poll Who is the better songwriter: Mariah or Taylor?

[dirrtydiana]

39 minutes ago, HappierJealousy said:

 

In ATRL it will be Mariah. In the real world nobody knows or cares if Mariah co-writes some of her songs meanwhile Taylor’s self-written third album Speak Now receives universal acclaimed. folklore/evermore and Red including All Too Well are all considered as singer-songwriter’s masterpiece. But the bitter ATRL gays will always use some cute catchy brainless pop songs as an example trying to discredit Taylor’s songwriting ability. I just love how ATRL will always be the opposite of the real world. 

Mariah broke down many doors as a woman in writing and producing for it to be possible for mid writers like tay to receive those things you speak of

[HappierJealousy]

32 minutes ago, Moonlight Nation said:

Mariah Carey's entire commercial peak was prior to poptimism and she was associated with vocal powerhouses like Whitney Houston and Céline Dion who famously didn't write their music. No wonder the elitist critic industry of the time, dominated by white dudes with a bias for rock, would not take her seriously as an artist, let alone as a songwriter. Her having a very girly aesthetic and playing up a campy diva persona only made her 'less credible' for these people, plus the fact she's a biracial woman.

 

These days, everything Mariah Carey was discredited for is being praised, so it's unfair to treat Taylor Swift's critical acclaim and industry accolades as 'facts' when she benefitted from a completely different cultural climate. Not to mention these 'prestigious' publications often have their own agendas, with Rolling Stone being infamous for overhyping artists like Taylor Swift and Harry Styles because of biased stans who work for the institution. And the less said about using the corrupt, racist Grammys as 'proof' of quality, the better. Let alone the 2021 ceremony which damn near set up "folklore" 's win by having the secret committees shutting out all proper competition "folklore" should've had (Fiona Apple's "Fetch The Bolt Cutters", Harry Styles' "Fine Line", The Weeknd's "After Hours", Phoebe Bridgers' "Punisher"...).

 

How about you quit the obsession with shoving down numbers and meaningless achievements and write real arguments as to why you find Swift to be the better songwriter?

So everything achievement Taylor has received - biased, racist, corrupt, meaningless   So you basically discredit the whole music industry and music critic system cause you want to discredit Taylor, is this your so-called real arguments?

Edited February 26 by HappierJealousy

[Moonlight Nation]

3 minutes ago, HappierJealousy said:

So everything achievement Taylor has received - biased, racist, corrupt, meaningless   So you basically discredit the whole music industry and music critic system cause you want to discredit Taylor, is this your so-called real agreement? 

[MissedTheTrain]

They're both great!  Just different styles and it comes down to what you prefer.  When it comes to songwriting, I prefer Taylor's detail-filled storytelling. 

[HappierJealousy]

Just now, dirrtydiana said:

Mariah broke down many doors as a woman in writing and producing for it to be possible for mid writers like tay to receive those things you speak of

Yes, exactly, it seems like Carole Kings and Joni didn’t exist.   Just cause Mariah debut at 90s doesn’t mean she has strong influence for other female songwriters I’m sorry. Some people literally say anything

[HASHTAGPOW]

Whoever saved this girl's life 

 

Edited February 26 by HASHTAGPOW

[dirrtydiana]

2 minutes ago, HappierJealousy said:

Yes, exactly, it seems like Carole Kings and Joni didn’t exist.   Just cause Mariah debut at 90s doesn’t mean she has strong influence for other female songwriters I’m sorry. Some people literally say anything

Talk about baseless accusations to discredit Mariah lol only on atrl would  I see people over 15 years old claiming Mariah’s talent is inferior to someone like taylor 

 

she can buy all the acclaim, trophies, etc she wants but the music speaks for itself and for starters, she’s an incredibly weak singer and her melodies do not hold a candle to Mariah’s. Sure she self wrote some of her work but after listening to it, she could’ve used a camp. Or maybe if she herself didn’t sing her work. Like Rihanna completely elevated tiwycf 🤷‍♀️ 

[JoeAg]

1 hour ago, TayDuaStan said:

Taylor could easily write Obsessed or AIWFCIY but Mariah could never write ATW or a song on the level of the tracks from Folklore or Evermore 

I voted for Taylor, but nah... Mariah could easily write ATW lol. that song will forever be overrated by swifties everywhere 

[HappierJealousy]

7 minutes ago, dirrtydiana said:

Talk about baseless accusations to discredit Mariah lol only on atrl would  I see people over 15 years old claiming Mariah’s talent is inferior to someone like taylor 

 

she can buy all the acclaim, trophies, etc she wants but the music speaks for itself and for starters, she’s an incredibly weak singer and her melodies do not hold a candle to Mariah’s. Sure she self wrote some of her work but after listening to it, she could’ve used a camp. Or maybe if she herself didn’t sing her work. Like Rihanna completely elevated tiwycf 🤷‍♀️ 

Nobody discredit Mariah’s talent, she is one of the greatest vocalist. Say someone “buying” all her achievements simply because you don’t like them is the true 15-years old children’s behavior I’m sorry  

 

Yes, Taylor Swift can’t sing, can’t write song, her melody and lyrics are weak, and she is at her peak 18 years into her career and consistently release album with universal acclaimed. Ofc she “buying” all of these and the only fact in the real world is your personal delusional feeling 

 

Edited February 26 by HappierJealousy

[dirrtydiana]

1 minute ago, HappierJealousy said:

Nobody discredit Mariah’s talent, she is one of the greatest vocalist. Say someone “buying” all her achievements simply because you don’t like them is the true 15-years old children’s behavior I’m sorry  

 

Yes, Taylor Swift can’t sing, can’t write song, her melody and lyrics are weak, and she is at her peak 18 years into her career and consistently release album with universal acclaimed. Ofc she “buying” all of this and the only fact in the real world is your personal delusional feeling 

 

Imagine peaking 18 years into your career with material like midnights and all the rerecordings from when you were younger

 

and before you bring up “detailed story telling” lol I’m sorry but as a story teller, your genius relies on tailoring your experiences for people to enjoy. I cannot relate nor care about a billionaire and her celeb exes but that’s just me 🤷‍♀️ 

[Bey_Rihstan]

Mariah Carey easily for me. I don’t like Taylor’s writing style at all personally 

[GraceRandolph]

1 hour ago, Perfect Blue said:

Absolutely Mariah. Taylor Swift's childish, redundant, and emotionally stunted lyrics are factory made for millennial horse girls.

 

 

Queen of drunk driving

[HappierJealousy]

Just now, dirrtydiana said:

Imagine peaking 18 years into your career with material like midnights and all the rerecordings from when you were younger

Is this even a drag 

 

3 minutes ago, dirrtydiana said:

and before you bring up “detailed story telling” lol I’m sorry but as a story teller, your genius relies on tailoring your experiences for people to enjoy. I cannot relate nor care about a billionaire and her celeb exes but that’s just me 🤷‍♀️ 

No one is going to bring that up. But at least you admit it’s just your personal feeling and not act like 15-years old children, a growth I guess! 

[JoeAg]

both are brilliant

 

both have excellent moments, both have some duds. but hey, as a songwriter myself, I gotta say that that's to be expected for every songwriter ever! anyway

I personally prefer Taylor, but at her best, Mariah has written several songs on the same level as Taylor's most acclaimed tracks 

[JoeAg]

and if we want to talk about peak Taylor lyricism/melodism can we please do like... Enchanted, State of Grace, The Lucky One, Holy Ground, Don't Blame Me, The Archer, Seven, Tolerate It, Closure, You're on Your Own Kid, etc.

 

and not immediately go to the overrated All Too Well (the 10 minute version in particular is super overrated lol )

[Blue Skies]

 

[satellites.™]

When Taylor can write a Vision of Love then talk to me.

[ToraeGilt]

Taylor is not the songwriter y’all think she is. She’s ok at best. 

[Auburn]

tired thread topic but anyways

 

The answer will always and forever be Mariah and when we look at their songwriting beyond lyrics as there is more to it than just that, Mariah (and countless other artists) outclasses her immensely. Her lyricism is vastly overrated and wildly inconsistent to begin with.

[Mandalay]

Compared to Mariah, Taylor is so MOR in terms of lyrics. Now talk about melodies and arrangements, Mariah obliterates Taylor.

[Miley Cyrus]

Mariah. Swifties had to delude themselves  into thinking that taylor's songwriting is good.

 

Edited February 26 by Miley Cyrus

[Melancholy]

2 hours ago, The Music Industry said:

Wanna talk about range!?

 

''Now you hang from my lips
Like the Gardens of Babylon
With your boots beneath my bed
Forever is the sweetest con''

 

''Meeeeh heee heeeeeee oooooh oooooh

I'm the only one of me, baby that's the fun of me!''

 

Look at the material here too! 

Missing the point   lyrics from Me!ss are objectively bad while Obsessed lyrics are just perfection...TRY AGAIN!

[suburbannature]

2 hours ago, MissedTheTrain said:

They're both great!  Just different styles and it comes down to what you prefer.  When it comes to songwriting, I prefer Taylor's detail-filled storytelling. 

and Mariah does this better as well

 

Quote

It wasn't raining yet
But it was definitely a little misty on
That warm November night
And my heart was pounding 
My inner voice resounding
Begging me to turn away
But I just had to see your face to feel alive
And then you casually walked in the room
And I was twisted in the web of my desire for you
(And I was twisted)
My apprehension blew away
I only wanted you to taste my sadness
As you kissed me in the dark

Every time I feel the need
I envision you caressing me
And go back in time
To relive the splendor of you and I
On the rooftop that rainy night

Quote

And so we finished the Moet
And started feeling liberated
And I surrendered as you took me in your arms
I was so caught up in the moment
I couldn't bear to let you go yet
So I threw caution to the wind
And started listening to my longing heart
And then you softly pressed your lips to mine
And feelings surfaced I'd suppressed
For such a long long time 
And for a while I forgot the sorrow and the pain
And melted with you as we stood there in the rain

Quote

Slipping into dreams 
I feel my love surround you
My subconscious seems 
To weave itself around you
Do you care for me? 
Beyond idolization
Tell me how you feel
But don't keep me at bay
'Cause I won't be waiting long

Quote

So what do you do when somebody you're so devoted to
Suddenly just stops loving you and it seems they haven't got a clue
Of the pain that rejection is putting you through?
Do you cling to your pride and sing "I Will Survive"?
Do you lash out and say "How dare you leave this way"?
Do you hold on in vain as they just slip away?

Well I guess I'm trying to be nonchalant about it
And I'm going to extremes to prove I'm fine without you
But in reality I'm slowly losing my mind
Underneath the guise of a smile gradually I'm dying inside
Friends ask me how I feel
(How dare you leave?)
And I lie convincingly
'Cause I don't wanna reveal the fact that I'm suffering
So I wear my disguise 'til I go home at night
Then turn down all the lights and then I break down and cry
 

Quote

I was wayward child With the weight of the world that I held deep inside Life was a winding road And I learned many things little ones shouldn't know But I closed my eyes Steadied my feet on the ground Raised my head to the sky And though time's rolled by Still I feel like that child as I look at the moon Maybe I grew up a little too soon

 

---

 

Mariah's lyricism is so much more diverse and intricate. And that doesn't even touch on her melodic work.

Edited February 26 by suburbannature

[dirrtydiana]

3 hours ago, Moonlight Nation said:

I think Taylor Swift is a great songwriter in her own right, with her best compositions being all-around excellent, timeless, and brimming with strong melodic work. But she's been really inconsistent ever since her shift to pop, especially with the flashy 'statement' singles. She's had some baffling misuse of common expressions too ('They say home is where the heart is/But that's not where mine lives'  from "London Boy" being one of the worst offenders). "folklore" and "evermore" were exciting steps towards a new direction and feature some of her most poetic and unique compositions, but I'm personally not a fan of the approach she took when returning to pop with "Midnights", attempting to marry more intricate imagery and unconventional words with digestible pop structures. In my opinion, this has led to some of her clunkiest and most needlessly convoluted songwriting, where the melodies have also suffered in the process. The Vault tracks from "1989" are probably the worst offenders for this, which were obviously at least reworked recently. For me, her current songwriting tendencies have started to feel rather...amateurish, making for a peculiar artistic regression.

 

Meanwhile, Mariah Carey has showcased impressive consistency throughout her career. Some compositions are admittedly much simpler, but it also shows that Mariah knows when to tone it down and to capture a feeling or message at its most universal (see "Hero", "Love Takes Time", and "Can't Let Go"), not to mention her incredible voice plays a crucial role in the delivery and heart of these songs. Like post-"folklore" Taylor, Mariah has historically been known for incorporating unconventional words and poetic imagery in her music, but she does it very tactfully and effortlessly. In addition, Mariah also gets a point for executing humour and tongue-in-cheek lyrics much better than Swift. I don't know, there's an element of authenticity to Mariah's lighthearted and sillier compositions that I find lacking in most of Taylor's songs with this tone.

 

So Mariah Carey gets my vote, bu

 

3 hours ago, Moonlight Nation said:

Mariah Carey's entire commercial peak was prior to poptimism and she was associated with vocal powerhouses like Whitney Houston and Céline Dion who famously didn't write their music. No wonder the elitist critic industry of the time, dominated by white dudes with a bias for rock, would not take her seriously as an artist, let alone as a songwriter. Her having a very girly aesthetic and playing up a campy diva persona only made her 'less credible' for these people, plus the fact she's a biracial woman.

 

These days, everything Mariah Carey was discredited for is being praised, so it's unfair to treat Taylor Swift's critical acclaim and industry accolades as 'facts' when she benefitted from a completely different cultural climate. Not to mention these 'prestigious' publications often have their own agendas, with Rolling Stone being infamous for overhyping artists like Taylor Swift and Harry Styles because of biased stans who work for the institution. And the less said about using the corrupt, racist Grammys as 'proof' of quality, the better. Let alone the 2021 ceremony which damn near set up "folklore" 's win by having the secret committees shutting out all proper competition "folklore" should've had (Fiona Apple's "Fetch The Bolt Cutters", Harry Styles' "Fine Line", The Weeknd's "After Hours", Phoebe Bridgers' "Punisher"...).

 

How about you quit the obsession with parroting numbers and meaningless achievements and write real arguments as to why you find Swift to be the better songwriter?

Ugh the way I’m WET reading how deliciousouisly and eloquently you spill this truth tea

 

[Pillz]

3 hours ago, HappierJealousy said:

So everything achievement Taylor has received - biased, racist, corrupt, meaningless   So you basically discredit the whole music industry and music critic system cause you want to discredit Taylor, is this your so-called real arguments?

So you're saying the music industry is not biased, racist, and corrupt?