celeb news Selena Gomez attends Zionist wedding party where Israel flag is celebrated

[Headlock]

Just now, theflying said:

Okay. You got it. I recognize your definition.

 

Now what.

 

Palestinians are still never getting the land back.

Now we’re getting somewhere at least, pull that mask off further sis! Let us know the different ways you want Palestinians to suffer!

[theflying]

Lol there’s no “mask off”. I think the West Bank settlements should be disbanded, Palestinians should have a state of their own, and there will never be a right of return for Palestinians on Israeli land.

 

This is the *mainstream position in the US*.
 

It is also the only one grounded reality.

 

There is no amount of violence Palestinians can commit that will see them get their land back.

[Headlock]

2 minutes ago, theflying said:

Lol there’s no “mask off”. I think the West Bank settlements should be disbanded, Palestinians should have a state of their own, and there will never be a right of return for Palestinians on Israeli land.

 

There is no amount of violence Palestinians can commit that will see them get their land back.

So you agree that “Israeli land” is… Palestinian land that Israel stole, and is continuing to steal. Follow that logic down, what will happen when Israel steals all of Palestinians land, and don’t allow a right of return, as you suggest? 

[theflying]

@HeadlockMeanwhile, would you like to answer how much violence against Israel you’re willing to endorse in the name of getting land back?

[Nova_23]

8 minutes ago, theflying said:

Lol there’s no “mask off”. I think the West Bank settlements should be disbanded, Palestinians should have a state of their own, and there will never be a right of return for Palestinians on Israeli land.

 

This is the *mainstream position in the US*.
 

It is also the only one grounded reality.

 

There is no amount of violence Palestinians can commit that will see them get their land back.

I will keep fighting until my family gets back what’s theirs. Even if it amounts to nothing. Even if we get nothing. I will die fighting for Palestine and fighting for the rights of my people. And i know tens of millions of people who feel the same way. 

 

So Palestinians may not get their land back but thank you for admitting it’s ours and as a result Israel will never know peace because at the end of the day that country is a terrorist state built off the blood shed off Palestinians and we will make sure we remind them of that every single day. No peace for them until Palestinians are free. Period. 

Edited November 29, 2023 by Nova_23

[Headlock]

Just now, theflying said:

@HeadlockMeanwhile, would you like to answer how much violence against Israel you’re willing to endorse in the name of getting land back?

So again… you acknowledge the aggressor is Israel, and Palestinians are responding in defense of their homes and land being stolen from them?

[theflying]

Just now, Headlock said:

So you agree that “Israeli land” is… Palestinian land that Israel stole, and is continuing to steal. Follow that logic down, what will happen when Israel steals all of Palestinians land, and don’t allow a right of return, as you suggest? 

I really don’t care about the semantics of “stealing”. 
 

How much violence are you suggesting be inflicted upon Israel as a response?

[Mr.X]

2 minutes ago, theflying said:

Lol there’s no “mask off”. I think the West Bank settlements should be disbanded, Palestinians should have a state of their own, and there will never be a right of return for Palestinians on Israeli land.

 

This is the *mainstream position in the US*.
 

It is also the only one grounded reality.

 

There is no amount of violence Palestinians can commit that will see them get their land back.

If this isn't colonialism through and through. Yes, you are right though - it is the USA position, that's for sure. Doesn't mean it is less fascistic or genocidal. It means that you support the existance of an ethnostate where there is legal definitions of citizenship based on ethnicity. That's literally fascism.

 

Disgusting, really. Imagine supporting the view that a multi-cultural people like those living in occupied Palestine (I am including the whole of the Palestinian land here, not just the West Bank and Gaza) should never have the right to return to parts of their land?

 

You shame yourself with supporting genocide and the racist two-state policy. And please, spare me the whole 'Hamas is a terrorist group'. They are, at best, a resistance group against an occupying power. Yes, they have committed war crimes, but so have the IDF and the Israeli state. So by that definition, the IDF and the Israel state are terrorist groups as well.

 

I found this video particularly insightful, fair and nuanced on the situation:

 

 

[Mr.X]

2 minutes ago, theflying said:

@HeadlockMeanwhile, would you like to answer how much violence against Israel you’re willing to endorse in the name of getting land back?

I would love for Israel to be completely dismantled and everyone within historical Palestine to live with EQUAL rights. That includes current-Israel citizens and everyone in the West Bank and Gaza.

[Headlock]

Just now, theflying said:

I really don’t care about the semantics of “stealing”. 
 

How much violence are you suggesting be inflicted upon Israel as a response?

These strawmans are getting annoying. You don’t care about the “semantics of stealing”, which btw means the continued oppression and destruction of the lives of Palestinians, yet are choosing to be offended over those people fighting back?

 

You do realize the solution would be… for Israel to stop occupying a land that isn’t theirs, right?

[Mr.X]

On terrorism and 'land back', this is particularly a great article from Shuli Branson a Jewish, trans writer too on statehood and militarization of thought. It is free to access:

 

One of the major confusions for Western thinking when we hear the slogan “Land Back” from Indigenous liberatory movements—or the chant, “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free”—is this relationship to land. We only relate to land as property, either deeded and rightfully owned through law, or divinely gifted and tied through blood to a people excluding all others. The land back claim of Indigenous decolonial movements, however, isn’t the genocidal call that pearl-clutching settlers think it is. When discussing Palestinian liberation with Zionist Jews, I am told they want to genocide the Jews and wipe them off of Israel. We know within Turtle Island/United States, that the majority of Indigenous groups here calling for land back aren’t articulating a reversed settler genocidal urge, but rather a new relationship of living to the land, one that imbricates our species with other living things. The settler propaganda claims that all people have a land they are indigenous to, that they can then claim, like their birthright. The vocabulary of national identity runs so deep that many decolonial liberatory movements could only conceive of their freedom in that language. Our race thinking is so deeply embedded as an extension of our logic of property, we can’t imagine a world where different people live in relation to land outside of ownership, extraction, and biological hierarchies.

When it comes to Israel, there are added reasons to promote its existence that make it often hard to have real discussions about the violence it promotes. But I want to move beyond the argument that the Shoah/Holocaust is invoked as an excuse for Israel to perpetrate violence and genocide on the Palestinians, beyond the Israeli settler logic that their safety must be secured with disproportionate force against any would-be resistance, that all Jews in the world owe their safety to Israel. I think there is a deeper alibi at play in the grievance politics of Israel and its relation to the Holocaust, an alibi that the state itself permits.

We are told that the Arabs, Hamas, the Palestinians want all Jews dead. Gaza or Hamas is an existential threat for Israel and hence the Jews. But this is a displacement of the European antisemitic death wish that seemingly culminated in the final solution, but actually found its end in the creation of the Jewish state. The current conflict is a co-production of two fundamental forces of Western civilization—antisemitism and Islamophobia. Israel washes the blood off Europe’s hand with an Arab antisemitism. You only need to look at Germany’s ham-fisted (treyf), violent, and disgusting response to any anti-Zionist voices, but especially those of Jews.

 

 

No State Solution

On Social War, Israel, and the Alibi of the State

Shuli Branson

https://www.patreon.com/posts/no-state-93346904

Edited November 29, 2023 by Mr.X

[Communion]

37 minutes ago, theflying said:

Palestinians are still never getting the land back.

 

38 minutes ago, theflying said:

Gaza is the one that’s a shithole 

Oh wow. Sadly you don't realize you only further show how Zionists as far-right conservatives and why people become suspicious over celebrities or public figures who remain close confidants and allies with those who are publicly Zionists. 

Edited November 29, 2023 by Communion

[Cloröx]

14 hours ago, Harrier said:

No one has done so in here, but the Israel Palestine thread has contained many, many defenses and apologia for Hamas including: members pushing narratives the Oct 7th was an inside job, that Hamas' violence represents justified resistance against oppression, and that we as Westerners have no place to tell Hamas how to do their resistance etc etc 

 

I am not Jewish and so it has been easier for me to just comfortably argue with these members, and I don't report in the civics section, but I can very easily understand why Jewish members might feel uncomfortable with some of what has been posted in there in the past months. I support what y'all have been doing thread banning looney Zionist members & I don't think the posts from pro Palestine members have ever been as bad as that, but I do think its not fair to suggest "no one is defending Hamas" on ATRL  Even interpreting very charitably, we clearly have apologists.

Blaming Israel for the rising of Hamas doesn't mean people are defending Hamas lol you guys Zionist should stop twisting people word

 

[Cloröx]

38 minutes ago, theflying said:

@HeadlockMeanwhile, would you like to answer how much violence against Israel you’re willing to endorse in the name of getting land back?

What about how much violence has Israel committed to steal the land to begin with?

 

[ClashAndBurn]

1 hour ago, theflying said:

I think the West Bank settlements should be disbanded

As long as Israel expresses its "right to exist" as an occupying force, the settlements are going to continue until there is no West Bank left. That is the entire point of the settler-colonialist project. Netanyahu has vowed that Israel will take ownership of Gaza, Judea, and Samaria. Do you understand the implications of that? The "mainstream position of the US" (which is a fanciful notion of a two-state solution) is irrelevant and completely at odds with the stated goals of Israel and Zionism.

[heckinglovato]

2 hours ago, theflying said:

Gaza is the one that’s a shithole

2 hours ago, theflying said:

Okay. You got it. I recognize your definition.

 

Now what.

 

Palestinians are still never getting the land back.

At least your racism is no longer hidden  kudos I guess

[Cloröx]

Zionist be like "It's okay for us to commit genocide because our country practice democracy"

 

When you thought they were already stupid yet they keep coming with even more ridiculous take

 

[SeeingStars1515]

There is also left and ring versions of Zionism. Plenty of Zionists believe in the Jesus state while also advocating for Palestinian sovereignty and statehood. As an ethnoreligion, it's not different than the French advocating for a France, Chinese advocating for a China UNTIL you believe it's at the expense of others.

[hypnodemiluv]

On 11/28/2023 at 2:00 AM, Freakshowvato said:

What a dumb wedding celebration… why get the Israeli flag into this???? During this climate and when they are continually murdering children??????
 

anyway she shouldve done her research prior to attending. Donating her Rare beauty profits to pro-Zionist organizations and now this… she needs to do actual research when she takes accountability or stop pretending she cares entirely. 

OMG can you all stop infantilizing Selena Gomez!? she's one of the richest people, PRIVILIGED like nobody else in this world and she is doing sh*t like this constantly! just f*cking stop this is WAR we talking about - this is SERIOUS topic and all i see it's " she needs to do actual search" bit*ch please she's 31 years old self centered person and she deserve to be CANCELLED ASAP! enough is enough

[hypnodemiluv]

Also all Selenators still defending this girl should be dragged! I get it it's pop forum with stans but this is really not topic to be soft and forgivable even when she is your favorite celebrity.

[feelingsonfire]

2 minutes ago, hypnodemiluv said:

Also all Selenators still defending this girl should be dragged! I get it it's pop forum with stans but this is really not topic to be soft and forgivable even when she is your favorite celebrity.

You need some psychological evaluation seriously 

[hypnodemiluv]

10 minutes ago, feelingsonfire said:

You need some psychological evaluation seriously 

because i'm not afraid to unmask toxic actions of your fave? it is really worth it defending that girl? tell me

[Sad Serenade]

24 minutes ago, hypnodemiluv said:

OMG can you all stop infantilizing Selena Gomez!? she's one of the richest people, PRIVILIGED like nobody else in this world and she is doing sh*t like this constantly! just f*cking stop this is WAR we talking about - this is SERIOUS topic and all i see it's " she needs to do actual search" bit*ch please she's 31 years old self centered person and she deserve to be CANCELLED ASAP! enough is enough

 

21 minutes ago, hypnodemiluv said:

Also all Selenators still defending this girl should be dragged! I get it it's pop forum with stans but this is really not topic to be soft and forgivable even when she is your favorite celebrity.

you stan this piece of s**t who visited and support openly Israel

https://www.etonline.com/demi-lovato-gets-baptized-in-the-jordan-river-ive-never-felt-more-renewed-in-my-life-133561?amp

show some awareness and less ipocrisy.

[hypnodemiluv]

Just now, Sad Serenade said:

 

you stan this piece of s**t who visited and support openly Israel

https://www.etonline.com/demi-lovato-gets-baptized-in-the-jordan-river-ive-never-felt-more-renewed-in-my-life-133561?amp

show some awareness and less ipocrisy.

these two situations are not comparable but you tried to  

[Sad Serenade]

2 hours ago, hypnodemiluv said:

these two situations are not comparable but you tried to  

no way to defende your fave sweetie, even the OP dislikes her. 

I do agree Selena deserves criticism but your rants are totally hypocrite and out of control. 

Edited November 29, 2023 by Sad Serenade