discussion Teacher defends lgbt students

[SmittenCake]

https://twitter.com/a_manluv/status/1666794064082272257?t=JkxzQeacy0eGcm10i_yZlw&s=19

 

 

The original source of the tweet is far right propaganda so I'm quote tweeting a mutual 

Edited June 8, 2023 by SmittenCake

[Saintlor]

Quote

The original source of the tweet is far right propaganda so

I'm quote tweeting a mutual

The mutual's tweet:

 

Quote

if you can't be tolerant towards others then get the **** out of the West!

 

Why are you supporting this? 

 

Yes, its very wrong for them to not support LGBTQ+, but this is reinforcing that western countries belong to white people and anyone else living here (even if they were born here) is not a real citizen

 

Nobody would tell a racist person or white school shooter to leave America and "get the **** out of the West!"

Edited June 8, 2023 by Saintlor

[ZIVERT]

Ready for another thread telling us why we need to tolerate intolerance. Nobody should be told to gtfo, but all people using religions as an excuse for hatred deserves to be dragged

[SmittenCake]

11 minutes ago, Saintlor said:

The mutual's tweet:

 

 

Why are you supporting this? 

 

Yes, its very wrong for them to not support LGBTQ+, but this is reinforcing that western countries belong to white people and anyone else living here (even if they were born here) is not a real citizen

 

Nobody would tell a racist person or white school shooter to leave America and "get the **** out of the West!"

I agree with you. But this young person escaped his home country where he could have been killed. I don't agree with his messaging either, but I can see why he feels this way. Also, I'd rather quote him than the other Far Right lunatics who want to actually harm people and spread propaganda. 

[NoOneDiesFromLove]

 

[loveisdead9582]

I don’t agree with the phrasing here at all, but to be fair, if America is supposed to the land of the free, and have liberty and justice for all, individuals need to be tolerant of other people WITHOUT encroaching on their rights and freedoms.
 

I don’t like religion and I truly think that it is a hateful institution that has oftentimes done more harm than good. I will not however say that we should take away anyone’s freedom of religious expression. If these bigots don’t like same sex marriage or the thought of being trans, then they shouldn’t marry someone of the same sex or go through a gender affirming surgery. Don’t sit here and call us “wrong” when religion has been responsible for the deaths of millions. Works for brains - all of them. 

[Communion]

These conversations in the West will never be productive as long as people become nativist freaks the moment they have a moment of conflict. 

 

The entire reformist movement of Christianity in North America has been rooted in melding religion and progressivism together. By reiterating that religiosity is not tied to conservatism. "I'm beautiful in my way cause God makes no mistakes".

 

If you actually wanted to rebuke conservative religious people without rebuking all peopoe of that religion, you can literally just say things like "the existance of gay Muslims proves Allah loves gays".

 

"Allah loves gays" is way more effective than "go back to your dirt home, you mongrels!!!!!" that yall can't keep yourselves from saying. 

[playboi]

The real question is why is their school organizing Ramadan activities??? 

 

Religion has no place in public school

[FOCK]

I appreciate the teacher’s sentiment here, I just think the phrasing is off & whilst her frustration is understandable, it veered too much into emotion & antagonism to be effective, imo. 
 

I don’t know the age of the class, but this discussion may have been better had in a private context with the student & maybe, a call to his family to modify behaviour, as I’m sure they wouldn’t have appreciated him leaving the premises during school time. 
 

It’s a fair lesson & parallel drawn overall, though it’s tricky, as I remember Jehova’s Witness students would sit out certain assemblies that were honouring fallen ANZAC soldiers, for example. The difference is, it was a discussion had with parents & the kids were still on the school premises where they could be safely monitored. The teachers discussed the situation with the students & it minimised any potential misinterpretation of intent, disrespect or conflict.

 

Acknowledging/respecting someone’s right to exist or live as they want, does not necessarily mean you are obligated to subscribe to their beliefs. 

 

Religious children may lack this nuance just by the virtue of their lack of world experience or what they are taught at home. 

[helpthomas]

the fact that a far right account shared this is so unsettling imo. homonationalism is so a toxic, because far right extremists hate gays and use racism as a crutch to win us over and show us that we have a common "enemy", when they actually despise us and use us. 

 

the teacher has a point. but the wording was a bit off. she was obviously very upset, which probably lead to her phrasing it in that way, but her point is valid. it's just a slippery slope to use that type of rhetoric because it plays right into the hands of far right extremists salivating over the fact that they can win over gay people to pursue their racist agenda

[Harrier]

2 hours ago, helpthomas said:

the fact that a far right account shared this is so unsettling imo. homonationalism is so a toxic, because far right extremists hate gays and use racism as a crutch to win us over and show us that we have a common "enemy", when they actually despise us and use us. 

 

the teacher has a point. but the wording was a bit off. she was obviously very upset, which probably lead to her phrasing it in that way, but her point is valid. it's just a slippery slope to use that type of rhetoric because it plays right into the hands of far right extremists salivating over the fact that they can win over gay people to pursue their racist agenda

that's true, but in this case, the far right is much more concerned with crushing gay people right now. The account is sharing it not to win over lgbt support for deporting Muslims, but rather to a) help get conservative Muslims on the anti-anti-woke bandwagon and b) to show what they perceive as hypocrisy  on the left. Just look at the replies on the original tweet - most of them are Muslims or conservatives praising the kid.

 

Overall, anti-woke conservatives are trying to mobilize the social conservatism of minority groups against us right now. It's honestly scary to watch, because I believe they will be successful. We should fight back, but we can do that without getting nativist as you and Communion rightly say.

 

 

 

 

 

[Mr_campbell]

On 6/9/2023 at 1:12 AM, Saintlor said:

The mutual's tweet:

 

 

Why are you supporting this? 

 

Yes, its very wrong for them to not support LGBTQ+, but this is reinforcing that western countries belong to white people and anyone else living here (even if they were born here) is not a real citizen

 

Nobody would tell a racist person or white school shooter to leave America and "get the **** out of the West!"

This ain’t it. What you’re basically saying is that white people have no culture or home on this earth. If a white person moves to Dubai they are expected to adapt to the laws and ways of the land, which most white people do. If a muslim comes to the west then they are expected to obey the rules and ways of the land as well. This is called respect, and you need to learn that if you believe in equality. 

[rihannafan]

8 minutes ago, Mr_campbell said:

This ain’t it. What you’re basically saying is that white people have no culture or home on this earth. If a white person moves to Dubai they are expected to adapt to the laws and ways of the land, which most white people do. If a muslim comes to the west then they are expected to obey the rules and ways of the land as well. This is called respect, and you need to learn that if you believe in equality. 

Well you saw how people reacted to qatars backwards laws (and rightfully so). 

 

You can reprimand someone without telling them to go back to their country.

[Mr_campbell]

Just now, rihannafan said:

Well you saw how people reacted to qatars backwards laws (and rightfully so). 

 

You can reprimand someone without telling them to go back to their country.

Yes, very true. 

[Scars]

15 hours ago, Mr_campbell said:

This ain’t it. What you’re basically saying is that white people have no culture or home on this earth. If a white person moves to Dubai they are expected to adapt to the laws and ways of the land, which most white people do. If a muslim comes to the west then they are expected to obey the rules and ways of the land as well. This is called respect, and you need to learn that if you believe in equality. 

You're comparing apples to oranges and completely missed that user's main point. 

 

Canada, just like any other country in the Americas, is a stolen land which the population is mostly made up of demographic groups that have racial ancestry from somewhere else, so identifying as a canadian isn't (only) connected to having ancestral roots there and it isn't synonymous with whiteness either. Immigrants from all over the world played a part in building what we know today as the canadian culture and that's still the case.

 

When someone says a muslim canadian should "go back to their country", without even knowing their citizenship status, they're stripping them away from their national identity. It goes beyond the "ugh, I hate foreigners!" xenophobic rethoric, there's the implicit idea here that non-white canadians aren't true canadians, but honorary citizens instead, in a sense that their ties to the country don't really matter, they'll always going to be the *other* from somewhere else and should have their nationality status revoked if they don't play the part. This energy certainly isn't given to conversative white canadians.

 

Other users have said that before, but that language is not only hurtful to both sides, but very unproductive as well, especially because nearly 60% of Canada-born muslims already support LGBTQ+ rights. On top of everything else, those talking points are a constant reminder to our muslim canadian allies that you'll never see people that look like them as canadian enough.

 

There's too much energy waisted on irrational nonsense instead of a focus on meaningful and mature conversations on how to effectively tackle queerphobia among disenfranchised groups in the West. 

Edited June 11, 2023 by Scars