Vermillion Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 Also, this is while Rudy campaigning for his son...
ClashAndBurn Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 9 minutes ago, Espresso said: That’s basically what YouTube suspended The Hill’s channel for. And liberals ran with it as a reason to personally attack Ryan Grim for spreading misinformation when he was just… reporting Big Tech has overstepped completely. It worked fine in Team Blue’s favor when they baselessly throttled the Hunter Biden laptop story, but they’re reaping what they’ve sown now.
rihannabiggestfan Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 "Just 21% of Americans — down from 25% three weeks ago, and the lowest number to date — say Biden should run again. But perhaps more strikingly, a greater share of 2020 Biden voters now say he shouldn’t run again (40%) than say he should (37%). Last month, those numbers were reversed. In contrast, a clear majority of Trump voters (57%) say Trump should mount another bid. Just 21% say he shouldn’t. And while 57% of independents say Trump shouldn’t try to make a comeback in 2024, far more — a full 76% — say the same about Biden." Looking cute tho, at least. (Oh wait ) Bernie, please reconsider 2024 Especially we Independents want you
ClashAndBurn Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 20 minutes ago, rihannabiggestfan said: "Just 21% of Americans — down from 25% three weeks ago, and the lowest number to date — say Biden should run again. But perhaps more strikingly, a greater share of 2020 Biden voters now say he shouldn’t run again (40%) than say he should (37%). Last month, those numbers were reversed. In contrast, a clear majority of Trump voters (57%) say Trump should mount another bid. Just 21% say he shouldn’t. And while 57% of independents say Trump shouldn’t try to make a comeback in 2024, far more — a full 76% — say the same about Biden." Looking cute tho, at least. (Oh wait ) Bernie, please reconsider 2024 Especially we Independents want you No, I disagree. Bernie should let Biden lose on his own and not give neoliberals the space to use him as a scapegoat. Ultimately the Democrats will eventually need to learn what happens when they move to the right more and more with every cycle and we need to stop saving them from themselves. Nina Turner can run a dead-end campaign all she wants. She won't take any votes from anyone who was going to be voting without her running anyway. Anyone that tries to use her as a scapegoat for Dems losing would look like an imbecile. Democrats won't respond to policy demands whether they came from her or Sanders anyway. Bernie might also not even be alive for 2024 anyway, realistically. That heart attack...
ATRL Moderator Bloo Posted June 17, 2022 ATRL Moderator Posted June 17, 2022 Honestly, leftists holding onto a possible 2024 run by Bernie need to realize that he cannot be the sole voice on the left. If he is, then the left is forever screwed. New leaders need to rise to the occasion and take charge. Bernie has also demonstrated he does not have the fighting spirit to actually take on the Dem establishment strong enough. "My dear friend Joe" is the pinnacle of Bernie's ineptitude to challenge the Dem establishment in a meaningful way. Had he simply said he won't commit to endorsing the eventual Dem nominee, he would have stood a stronger shot. He would have been seen as less of a short-term problem that can be squandered in the primaries and forgotten about. To forego a longwinded rant, we need to look beyond Bernie and I would personally prefer a complete outsider to run for president as a leftist in 2024 or 2028 or whatever. I think so many politicians go into DC with good intentions and a fiery spirit and then get inoculated with social niceties and lose their teeth. We saw it with AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Cori Bush, etc. Bernie's probably the most emboldened of them all, but even he couldn't criticize his good friend Joe, so we need someone completely removed from the bubble of DC.
Harrier Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Bloo said: Honestly, leftists holding onto a possible 2024 run by Bernie need to realize that he cannot be the sole voice on the left. If he is, then the left is forever screwed. New leaders need to rise to the occasion and take charge. Bernie has also demonstrated he does not have the fighting spirit to actually take on the Dem establishment strong enough. "My dear friend Joe" is the pinnacle of Bernie's ineptitude to challenge the Dem establishment in a meaningful way. Had he simply said he won't commit to endorsing the eventual Dem nominee, he would have stood a stronger shot. He would have been seen as less of a short-term problem that can be squandered in the primaries and forgotten about. To forego a longwinded rant, we need to look beyond Bernie and I would personally prefer a complete outsider to run for president as a leftist in 2024 or 2028 or whatever. I think so many politicians go into DC with good intentions and a fiery spirit and then get inoculated with social niceties and lose their teeth. We saw it with AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Cori Bush, etc. Bernie's probably the most emboldened of them all, but even he couldn't criticize his good friend Joe, so we need someone completely removed from the bubble of DC. Broadly I agree. Were I find difference with the leftist take on this, though, is I don't think its that all those progressives are corrupted by the niceties of DC or the allure of being in the elite. More so, I think, its that they come into contact with all these Democratic figures that the left (including me at times!) often paint as boogey men, only to discover that they're not in fact horrible people, they're not ghouls - they are (mostly) well intentioned people. I genuinely think the Joe Biden is a decent person, and so does Bernie. Most moderate democrats, unlike Republicans, are not evil. They are just misguided, and genuinely believe that their milquetoast policy, dodgy fundraising, and careful politicking is the only way to win power from the unbelievably dangerous right. That is what the judgement of all these good progressives is, and I am inclined to believe them over twitter denizens. That makes it very hard to be extremely harsh on them in a way that might sometimes be necessary. For me, the system itself - and also the electorate - is at the core of the issue. Milquetoast corporate democrats are a product of a party constantly in fear of a right wing that simply is more powerful and has an easier time getting elected due to the ways the system favors them.
ATRL Moderator Bloo Posted June 17, 2022 ATRL Moderator Posted June 17, 2022 Just now, Harrier said: Broadly I agree. Were I find difference with the standard leftist take on this, though, is I don't think its that all those progressives are swayed by the niceties of DC or the allure of being in the elite. More so, I think, its that they come into contact with all these Democratic figures that the left (including me at times!) often paint as boogey men, only to discover that they're not in fact horrible people, they're not ghouls - they are (mostly) well intentioned people. I genuinely think the Joe Biden is a decent person, and so does Bernie. Most moderate democrats, unlike Republicans, are not evil. They are just misguided, and genuinely believe that their milquetoast policy, dodgy fundraising, and careful politicking is the only way to win power from the unbelievably dangerous right. That is what the judgement of all these good progressives is, and I am inclined to believe them over twitter denizens. That makes it very hard to be extremely harsh on them in a way that might sometimes be necessary. For me, the system itself - and also the electorate - is at the core of the issue. Milquetoast corporate democrats are a product of a party constantly in fear of a right wing that simply is more powerful and has an easier time getting elected due to the ways the system favors them. That’s what I mean by social niceties. I’m sure plenty of Dem politicians go in with good intentions and then think, “Huh, well to accomplish X I need to get re-elected and I need money from Y corporation to do so..!” And then they become corrupt and they work against the people. I’m sure these people are pleasant and kind individuals. But they’re corrupt. So, if you’re someone who isn’t corrupt and not bought out and you start to share a beer with these nice, corrupt politicians, it suddenly becomes hard to demonize them and their corruption. It becomes to call out their shilling for corporations and the fact that they are an obstacle for socioeconomic justice in America because they’re a nice friend to share a coffee break with. That’s a very human social quality we have and it’s something we need to avoid. We, frankly, need an a**hole who ain’t looking for friends in DC.
Mean Trees Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 I wonder which book she read by candlelight made her believe this.
ClashAndBurn Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 The problem is, you have a society that shuts down and goes into panic mode whenever it hears the word "socialism" even though many of the things we function on as a society depend on socialist policies and ideas. People don't realize the fact that those socialist institutions we do have are what barely keep us being from a pure capitalist hellscape, and... doesn't seem like anyone is willing to accept that reality. American propaganda is too strong. People just envision total societal collapse and ruin like in Venezuela and Cuba, not realizing or caring that those are caused primarily by American sanctions and trade embargoes cutting those countries off from the rest of the world.
anti-bitch Posted June 17, 2022 Posted June 17, 2022 3 hours ago, Bloo said: Honestly, leftists holding onto a possible 2024 run by Bernie need to realize that he cannot be the sole voice on the left. If he is, then the left is forever screwed. New leaders need to rise to the occasion and take charge. Bernie has also demonstrated he does not have the fighting spirit to actually take on the Dem establishment strong enough. "My dear friend Joe" is the pinnacle of Bernie's ineptitude to challenge the Dem establishment in a meaningful way. Had he simply said he won't commit to endorsing the eventual Dem nominee, he would have stood a stronger shot. He would have been seen as less of a short-term problem that can be squandered in the primaries and forgotten about. To forego a longwinded rant, we need to look beyond Bernie and I would personally prefer a complete outsider to run for president as a leftist in 2024 or 2028 or whatever. I think so many politicians go into DC with good intentions and a fiery spirit and then get inoculated with social niceties and lose their teeth. We saw it with AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Cori Bush, etc. Bernie's probably the most emboldened of them all, but even he couldn't criticize his good friend Joe, so we need someone completely removed from the bubble of DC. I was thinking about this the other day, how Bernie is still the only formidable progressive out there. I think he was more fiery in 2016 but got a bit shaken by people blaming him for the election loss, so he tried to be more friendly in 2020 but that also failed. AOC has potential for sure but she needs a lot more experience in DC. I guess Stacey Abrams could be a big deal in the future though. I hope she becomes the governor of GA this year.
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