Gen-Z Muslims Split on Homosexuality

[Monster Megamind]

4 minutes ago, Communion said:

What do American citizens born in America have to do with either Europe or refugees? 

Nothing. It's just that the proportion of Muslims migrating to Europe is going to have a bigger effect that here 

[Johan]

These queer muslims are delusional, coming from an ex-muslim. islams stance is clear and them along with liberal sjws by defending that religion is  doing more harm to queers and other minorities that live in muslim countries that have no voice and are risking their lives.

[Literature]

On 1/9/2023 at 3:35 AM, Communion said:

She literally said passages that allegedly condemn homosexuality instead read to her and many others as a condemning of rape and cheating. Who are you to say your interpretation is anymore valid than her's? What are you gonna do, get Allah to come down and correct her?

 

Organized religion is not some naturally observed thing. It's a social contract. There are no innate, inherent rules to any religion. The entire history of organized religions, and that there are even different organized religions throughout history itself proves this - the mere existence of organized religion proves a social contract.

 

You don't know her connection to Allah. You don't know what Islam means to her.

So if she thinks that Islam is pro-LGBT and Allah loves her as a gay women, then guess what?

The verse she is referencing is 7:81: “Indeed, you approach men with desire, instead of women. Rather, you are a transgressing people." She's replacing the word 'approach' with 'rape', which not only demonstrates poor knowledge of the Arabic vocabulary but also does not make much sense as it would imply that rape against women is allowed: "Indeed, you 'rape' men out of desire, instead of women. Rather, you are a transgressing people." 

 

Forget being a topic where there is a difference of opinion amongst scholars its just a flat out error in translation  

 

Quote

There are no innate, inherent rules to any religion.

Literally every Muslim would disagree with you  You're trying to view Islam from an outside perspective and make it seem neutral and tolerant of every opinion but that just doesn't work with a religion like Islam 

[Communion]

12 minutes ago, Literature said:

with a religion like Islam 

Right-wing Christians like you thinking your book of fairy tales are somehow magically more amenable and able to be reformed than other people's book of fairy tales. 

 

You're not going to convince any non-racist atheist of this. No one gets to be any more special than the other. Yall are literally the same story copied and pasted 3 times and will be treated like such. No skeptic or secular person motivated by actual atheism believes there's any meaningful differences amongst the Abrahamic religions. 

 

It's not ~Judeo-Christian Fables aka "Values"~ vs Islamic "Values". It's Abrahamic Fables vs Secular Thought. You cannot ostracize Islam while believing in other ideological systems where there lacks any meaningful evidence that such belief systems are substantially different. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Communion

[Literature]

1 hour ago, Communion said:

Right-wing Christians like you thinking your book of fairy tales are somehow magically more amenable and able to be reformed than other people's book of fairy tales. 

 

You're not going to convince any non-racist atheist of this. No one gets to be any more special than the other. Yall are literally the same story copied and pasted 3 times and will be treated like such. No skeptic or secular person motivated by actual atheism believes there's any meaningful differences amongst the Abrahamic religions. 

 

It's not ~Judeo-Christian Fables aka "Values"~ vs Islamic "Values". It's Abrahamic Fables vs Secular Thought. You cannot ostracize Islam while believing in other ideological systems where there lacks any meaningful evidence that such belief systems are substantially different. 

And with that, you've exposed your bias and lack of knowledge when it comes to approaching this issue.

 

 

Oh, and I'm not Christian, nor Jewish. Food for thought 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Literature

[CottageHore]

Organized religion is damaging and this is one of many examples. Reciting age-old scripture that’s been misconstrued and spun to oppress whole groups of people. That legend at the end is amazing though and I hope they’re well.

[Weld_E]

There are multiple knowledgable ex-muslims in this thread sharing their traumatic lived experience with the religion and having the same sentiment.
 

That one user that’s constantly trying to belittle people’s religious trauma and villainize them for some cookie points should receive WP and should refrain from future discussions on the topic if they will keep minimizing people’s valid experiences with the religion.

[A.R.L]

Well, it's hard to be the real you with religious people, good luck to them and all people oppressed by any religion or mentality

[Pikachoo]

On 1/10/2023 at 5:30 AM, Delirious said:

Messssssssy thread 

 

it always becomes a disaster when islam is discussed

well there's actually people in this thread who live in a muslim country so I'll take their word on Islam or anyone else's here.

[Delirious]

4 hours ago, Pikachoo said:

well there's actually people in this thread who live in a muslim country so I'll take their word on Islam or anyone else's here.

True you're right!

 

19 hours ago, Weld_E said:

There are multiple knowledgable ex-muslims in this thread sharing their traumatic lived experience with the religion and having the same sentiment.
 

That one user that’s constantly trying to belittle people’s religious trauma and villainize them for some cookie points should receive WP and should refrain from future discussions on the topic if they will keep minimizing people’s valid experiences with the religion.

True! It's so annoying and tiring.

[A.R.L]

On 1/12/2023 at 7:29 AM, Weld_E said:

There are multiple knowledgable ex-muslims in this thread sharing their traumatic lived experience with the religion and having the same sentiment.
 

That one user that’s constantly trying to belittle people’s religious trauma and villainize them for some cookie points should receive WP and should refrain from future discussions on the topic if they will keep minimizing people’s valid experiences with the religion.

I just read ur post and u know what? This is very true, victims of religious extremism are affected much more than those who are assaulted for their religious beliefs..

[wastedpotential]

It's clear that some users in this thread are trying to approach Islam with the same understanding that they do Christianity. While the religions come from a similar place, they have diverged enough across history that making claims like "Allah's connection with practitioners of Islam" or "what Islam means to individuals" is patently not true for Islam, though they've generally become acceptable for Christians under recent scholarship. A key difference between them, relevant for this conversation, is that Jesus founded a religion and then died, whereas Muhammed founded a religion and then an empire, whose legal texts and frameworks remain applicable to Islam and Islamic interpretation today. Because of this, modern Christians generally have to forge their own connection to God and can choose to interpret the Bible how they see, since it comes from so many sources, only a small portion of which comes from the "Son of God". Islam, on the other hand, has a very detailed text that gives both the foundational story of their religion, and then follows it up with strict rules and guidelines also given by Allah's chosen prophet that must be followed to "properly" practice Islam. Therefore, it's valid to say that Christianity is truly up to interpretation and that what really matters to reach Heaven is the strength of one's relationship with God, either by following Church guidelines (Catholicism), or by being a good person (most forms of Protestantism). Islam gives a very specific path to Jannah that must be followed. 

 

Of course, this is just my understanding of these religions (so please correct me if I'm wrong), and it also only applies to the broader "accepted scholarship" of each. There are extremely conservative Christian and Muslim scholars, just as there are extremely progressive Christian and Muslim scholars, but I tried to look at the most broadly used philosophies of each, those understood to be the "right interpretation" by the vast majority of Muslims and Christians. It's also worth pointing out that Christianity before the Protestant Reformation and the 18th century looked a lot more like Islam than it does now, and that ultimately, that girl's interpretation of the Quran is incorrect, because there really only is one proper interpretation.