NEX Posted June 16 Author Posted June 16 10 minutes ago, More Than A Melody said: See, I think she probably uses a thesaurus as well, or something to that effect, but I don't think her vocabulary in interviews is bad or that it should be similar to the way she writes. I'm not an eloquent speaker but I am an eloquent writer (in English not so much, but I'm great in Spanish lol). I have a pretty ample vocabulary in my native language but I don't necessarily employ it when I'm just talking. It's like judging someone's grammar by looking at their WhatsApp messages. I don't really get this argument. I think she uses a thesaurus because she didn't use to write like this and she started to use purposefully complicated wording after Folkmore. It's like she thinks she has to. She used to write very compellingly but using less overcomplicated words, and that was the case until her mid to late 20s, so it doesn't really make any sense that so deep into her adulthood she just switched with no reason. She admitted that sometimes she'd come across words that she likes the look/sound of and would put them into her notepad. Then later she'd think of ways in which she could incorporate them into a song. I guess the result is the purposefully complicated lyrics in her recent songs like "rivulets", "soliloquies", "clandestine" etc. Sometimes it works, most times I think it doesn't.
Asscatchem Posted June 16 Posted June 16 i dont agree with everyone dragging you. you obviously care about pop culture and have a good sense of criticism. 11
Wicked Posted June 16 Posted June 16 4 minutes ago, Asscatchem said: i dont agree with everyone dragging you. you obviously care about pop culture and have a good sense of criticism. Its a refreshing thread actually talking about one of the elements of music and its in depth. 3 5
Klein Posted June 16 Posted June 16 (edited) 21 minutes ago, NEX said: Darling, you were the first person to derail this thread with your opening statement, which had nothing to do with my reasons for making this thread - I wanted to make it for a while now (same as my review thread, which is coming soon™). What I said in the TTPD album thread was "legacy isn't only about numbers and that the entire TTPD ordeal is damaging to her legacy", which I don't think was that bad, but of course those remarks were seen as highly inflammatory and unbearable. The entire album thread has become truly unbearable at this point. I did not even react to your post in the album thread, I didn't respond, and did not even react to a post quoting you. I fundamentally disagree that TTPD will be damaging her legacy though, and the reason I didn't respond is because I think enough people came for you already. The real world doesn't care for the online discourse we have on this website. Otherwise, female artists wouldn't struggle this much and would dominate every discussion. In the real world, people are either listening to her music because they like it or they don't. Sure they might stumble upon one or two articles dragging Taylor for her antics, but what they will remember most is the hundreds of thousands articles that are being released praising her with a much bigger reach (albeit, most of them are about The Eras Tour and Taylormania). At most, if the public doesn't like it, TTPD will become forgotten over the years. But the general overwhelming praise alongside popularity that Taylor has been receiving since 2022 will be what people will remember of the first half of this decade. Not that she released many variants which is something only stans will remember, if even them. And for an artist still in her prime like Taylor, there's also a very good chance that the critical acclaim of this record will come in hindsight once people stop being so insane with everything that surrounds her. That has already happened with Reputation after all. Edited June 16 by Klein 2 1
NEX Posted June 16 Author Posted June 16 19 minutes ago, Wicked said: Its a refreshing thread actually talking about one of the elements of music and its in depth. Wait until you see my actual review of the album. You'll need a cup of tea for that
leonbotstein Posted June 16 Posted June 16 I've never heard the album, so this is quite shocking. You've done a service to those who weren't aware of the level this has reached... 1 2
georgechxng Posted June 16 Posted June 16 witness writing sounds decent in comparison to the writing on this disgrace of an album…. it's bad for her
georgechxng Posted June 16 Posted June 16 you forgot the infamous "and all my friends smell like weed or little babies" i get what she tried to convey in terms of that awkward confusing stage that people seems to go thru during their early 30s where things are starting to change drastically while some stays the same but that's such an awful cringe way to try to describe that 5
Wicked Posted June 16 Posted June 16 15 minutes ago, NEX said: Wait until you see my actual review of the album. You'll need a cup of tea for that 1
Matchatea Posted June 16 Posted June 16 I think that the album shoot its self in the foot is with the atheistics. The theme and album cover makes it where the album is deep and must be taken seriously. So when you hear clunky or cringe lyrics though out a serious album, especially when you put emphasis on the importance of lyricism as the theme as well as title, it's hard not to be judgmental. I think if she made sure people were on the joke and how the album is a overdramatize version of her self and her feelings, I would be willing to give these lyrics more grace. But honestly this album is her weakest lyrically and production wise, which is sad as I loved her albums in the past. 2 1
Erreur2 La Nature Posted June 16 Posted June 16 I do not even enjoy Taylor Swift's music but this is some sick level of obsession. 1 1
NEX Posted June 16 Author Posted June 16 1 hour ago, Klein said: I did not even react to your post in the album thread, I didn't respond, and did not even react to a post quoting you. I fundamentally disagree that TTPD will be damaging her legacy though, and the reason I didn't respond is because I think enough people came for you already. It's honestly not about that post. I've been getting downvoted and attacked in that thread since release week. What was more significant for me is her behaviour during Billie's release week. That was honestly nasty, no way around it. I never identified as a Swiftie, but I always caucused with Swifties in a way that Bernie does with the Democrats in Senate. But it's just impossible to defend her now. And there were many defections from actual Swifties in recent weeks, and you can also easily gauge the overall mood on this forum - it went from mostly positive and supportive to overwhelmingly negative even from those who were once allies. I'm noticing similar trends on non-stan social media and also in real life. So you can't say that this album hasn't been damaging to her career/image/legacy etc. It's just these things don't immediately play out and it will take at least a couple of years for the dust to settle and reveal the actual damage. Of course she could course correct like she did with Lover>Folklore, but it will be a lot lot harder this time around because she created for herself this image of evil/greedy/ruthless/mean girl now. Reputation TV won't fix that. 1 hour ago, georgechxng said: you forgot the infamous "and all my friends smell like weed or little babies" i get what she tried to convey in terms of that awkward confusing stage that people seems to go thru during their early 30s where things are starting to change drastically while some stays the same but that's such an awful cringe way to try to describe that I didn't include that line because it's rather simple and straightforward. It does sound a little jarring though, so I can see arguments for potentially including it as well.
Into The Void Posted June 16 Posted June 16 6 hours ago, NEX said: . 2. We declared Charlie Puth should be a bigger artist - terrible line and simply doesn't work even if we pretend they declared that while they were high The man who produced Harleys In Hawaii deserves his flowers 💐 6
MusicLoverDude Posted June 16 Posted June 16 While I do agree some lyrics on the album are very clunky, a lot of the ones in your OP aren't bad. So Long, London is pretty weak though. A track #5 that pales in comparison to several of the past ones. 1
Green Posted June 16 Posted June 16 Who's afraid of little old ME!?" YOU SHOULD BE, YOU SHOULD BE, YOU SHOULD BE
Luckitty Posted June 16 Posted June 16 the way she takes viral slangs and quotes from twitter and use them in her lyrics
Tylerbv Posted June 16 Posted June 16 5 hours ago, Badgalbriel said: But haters are indeed too dumb to understand it lol It's not difficult to understand. It's just bad. 4
JoeAg Posted June 16 Posted June 16 9 hours ago, punisher said: so cringe when she does this... good songwriting is not about knowing the biggest words lmao literally!! as a songwriter it's lowkey something we all go through. like dgmw I'm a 27 year old and I've been writing songs for 19 years and I still find myself looking at my lyrics from the past 7 years and being like "mkay nope that's unnecessarily verbose I need to cut that sh*t out" and then using maybe 2 or 3 big vocab words in a song but not in the same f*cking line. but Taylor does it so much nowadays and people are like "omg her growth she's so brilliant!" like… wait'll they find out about Joanna Newsom and Kate Bush and how they EFFORTLESSLY sound intelligent and natural in their lyrics. this^ is more tryhard imo it's just something that should be done sparingly, and not just in songs about love. I like being unnecessarily verbose in songs about like… familial trauma or existential crises or dreams. i think as a songwriter, Taylor should expand upon the directions she was going with Folklore and Evermore, where she was doing vignettes that weren't always necessarily just about HER. more Sevens and Dorotheas and Epiphanies please! 4
PoisonedIvy Posted June 16 Posted June 16 The album has great lyrics outside of your cherry picking, but I'm sure you already know that
JoeAg Posted June 16 Posted June 16 8 hours ago, liquiddiamonds said: Her way with melodies is actually her biggest catch this is what I've been sayin for years!! thank you! like… dgmw she's got some great lyrics in her discography. especially songs like The Archer and Mirrorball and Gold Rush and YOYO,K have introspection done right, and are paired well with subtle melodies. but for her hits? it's the melodies that keep me listening, she's got that natural capability for instantly catchy melodism, which is what sets her apart. that's what struck me the most when I saw her live last year, i was like "wow yeah I really HAVE loved her melodies for years!" 1
Doctor Dick Posted June 16 Posted June 16 I think that one line about "Who's Afraid of Little Old Me" isn't bad, it's cute. But that Golden Retriever and that siliquettessocorestes line is absolutely garbage. I think this is ultimately the result of people saying she is a great songwriter so she stopped filtering and trying because her fans will eat it up and call it excellent no matter what and it doesn't help if she's surrounded herself with a bunch of yes men as well.
Doctor Dick Posted June 16 Posted June 16 (edited) 19 minutes ago, JoeAg said: this is what I've been sayin for years!! thank you! like… dgmw she's got some great lyrics in her discography. especially songs like The Archer and Mirrorball and Gold Rush and YOYO,K have introspection done right, and are paired well with subtle melodies. but for her hits? it's the melodies that keep me listening, she's got that natural capability for instantly catchy melodism, which is what sets her apart. that's what struck me the most when I saw her live last year, i was like "wow yeah I really HAVE loved her melodies for years!" I just don't think so honestly. She's limited in terms of vocal abilities so her melodies are naturally limited as well. I think that plays a part of the reason why she doesn't have that many recognizable songs from people outside of her fanbase because her melodies are not as strong as you'd think. Aren't there going memes around that her songs sound the same? You don't have that for most other of her peers. I think Ariana has a nice ear for melodies but she's also a way more accomplished vocalist and can sing any tune. Taylor's strongest suit has always been her lyrics. Edited June 16 by Doctor Dick
liquiddiamonds Posted June 16 Posted June 16 6 minutes ago, JoeAg said: this is what I've been sayin for years!! thank you! like… dgmw she's got some great lyrics in her discography. especially songs like The Archer and Mirrorball and Gold Rush and YOYO,K have introspection done right, and are paired well with subtle melodies. but for her hits? it's the melodies that keep me listening, she's got that natural capability for instantly catchy melodism, which is what sets her apart. that's what struck me the most when I saw her live last year, i was like "wow yeah I really HAVE loved her melodies for years!" Exactly. The thing that was always impressive about Taylor was how she was giving the Swedish a run for their money as a girl with a guitar doing country music with delicious hooks. And then she got together with them and delivered true pop magic. Folklore was the best balance between her introspection and melodic game. It was her peak with Aaron and Jack. But I only hear that spark rarely in both Mid and Poets. She's obviously doing something right for the masses, since they're two of her most successful releases ever, but the melodies and production quality took a dive imo she's been rehashing thing a bit too much and the focus on words and storytelling doesn't work if it doesn't grab me as a listener. I cringed to Who's Afraid of Little Old Me on my first listen, for example, because it felt like a Taylor that Taylor herself had overcame creatively two projects ago. I think she wanted Poets to be messy and sprawling. Every songwriter has this album in their canon, and some fans will love it dearly because of it, but I didn't connect to the introspection she delivered. The only positive thing is that she's become less filtered and more candid with her writing. I think with better backing this stream of consciousness writing can work in a different project. I never count Taylor out, because she went from Lover to Folklore in a minute 1
liquiddiamonds Posted June 17 Posted June 17 2 minutes ago, Doctor Dick said: I just don't think so honestly. She's limited in terms of vocal capacities so her melodies are naturally limited as well. I think that plays a part of the reason why she doesn't have that many recognizable songs from people outside of her fanbase because her melodies are not as strong as you'd think. Aren't there going memes around that her songs sound the same? You don't have that for most other of her peers. I think Ariana has a nice ear for melodies but she's also a way more accomplished vocalist and can sing any tune. Taylor's strongest suit has always been her lyrics. The memes are only about this new album. Vocal capacity has little to do with melodies We're not speaking of vocal arrangements here. She stays in her lane with mostly the same range of chords, but her hooks are undeniable. Most of her singles sans Speak Now and her debut (more local to the US) are arguably recognized by the GP and not only her fanbase. Ariana works with some of the best in the game for her melodies. Taylor has proven to know how to come up with them on her own…
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