't matter cause she's actually secretly speaking in dog whistles and innuendo. That her literal calls of January 6th as dangerous and a violation of law don't mean those literal words but actually mean some secret hand signal to Republicans. It's Contrapoints-ified liberal politics taken to a silly degree. It's the kind of politics Warren-over-Sanders supporters in 2020 did where there's some cultural, partisan bounds to progressive liberals wrt just how far left they will go. Left enough to be progressive, but within the bounds of what intra-party politics deem as respectable leftism. It reads as you being frustrated at not hearing certain things from Stein. And I would be sympathetic - you certainly don't have to vote for her - if that the posturing didn't feel dishonest. Cause much of it feels no different than the kind of criticisms used when trying to ostracize Sanders in 2016 from Dem intra-party politics for not following a script. The anger feels no different in character than instances where Sanders would: get asked some silly question on if he condemned all of Trump's supporters following Clinton's "basket of deplorable" gaffe; instead of doubling down on saying voting for Trump made someone irredeemably racist like Dems were encouraged to do, he would simply say he hopes progressive economic policy could reach people being fooled by a racist like Trump; and the Dem reaction was that this was ACTUALLY Bernie's secret endorsement for Trump supporters to be racist. It's clear some people will view Stein as "right-wing" if she doesn't preface her entire campaign with the disclaimer of "we'll run... up until the point it hurts Kamala but then we'll drop out of it does hurt her cause Trump 100% must lose and we will step up if Harris doesn't bother to win voters" and I just don't think that's a serious nor realistic view to hold. It's a partisan loyalty that betrays intellectual honesty. Again, I would agree with that very moral absolutism... if it wasn't coming from those who find themselves casting a vote for a genocider come November 5th and not aware of the irony at hand. Just like I would have been more sympathetic to "BERNIE CONDONES RACISM!!" reactions in 2016 if it wasn't coming from those supporting Hillary "Super Predators" Clinton. I just don't think one can identify as both a Dem loyalist and a progressive because - at some point down the line - progress for poor people will require interrogating Democrats and their role in people's suffering. One just can't credibly articulate fears that Stein is secretly a right-winger while themselves voting for a right-wing Kamala. I don't know how else to say it. You're free to post whatever you want of course. But I'm also going to continue to point out things like *re-reads* when the words being reacted to are literally are not in the video. Edited October 3 by Communion 2
Bears01 Posted October 3 Posted October 3 22 minutes ago, Blade said: Those stupid dock workers asking for a 77% increase when they ALREADY MAKE OVER SIX FIGURES Hopefully they accept the 62% being offered in the new proposal I'm always as pro union as it can get (I'm literally in one) but….yeah 3 1
Popular Post shelven Posted October 3 Popular Post Posted October 3 1 minute ago, Communion said: it reads as you being frustrated at not hearing certain things from Stein. I'm frankly not interested in repeating what's essentially the same back and forth that took place in here a few weeks ago when Stein liked a comment that explicitly encouraged people to vote for Trump as a preferable alternative to letting Harris win, so I'm not going to, but just to clarify this one point: no, I am very much frustrated at the things I literally heard her say with my own ears. I do not think anyone who considers themselves a good-faith presidential candidate should be feeding into MAGA rhetoric about how "parts of J6 are being blown up for political reasons", and the fact that she included a "...but I promise I think it was dangerous!" or randomly pivoted into money in politics doesn't save that for me. I also don't think anyone who considers themselves a good-faith presidential candidate should be giving an "I'd have to look into it more" answer to whether the J6ers should have their sentences commuted. She literally said both those things and your own transcript reply to Blade contains those statements. So no, this isn't about what "I didn't hear her say", and I'd appreciate not being gaslit when I wrote the post you're quoting immediately after listening to the full video. At a certain point, if you find yourself accusing literally every single frequent poster in this thread of acting in bad faith and being dishonest, maybe it's a case of projection? 14 4
FameFatale Posted October 3 Posted October 3 @Vermillion I'm still going route 1. The timing, the context.. etc is odd. Of pieces out the book to put out, THAT is what she chose to bring attention to. If it was route 2 I don't think she'd still be doing interviews putting him a positive light. Do I think she can't stand the man and they don't live together? Yes. But I think she's as slimy as he is and still would do or say anything for check for the campaign. Ex- the log cabin speaking appearance. 1
Communion Posted October 3 Posted October 3 (edited) Like I'm sorry but this encapsulates the irony and issue: Those outside of the Democratic Party framework but squarely on the left - whether it be independent Bernie Sanders of 2016 or Jill Stein - will be put to random, arbitrary tests by people who are Dem party loyalists before they are progressives. For Sanders to not explicitly say all Trump supporters are racist, is to endorse racism. For Stein not to say she's dedicated to Harris winning, is to endorse Trump winning. But Kamala? Take warmth in her silence. Take her silence on murdered Palestinians as care for those same Palestinians. Take her calls for military strikes as calls for peace. Even when she says she doesn't want what you want, reassure yourself that she secretly does want what you hope for.. whatever it is. Edited October 3 by Communion 6
Sannie Posted October 3 Posted October 3 If Melania wants us to believe her, she should divorce Trump lol.
anti-bitch Posted October 3 Posted October 3 39 minutes ago, Blade said: Those stupid dock workers asking for a 77% increase when they ALREADY MAKE OVER SIX FIGURES Hopefully they accept the 62% being offered in the new proposal No, it's not stupid to ask for more money. If anything, other unions should be encouraged to ask for more too. There is no shortage of money at the corporate level in America. It's sad to see working people kind of fighting with each other when actually the real problem is the employers not paying people what they deserve. 4
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