XDNA Posted November 8 Posted November 8 2 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said: That problem goes away entirely in a timeline where Biden decides before 2023 not to recklessly commit to running again. I agree, but i'll take it one step further and say Harris should've never been he VP. The VP should've been someone with a better chance at winning a national election given Biden's old age.
GraceRandolph Posted November 8 Posted November 8 1 minute ago, XDNA said: I agree, but i'll take it one step further and say Harris should've never been he VP. The VP should've been someone with a better chance at winning a national election given Biden's old age. Clyburn demanded a WOC
RihRihGirrrl Posted November 8 Posted November 8 Just now, XDNA said: I agree, but i'll take it one step further and say Harris should've never been he VP. The VP should've been someone with a better chance at winning a national election given Biden's old age. In hindsight I agree.....also think that would've been better for Harris' career as a politician
Cruel Summer Posted November 8 Posted November 8 Just now, Bloo said: What followed South Carolina was the day I gave up on the party and I developed a cynicism I can't let go of. The following Super Tuesday was such a depressing ass day for me. I was honestly more upset then than I was this recent electoral outcome. I truly think the consolidation around Biden, the man that could barely speak and was widely hated, to prevent Bernie from being the nominee really snapped me out of whatever confidence I had with the party. It became clear the "protectors of Democracy" truly do not care about Democracy in any meaningful capacity. For me, one of the most jarring parts of all that - as someone who had recently still believed in the whole thing, but had crossed over already - was seeing that Obama was involved behind the scenes in multiple candidates dropping out and directing their supporters to Biden. It felt like a heavy hand had been placed directly on the scales, and with Warren still in, there was virtually nothing to be done. If I recall (I may be wrong on this), even Warren dropping out wouldn't have really been enough at that point, and the Democrats failing to let that primary play out more naturally sealed a lot of things irreversibly. And boy do I seem to remember some nasty arguments in the main politics thread right around that time, too.
anastaciabby Posted November 8 Posted November 8 2 minutes ago, XDNA said: I agree, but i'll take it one step further and say Harris should've never been he VP. The VP should've been someone with a better chance at winning a national election given Biden's old age. anyone under Biden would've been treated the same 1
harwee Posted November 8 Posted November 8 15 minutes ago, RihRihGirrrl said: But this is his last presidency, he doesn't need their vote again....I think he'll want to go out with a legacy of making America white again Or do both: flip flop on issues, keep stringing new recruits along to expand his brand for his kids, and also be racist. Some voters seem to like that.
ATRL Moderator Bloo Posted November 8 ATRL Moderator Posted November 8 1 minute ago, Cruel Summer said: For me, one of the most jarring parts of all that - as someone who had recently still believed in the whole thing, but had crossed over already - was seeing that Obama was involved behind the scenes in multiple candidates dropping out and directing their supporters to Biden. It felt like a heavy hand had been placed directly on the scales, and with Warren still in, there was virtually nothing to be done. If I recall (I may be wrong on this), even Warren dropping out wouldn't have really been enough at that point, and the Democrats failing to let that primary play out more naturally sealed a lot of things irreversibly. And boy do I seem to remember some nasty arguments in the main politics thread right around that time, too. I don't know about the Warren piece. I remember there being a LOT of animosity between Warren supporters and Bernie supporters (with the latter outnumbering the former; especially following the sexism smear) because Bernie supporters were demanding Warren drop out and endorse Bernie ahead of Super Tuesday since he was the one with the best shot of winning the nomination. Warren clearly didn't. I think had she done that, it could have halted some of the bleeding and could have prevented Super Tuesday from being so terrible. Because Biden was coronated by media hype. Warren still had a fair amount of media hype that could have been redirected towards Bernie via endorsement. But, it would have been a long shot for sure. I think the weird thing about the entire orchestration on Obama's part was just how desperate he was to get behind anyone else besides Biden. Remember when Obama-world was vying for Deval Patrick to be the runaway last minute candidate in the race? There were a lot of people coming out of the blue, announcing last minute candidacies for president because Obama ultimately was throwing the kitchen sink at the primary. He was even toying with the idea of anointing Warren. But he just knew he didn't want Bernie. But after the first three primaries and Biden winning the fourth one (SC), he got desperate and settled for Biden. It's just an interesting dynamic how much he seemingly hated his own VP and had no confidence in his ability to win. Despite that, he still chose to mettle in the primary and put his thumb on the scale. 2
Communion Posted November 8 Posted November 8 23 minutes ago, ClashAndBurn said: If by progressive channels and creators, you mean more Pod Saves and Destiny clones then no thanks Me as someone who became blackpilled about progressive content creation after 2020 and basically checked out being confused about why the guy who said he wanted to go out and shoot Black Lives Matter protestors is someone liberal twitter users keep referencing as a liberal content creator??? fgjknbkjnfg
XDNA Posted November 8 Posted November 8 5 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said: Clyburn demanded a WOC Yep, and Clyburn playing backroom dealmaking will hurt POC people more. There was too much at stake with Trump still around.
byzantium Posted November 8 Posted November 8 10 minutes ago, RihRihGirrrl said: Well there was no time for an actual primary because Biden dropped out so late.... The democrats need to stop seeing themselves as so limited. America wants leaders with visions. Not someone who is going to spend their time telling the American people all the things they can't do.
ClashAndBurn Posted November 8 Posted November 8 14 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said: Oh the aftermath of all that was definitely sickening. From that point until the first primaries and caucuses brought me straight into blackpilled "it's all a ******* pointless lie" territory - and some of those views on politics, to be entirely transparent, stick with me today. My personal darkest day, recorded I'm sure in our own 2020 election thread somewhere, was the 2020 Iowa caucus Pete/Shadow, Inc. disaster. That was when I knew with absolute certainty that the party was going to do everything it could to crush the Sanders candidacy faster and harder the second time around, and sure as **** it did so. Still kills me how a data company would ACTUALLY willingly tank their own credibility AND ruin Iowa's status as "first-in-the-nation caucus" just to **** over one candidate in particular. Unreal 1
anastaciabby Posted November 8 Posted November 8 I don't even want to remember Warrens stubborn ass not wanting to drop out, I was fuming
ATRL Moderator Bloo Posted November 8 ATRL Moderator Posted November 8 7 minutes ago, Communion said: Me as someone who became blackpilled about progressive content creation after 2020 and basically checked out being confused about why the guy who said he wanted to go out and shoot Black Lives Matter protestors is someone liberal twitter users keep referencing as a liberal content creator??? fgjknbkjnfg Ummm??? I keep hearing about Destiny but I am blessed to say I've never watched his content, never encountered his content, never witnessed it. I'm suddenly feeling very blessed and privileged for somehow missing that mess. — Speaking of online commentators, is anyone following some of the (very light) drama around Olayemi Olurin? 2
Prodigal Self Posted November 8 Posted November 8 44 minutes ago, monologueNacafe said: It's kind of hard because a lot of us have been on there since 2009 and there hasn't really been an adequate replacement. I just made a bluesky account the other day. It seems they finally opened up registration. Hopefully that takes off now that Trump is coming back I mean yeah I been on twitter since 2011 til Elmo takeover but y'all need to take a stand 2
anastaciabby Posted November 8 Posted November 8 (edited) I barely saw Trump said today he's leaving the government to RFK? oh maybe we are doomed doomed Edited November 8 by anastaciabby
Wicked Posted November 8 Posted November 8 12 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said: This the only political podcast I regularly listen to lol, ain't listened to Rev Left Radio in years.
Communion Posted November 8 Posted November 8 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said: For me, one of the most jarring parts of all that - as someone who had recently still believed in the whole thing, but had crossed over already - was seeing that Obama was involved behind the scenes in multiple candidates dropping out and directing their supporters to Biden. It felt like a heavy hand had been placed directly on the scales, and with Warren still in, there was virtually nothing to be done. If I recall (I may be wrong on this), even Warren dropping out wouldn't have really been enough at that point, and the Democrats failing to let that primary play out more naturally sealed a lot of things irreversibly. And boy do I seem to remember some nasty arguments in the main politics thread right around that time, too. This was just propaganda by her more establishment-friendly supporters. A lot of Warren's campaign was run by those who were progressive but still loyal Dem staffers. Bernie had many DC types but chose more leftist media figures for many roles (They'll never make me hate BrieBrieJoy!!! lol). Many primaries once things got started in 2020 asked voters who their 2nd choice would have been and so her supporters at the time referenced how Sanders wasn't the 2nd choice for a few of her supporters. The issue was that such only occurred after she argued he was a sexist after he took back the lead progressive spot. I get what she was trying to do with the rhetoric but a lot of her campaign sought out diverse, social justice sphere organizations yet relied on the grasstops of those organizations for their guidance and endorsement (them then hoping to get a seat at the table if she won), despite the actual member bodies of many of these orgs supporting Sanders over Warren. See: The WFP endorsing her over him because her campaign was more in-touch with its leaders and promised influence, with then spokespeople for WFP running to twitter to claim they were being "harassed by Bernie Bros for endorsing a woman", but it was cause the WFP refused to release the result of the members-only vote. Edited November 8 by Communion 2
Cruel Summer Posted November 8 Posted November 8 17 minutes ago, Bloo said: I don't know about the Warren piece. I remember there being a LOT of animosity between Warren supporters and Bernie supporters (with the latter outnumbering the former; especially following the sexism smear) because Bernie supporters were demanding Warren drop out and endorse Bernie ahead of Super Tuesday since he was the one with the best shot of winning the nomination. Warren clearly didn't. I think had she done that, it could have halted some of the bleeding and could have prevented Super Tuesday from being so terrible. Because Biden was coronated by media hype. Warren still had a fair amount of media hype that could have been redirected towards Bernie via endorsement. But, it would have been a long shot for sure. I think the weird thing about the entire orchestration on Obama's part was just how desperate he was to get behind anyone else besides Biden. Remember when Obama-world was vying for Deval Patrick to be the runaway last minute candidate in the race? There were a lot of people coming out of the blue, announcing last minute candidacies for president because Obama ultimately was throwing the kitchen sink at the primary. He was even toying with the idea of anointing Warren. But he just knew he didn't want Bernie. But after the first three primaries and Biden winning the fourth one (SC), he got desperate and settled for Biden. It's just an interesting dynamic how much he seemingly hated his own VP and had no confidence in his ability to win. Despite that, he still chose to mettle in the primary and put his thumb on the scale. It really makes you think, doesn't it? What still fucks me up, to this very day, about all of that is that Obama is adored by the Democratic base not just because of his charisma, or because things got better under his administration, but for the singular one word thing he symbolized most: hope. One of the most famous political posters in all of history is the one with just his face, his logo, and that one word. And what was the one thing Bernie most stood for in the eyes of his supporters? Hope. It's fascinating, again in a kind of morbid way, that Bernie represented such an existential threat to the Democratic Party establishment - to the exact kind of politics that was soundly crushed this week - that the candidate who sailed to a historic victory on hope and promises of progress used his influence to help defeat a movement based on hope and promises of progress. It's the biggest single thing that makes me no longer trust Obama and see him as just being yet another facet of the machine that produced Biden, the Clintons, and more. But it's not something that I feel I can even discuss outside of spaces like this, because to genuinely question Obama seems anathema to the strong majority of Democrats, who idolize him - and many of whom don't even know or care about politics deeply enough for any of this to make any more sense to them than me just rambling and them giving a concerned look. Of course I know that there are differences between the kind of hope that Obama represented and the kind that Bernie represented, but still - I have to wonder what might be different today if things had gone differently in that matter.
Relampago. Posted November 8 Posted November 8 26 minutes ago, Bloo said: What followed South Carolina was the day I gave up on the party and I developed a cynicism I can't let go of. The following Super Tuesday was such a depressing ass day for me. I was honestly more upset then than I was this recent electoral outcome. I truly think the consolidation around Biden, the man that could barely speak and was widely hated, to prevent Bernie from being the nominee really snapped me out of whatever confidence I had with the party. It became clear the "protectors of Democracy" truly do not care about Democracy in any meaningful capacity. I had this same reaction but then got fooled by the coconut memes with a side of Trump fear to dedicate 3 weekends of my life to go through the hell of canvassing for a milquetoast candidate. Never again! I'm fully disillusioned now, because this wasn't a Clinton close-call loss. The US fully said **** you to Dems, and I'll happily join them if they don't learn and try something new.
Bethenny Frankel Posted November 8 Posted November 8 ok can we please stop dissecting, it's over and done with. time to move on and be prepared for fascism. 1
Communion Posted November 8 Posted November 8 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Bloo said: Ummm??? I keep hearing about Destiny but I am blessed to say I've never watched his content, never encountered his content, never witnessed it. I'm suddenly feeling very blessed and privileged for somehow missing that mess. — Speaking of online commentators, is anyone following some of the (very light) drama around Olayemi Olurin? He's always been this like.. insane weird right-wing liberal. He was saying Biden winning in 2020 was "more important" than police brutality and so that he hoped enough protestors would get shot by conservatives that the protestors should go home?? Maybe it's cause he has "Liberal" in his user (OmniLiberal) but he's always been a right-winger. He just went from video game streamer to trying to seem 'progressive' by going out and debating (a throwback) people like.. Lauren Southern. He's just a reactionary neoliberal who will take any view that frames American neoliberal as inherently good. Him telling Vietnamese youtuber Luna Oi that America did nothing wrong during the Vietnam War is like.. the same to me as Vaush saying America nalpalming North Korea was amazing. Hasan had plenty of immature views, especially when younger, but the idea that anyone puts him into the same bracket of either of those freaks is ???. Even Kyle is a stretch despite his far more edgelord past given he's tried to shift to actual political commentary. Edited November 8 by Communion 1
bunnyeyes Posted November 8 Posted November 8 Wait not MAGATRL coming out of the woodwork and suddenly spamming everywhere on this site I can't be the only one who's noticed the shift 5
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