base talk Are Diana, Cher and Barbra the trinity?

[Planet Mars]

Just looking comprehensively into Queer iconography as it existed in the 70's and 80's they are almost ubiquitous.

 

From the Drag scene, to Gay Clubs and even revolutionary movements and the fight toward autonomy they always seem to be come up.

 

I understand this applies mainly to gay men of the baby boom generation, but they seem to be the IT girls of vintage queerness/gay standom. Basically the mothers than birthed gay Fandom and devout Diva devotion.

 

Thoughts?

[LegaMyth]

Um, how do you mention 70s and 80s Queer culture and not mention Donna Summer?

[Dante Silva]

5 minutes ago, LegaMyth said:

Um, how do you mention 70s and 80s Queer culture and not mention Donna Summer?

Exactly! Thread must have been created by a foetus.

[Josh]

7 minutes ago, LegaMyth said:

Um, how do you mention 70s and 80s Queer culture and not mention Donna Summer?

Isn't she homophobic? 

[LegaMyth]

7 minutes ago, Josh said:

Isn't she homophobic? 

No, she is not.

[Dante Silva]

12 minutes ago, Josh said:

Isn't she homophobic? 

No

[Mean Trees]

Anyone remember that Queen of Pop family tree? I think both Diana and Cher were on it as the originators so I guess this isn't far off.

[PopKills]

31 minutes ago, LegaMyth said:

Um, how do you mention 70s and 80s Queer culture and not mention Donna Summer?

Right? Bad Girl is like the original blueprint for pop girl eras. 

[Princess Aurora]

Where's Donna Summer? 

[Kimi]

i don't think 60s cher was a gay icon

[Elusive Chanteuse]

Replace Cher with Donna Summer. A large chunk of Cher's discography is terrible, flopped and out of print.

 

[holyground13]

Those three are definitely influential but also Donna Summer, Tina Turner and Olivia Newton-John from around that time period. Also actresses such as Judy Garland before that.

[DonnaSpring]

Please no

 

Diana Ross, Donna Sunmer and Olivia Newton John 

 

Cher is much more a gay icon from 90s and in the 1970s and 1980s her career had more flops that hits 

 

Barbara is more one for the straights 

[DonnaSpring]

Donna Summer Bad girls changed how an era was to be seen, smash singles, smash album, hit after hit, grammy noms, it truely set new heights of what an era can achieve 

 

 

[nicaindo]

in the sense of english speakers gay icons (not only political speakers) I see Diana, Donna, Tina, Barbra, Patti, Olivia, Cher, Liza, Bette Middler... 

[DonnaSpring]

Olivia Newton John the original crossover artist

 

the inspiration for Taylor Swift, she went from smashing in the country genre to record breaking sucess with totally hot and physical eras 

 

physical spent 10 weeks a number 1, unheard of at the time 

 

Diana Ross, the beyonce blueprint, breaking out from a mega successful girl group to a equally mega successful solo career 

[Capris Groove]

Giving Barbra to the 60s, the late 60s is when she hit her absolute peak.

 

And that means Donna Summer goes to the 70s, and frankly she's in first place. The first female pop star and that's on period.

[constantinople]

The pentagram 

Barbra, Cher, Diana, Donna and Olivia Newton-John

[Dante Silva]

Judy Garland was the original. Her role as Dorothy in "The Wizard of Oz" remains iconic to this day.

 

The scene of her singing "Over the Rainbow" gave birth to the (pre-Stonewall) gay movement and provided an entire generation of gay men and women with life.

 

For generations, the term "Are you a friend of Dorothy?" was used as code to let "inverts" (as gays were sometimes known then) recognize each other in a predominantly straight social landscape where being gay could be a sin punishable by beatings or social banishment.

 

(Yes, there was also the 'hanky code,' but that's specific to sex acts and not relevant in the context of this particular discussion).

 

The phrase "Are you a friend of Dorothy?" was asked through the shutters of unlicensed gay venues (which, back then, were all gay venues) to patrons who hoped to be admitted to gay clubs.

 

If you either didn't know the code or replied "No," the shutter would be shut in your face, and you would not be admitted. That is how iconic Judy Garland's role as Dorothy was to the gay community.

 

Ariana's latest film role visits this same universe, and none of you seem to realize the symbolism or gay patriotism inherent in that role as the female lead of a movie set in the Oz universe.

 

There is also the evolution of generational 'Blondes' who have passed the baton to each other down the generational line, from Marilyn Monroe through Nancy Sinatra through Debbie Harry through Madonna through Lady Gaga.

 

20th-century gay (and pop) culture cannot be condensed down to just three or four divas; it was a lot more multifaceted than that.

 

Even the Apple symbol has roots in gay culture, as the bite is symbolic of Alan Turing (the inventor of the computer, who also happened to be gay). He took a bite from an apple injected with poison to escape a life of enforced chemical castration, which was a punishment after being entrapped by police and identified as a practicing homosexual in the 1950s.

 

Edited November 10 by Dante Silva

[Planet Mars]

3 hours ago, LegaMyth said:

Um, how do you mention 70s and 80s Queer culture and not mention Donna Summer?

She's later than the 3 I mentioned.

 

1 hour ago, DonnaSpring said:

Please no

 

Diana Ross, Donna Sunmer and Olivia Newton John 

 

Cher is much more a gay icon from 90s and in the 1970s and 1980s her career had more flops that hits 

 

Barbara is more one for the straights 

On what planet exactly? 

[DonnaSpring]

17 minutes ago, Planet Mars said:

She's later than the 3 I mentioned.

 

On what planet exactly? 

Donna summer started releasing music in 1968

[Vixen Eyes]

4 hours ago, Josh said:

Isn't she homophobic? 

 

4 hours ago, LegaMyth said:

No, she is not.

 

3 hours ago, Dante Silva said:

No

to clarify what i think @Josh is thinking about

 

In the mid-1980s, Summer was embroiled in a controversy when she allegedly made anti-gay remarks about the relatively new disease AIDS. Summer publicly denied ever making such comments and in a letter to the AIDS campaign group ACT UP in 1989 said it was "a terrible misunderstanding". In explaining why she had not responded to ACT UP sooner, Summer stated, "I was unknowingly protected by those around me from the bad press and hate letters. If I have caused you pain, forgive me." She closed her letter with Bible quotes (from Chapter 13 of 1 Corinthians).[51]

In 1989, Summer told The Advocate magazine, "A couple of the people I write with are gay and they have been ever since I met them. What people want to do with their bodies is their personal preference".[52] A few years later, she filed a lawsuit against New York magazine when it printed an old story about the rumors as fact, just as she was about to release her album Mistaken Identity in 1991.[53] According to a Biography television program dedicated to Summer in which she participated in 1995, the lawsuit was settled out of court although neither side wanted to divulge any details.[54][55]

[Josh]

1 minute ago, Vixen Eyes said:

 

 

to clarify what i think @Josh is thinking about

 

In the mid-1980s, Summer was embroiled in a controversy when she allegedly made anti-gay remarks about the relatively new disease AIDS. Summer publicly denied ever making such comments and in a letter to the AIDS campaign group ACT UP in 1989 said it was "a terrible misunderstanding". In explaining why she had not responded to ACT UP sooner, Summer stated, "I was unknowingly protected by those around me from the bad press and hate letters. If I have caused you pain, forgive me." She closed her letter with Bible quotes (from Chapter 13 of 1 Corinthians).[51]

In 1989, Summer told The Advocate magazine, "A couple of the people I write with are gay and they have been ever since I met them. What people want to do with their bodies is their personal preference".[52] A few years later, she filed a lawsuit against New York magazine when it printed an old story about the rumors as fact, just as she was about to release her album Mistaken Identity in 1991.[53] According to a Biography television program dedicated to Summer in which she participated in 1995, the lawsuit was settled out of court although neither side wanted to divulge any details.[54][55]

glad to know she isn't homophobic

[jdanton2]

1 hour ago, DonnaSpring said:

Donna summer started releasing music in 1968

Donna  did not have her first  hit until 1975. Barbra , Cher and Diana had their first hits in the mid 60's.

Edited November 10 by jdanton2

[Planet Mars]

1 hour ago, DonnaSpring said:

Donna summer started releasing music in 1968

Stop being obtuse, the three aforementioned women were global superstars by 1968 (at least in the case of Barbra and Diana)

 

Donna did not become a superstar until the mid-70's with LTLYB at which point Diana and Barbra were still red hot. 

 

Yes she eclipsed them during the late 70's, but even by 1980 ( with the Guilty and Diana albums) they were basically on the same playing field (and definitely the bigger stars lbr)

Edited November 10 by Planet Mars