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I tried explaining this to a girl at work who is a big swiftie, not in a disrespectful way, just that I cant identify with this and need something fiercer like Beyonce and she got mad.

Again? Joseph Kahn's response is priceless though

Also you know what? I've now decided to abandon the constant, perpetual "yes, Hamas is awful" disclaimer in several of the ""discussions"" I've been having online. I've said it too many times, and how many (or how few) times I say it has no bearing on the broader context. I've been seeing interviews of the Palestinian ambassador to the UK, who by the way represents Fatah - and the constant, incessant demands placed on him to condemn Hamas - something that he masterfully navigates, with patience and grace - is ridiculous, because HE DOES NOT REPRESENT OR SPEAK FOR HAMAS. It is a LITERAL oppositional party to Hamas???? This insidious burden placed upon the oppressed to constantly self-flagellate and apologize for the more radical, psychopathic reactionary factions that evolve from a shared goal is insane. 90% of the conversations he has been in is "WELL, DO YOU condemn Hamas?" as he once again explains that it is not something he flipped a switch on, and it is not even related to him or the people he represents. Ironically, the language when speaking to Israeli government officials rarely veers into "do you regret the deaths of hundreds of Gazans", and if the conversation even goes there, a sort "hm yea sad but LOL war amirite" response usually placates the journalist asking that question. The bias could not be clearer, and you do not have to have a degree in communication, language, political science, international relations or whatever to see what is so brazenly going on here. It is even more perverse when the Western media will not only never recognize or meaningfully cover the factions within the PL that have been carrying out tactical military operations, with mixed results - such a story is a harder emotional sell than murdered babies, presumably - and in the cruel instances that it does recognize other parties (such as this one), it wants them to prostate over for an entity that itself snatched power from said party. Enough. So yeah. FREE Palestine. Once you Free Palestine, you also end the suffering of civilians across BOTH nations.

At this point it may just be more efficient for her to stab Will Smith on camera? Surely that is quicker and less excruciating than this?

everything i know about them as a couple has been learned against my will jada is so annoying sorry

Thank you for thinking of me. There's simply too much chaos going on and no energy to engage in social media/internet activities. But I'm well.

Why are certain people making such a complex matter a black and white thing? It’s 100% FREE PALESTINIANS AND praying for the actual innocent lives that were lost who were a casualty in this war. Plus, to also keep in mind and not forget, that what the Israelis just went through is what Palestinians have been going through daily for the last 50+ so years. eta: Also, weren’t many of the deaths Noah speak of, debunked with some of the terrible images turning out to be actually from the horrors of what Palestinians went through

I've been waffling back and forth on whether or not to make this post because I know some people will (perhaps intentionally, in some cases) misinterpret it, but I figured I'd share my perspective for the benefit of people who are at least interested in understanding what the other side is thinking, even if you disagree with it. Not to be cheesy and naive, but I think if this conflict ever does end, it'll be because people on both sides are finally willing to at least understand the other side's concerns, even if they don't think those concerns justify the actions that result from them. My own understanding of this conflict stems from the fact that I went through Jewish schooling for 12 years where students were subjected to an extremely one-sided, propagandist, pro-Israel education of the conflict, which I then spent many years unlearning. I'm now firmly against the vast majority (if not the entirety) of the current Israeli government's actions and believe that the Israeli government is actively and intentionally perpetuating this conflict by committing numerous long-time and ongoing human rights violations against Palestinians. Even though I've gotten to that position myself, I'm surrounded by a lot of close friends and family members who are firmly pro-Israel and fall squarely in the "Israel has the right to defend itself, no matter how aggressively it does so" camp. While some of them are right-wing in many aspects of politics, a lot of them are very left-wing and progressive on practically every other political issue other than the Israel/Palestine conflict. So I figured I'd share the most common concerns I hear from those people. To be extremely clear (not that it will stop some people from reading this post in bad faith anyways), I'm not endorsing these concerns nor am I remotely suggesting they come close to justifying the crimes that the Israeli government has and continues to commit against Palestinians. But what I do strongly feel is that it's extremely counterproductive to write off every pro-Israel person as fundamentally evil and bigoted and to wave off the nuances of this conflict when many of the people doing the hand waving likely don't have any close personal connections to Palestinians or Israelis. So if anyone's interested, here's some of the perspective I've gained from being surrounded by a lot of pro-Israel people in my life: 1) The biggest obstacle to peace on the pro-Israel side is that most of them fundamentally do not believe that the Jewish people in Israel (or frankly at large) will be safe from harm if the occupation ends, mostly due to the continued existence of Hamas. I very often see posts along the lines of "if Israel ended the occupation today, the conflict would end" on social media - pro-Israel people will never be convinced of that while Hamas still has any sort of leadership position in Palestine. Honestly, this is probably the fear I sympathize with the most. What often goes ignored on social media is that up until just a few years ago, the Hamas Charter had numerous directly antisemitic statements in it that essentially called for the eradication of the Jewish people. Those comments aren't in the current Charter, but they've left a permanent impression on how the pro-Israel Jewish population views Hamas. These people are genuinely fearful that if Israel stopped exerting military power over a Hamas-led Palestine, Hamas would attempt to systematically murder as many Jewish people as possible. This conflict has zero chance of ever ending while Hamas is still in power because you will never convince most pro-Israel people that Hamas is solely interested in a free Palestine and they wouldn't commit or incite further violence against Jewish people after that. 2) The "anti-Zionism /=/ antisemitism" point is more complex than well-educated, politically engaged people can see. For what it's worth, I personally strongly believe in a separation of the Jewish religion and Zionism and even believed that back when I was still being "brainwashed" about Israel in school. But it's easy for myself and for the type of person who will see this post - who is more politically engaged and consistently online than the average pro-Israel supporter - to understand that concept. Most older pro-Israel Jewish people aren't seeing the nuanced discussions online; they're seeing videos like the "gas the Jews" chant that just took place in Australia or the Facebook comments where people describe Jews as a cancer that should have been wiped out in the Holocaust so that this conflict wouldn't have happened. It's absolutely true that anti-Zionism doesn't inherently equal antisemitism, but it's also true that there are many anti-Zionists who are also antisemitic. So a lot of pro-Israel Jewish people feel gaslit when they're told that this conflict has nothing to do with antisemitism, and that leads them to overreact in the opposite direction and assume that all anti-Zionists must be antisemites who just don't want to admit they're antisemitic. 3) A lot of the pro-Israel position ultimately comes down to a combination of a very intentional and coordinated misinformation campaign in Jewish communities and cultural/societal pressure. Zionist advocacy groups spend a TON of money and effort making sure that their version of history is the only version that Jewish people learn. Essentially all of the top donors of my Jewish high school were Zionists, so the school was basically forced to teach that incredibly lopsided history. Growing up, I never learned that Israel was illegally building settlements in the West Bank. I never learned that Israel controlled essentially all of Gaza's resources. I literally never even learned that Palestine was recognized as a legally separate entity from Israel - Gaza and the West Bank were always framed as areas of Israel that were controlled by Palestinian groups and were the subject of controversy. That severe lack of education is what leads to the seemingly hypocritical reactions by pro-Israel people who have been traumatized by the deaths of Israeli civilians this weekend but have never spoken out about the deaths of Gazans. A lot of them literally don't know it's happening because Zionist advocacy groups work extremely hard to keep them in the dark. And what's worse, that lack of information is compounded by a lot of pressure within the community to be pro-Israel in order to be a "good Jew." I can't even count the number of extremely heated arguments I had with my own family members as I was unlearning the pro-Israel version of history. It's very difficult to talk about with friends and family because, like I said above, even people who are otherwise very progressive across all other social issues are staunchly pro-Israel due to their own lack of education on the subject. So the cycle never ends - the biased education keeps happening, and most people don't unlearn that education because the people who try often end up feeling a sense of guilt and betrayal to their families and larger culture. I know it can be frustrating to be told not to view the people who are clearly supporting bad things as bad people, but it's a lot more complicated than that. Anyways, I don't really have a larger point with this post. To be honest, writing it up is probably just a form of therapy for me as I grapple with the stress and internal tension of being pro-Palestine myself while also not wanting to see people in my life that I care about being written off as irredeemable villains when I know why many of them feel the way they do (even if I disagree with it). I very likely won't be responding to any quotes of this (from either side) because my intention isn't to try to wade into the debate myself, but I think everybody on all sides could use a reminder that conflicts almost never get solved by one side refusing to understand what's going on in the minds of the other side.

A little context if you care to listen I find myself in a **** position The fan that I love sat me down last night And he told me that it's over, dumb decision

This is such a dangerous, disingenuous framing of the situation. The dispute is the cause of the violence. You can not separate the current uprising from the longer history of Israeli occupation. There's zero value in talking about the violence is some abstract, distinct matter as if it is not directly, irrevocably connected to the history of the region. And the desire to present this framing is literally only useful for people who want to uncritically support Israel.

i’d let will destroy me

The way his post starts like "i want peace for everyone! stop this madness!!” and then it goes like “you're either supporting Israel or you're a terrorist”

The report

It might be time to realize you missed the point of the album.

Joseph’s response as if she could dance any better on her tour pfff

in 3..2..1.......

These new swifties will never know the years of service on the frontlines it takes defending our polarizing overlord.

Eh, at-least she was honest. Tove Lo cancelled my show the night before and rescheduled it 4 months later on a Monday night didn't give a word as to why.

Not the 2 hour drive offer, how tone deaf

if only they used a Galaxy S23 Ultra... we could've seen all the details

As someone that doesn't really speak english as a first language, I try my best to fully articulate myself here, but sometimes it is hard to not feel a bit anxious about that getting in the way of my message, especially on such a sensitive topic. Thank you, sis. Your posts here definitely make the communist experience on ATRL feel less lonely. We haven't interacted much on this board, but I'd also like to share that I thought of you these past few days. I love reading your in-depth takes here. I've seen you multiple times being kind, thoughtful and helpful to other members that admitted to not know much about the Palestinian struggle, but wanted to learn more. Your voice is deeply appreciated. Good to hear you're doing well despite everything.

She's bigger than them once you divide their success by the number of members and add male privilege tax

get them for me cousin

She probably signed a contract with JYP right right before leaving, where she is never allowed to reveal the reason for her departure from the group, which is the same with Woojin etc. Otherwise they will get sued and blacklisted form the industry. Though at least JYP is allowing them a second chance in the industry unlike evil and horrible SM, who blacklists anyone who isn’t tied to the company anymore

I'm so tired of gays yelling "dAtEd1!!!11" as if it means it's bad and pretending anything that's supposedly "timeless" is automatically superior/good.

The most nuanced take of the present issue I’ve read this far

She has never won a grammy? Regardless how you feel about her that’s such a joke. Idk why anyone takes the Grammys more seriously than the Kids Choice Awards, and I say that as someone whose faves are generally Grammy darlings

Should've been love is embarrassing

Is it immoral for someone to buy the labor of someone else to cut down a tree, clean their home, walk their dog? Is it immoral for someone to sell their labor doing those things? Is it immoral to buy a cup of coffee from Starbucks when you could make it at home? Is it immoral to buy it when you have someone that could make it themselves for you because they want to? The answer to these questions is, obviously, NO. Do not judge the people buying a service - there are people that need physical touch without the ability to get it otherwise, there are people that want to have sex with someone attractive, there are people that will pay to have a specific fantasy. NONE of which is ANY of your dusty concern!

Midnights is super mediocre and anything Taylor put out would've smashed given how big she is currently. The melodies range from ok to nonexistant. The production tends to be a bit stiff and lifeless. People can bring up the LyRiCs and MaTurItY all they want, but they ain't jack either. Not when the album has immature turds like Vigilante Sh*t, Karma, Question, and Bejewled. Boring. Next.

Midnight is Taylor's worst album after her debut, it absolutely doesn't deserve its success and it's probably just a compilation of vault songs that she put together ("This is a collection of music written in the middle of the night, a journey through terrors and sweet dreams" my a**).

Taylor Swift

There is a huge difference between "babies were beheaded" and "babies were killed". Literally not a single soul here is denying the latter? It's still ******* awful. It is however very important to point out that the former fabricated claim was made to portray Palestinians as "barbaric, violent, and blood-thirsty Arabs" giving Israel an easy "excuse" that they’ll use for committing further genocide against Palestinian children, women, and civilians. Notice how this fake claim already has more reports internationally than the +260 children killed in Gaza.

Okay, you're telling me that you're still shocked and outraged by the fake beheading of babies that was debunked and proven to have been propagated by the Israeli military, reported by an ignorant and irresponsible journalist, and immediately disseminated by the world's largest media outlets in the United States and Europe... .....but you have no problem with the widely documented incineration of Palestinians with white phosphorous which is a violation of International Law. Are Palestinian children really less worthy of your rage and sympathy? Do you even hear yourself?

If that’s true then the Oscars incident is even more bizarre

The quotes crucifying someone who was a child victim of violence for not wanting other children to face the same fate as her. Some people are beyond help

After that, it feels important to highlight these below posts from before from users who always speak with both consideration and sincerity (with all 3 being far more eloquent and in-tune to many of the experiences being touched on than myself could be [praise to a myriad of other users as well, of course]): (I'm also thinking of @Jjang in times like this and hope they're doing okay. ) Thank you for your words. It feels almost silly to use emojis in such discussions but it feels important to take time to thank those who always bring clarity to such discussions, especially when times have seen such vitriol grow on ATRL in recent months.

Nobody off of this site cares, remembers, or even thinks about Britney’s peak. Musically, she is as “yesterdays news” as yesterdays news can get for the last decade+, and here’s where it’ll really ruffle some feathers: I don’t think it’s because of conservatorship. She was always meant to be a fad and a capture in time who caught magic. She’d have declined and became irrelevant even if her personal life wasn’t a mess. She’d never have the true staying power of actual artists with legit unique talents like Beyonce or Taylor Swift

Also it’s SO interesting to me how people can say ‘the hypocrisy to support Ukraine but not Israel’ like… WHAT? I’ve heard it a couple times these last few days but it’s literally impossible for me to get how you can support Ukraine AND Israel? Like you either support a settler-colonizer state or you don’t, you either support Ukraine and Palestine or you support Russia and Israel. The cognitive dissonance you would need to mix these up

as if performing on Jimmy Fallon in 2023 helped anyone

The misogynist gays will always pick apart every woman. You can be a great dancer, but you "don't write songs". You're a great songwriter but you can't hit the whistle note so you're trash. Disgusting

The Hamas sympathizers in here are really something... Imagine supporting or understanding a terror organization that committed war crimes only parable to ISIS in recent known history whilst thinking your views are progressive liberal or left leaning, or pro human rights in general. People here trying to deny the basic facts that are being heavily reported by all sources such as that civilians were raped, babies beheaded, hundreds of 18-30 year old shot and kidnapped while on drugs tripping etc in the peak of a music festival, entire innocent families abused tortured in unfathomable ways then killed or kidnapped, all of it filmed on phones by terrorists then shared on Telegram groups, posted on Facebook walls from the victim's phones, sent to parents looking for their missing children, it's the most basic unimaginable barbaric scenario which the western realm has fought and tried so hard to minimizes in the world for a better future just so you can all sit on here and try to simp for sadistic terrorists, it's really something...

i'm always going to wonder what they cooked up sans angel down and how it sounded - wasn't it rumored they had a song called frankenstein? people in this base have written off redone to be dated in production and whatnot but his songs specifically with gaga sonically doesn't compare to his others... even if you wanna cross reference a dark pop dance song like 'mannequin factory' by porcelain black vs. judas or scheisse, he had a certain magic with gaga. i'd be here to see what they could do in the future (dance pop oriented of course)

Ari Lennox very much happened in all the right spaces.

After catching up with the thread, I want to say once again that nobody wants to see innocent civilians getting killed, and I wish we didn't have to see videos of literal children (Palestinian and Israeli) being murdered like that. No one is exonerating Hamas. I thought it goes without saying, but we have to keep repeating it. That being said, you really can't claim that you "want peace" and still support Israel in the same breath, or fail to see that all of what's happening now is a result of Israel's ongoing illegal occupation. If you want peace and want violence to end, you don't look at the symptoms, you address the root cause which is the decades of oppression that preceded this. Hamas exists because of Israel, not the other way around. Another important detail that many people seem to forget is that Israel literally backed and funded Hamas in the 80s as a way to combat and tackle the more secular Fatah/PLO. It was a classic divide/conquer policy in hopes that religious extremism would delegitimize the entire cause and the idea of a Palestinian state. They have obviously found value in this because Hamas = an excuse for collective punishment and retaliation. Israel has turned Gaza into the largest open-air prison in the world and has subjected Palestinians there to sub-human living conditions, daily humiliation, violent series of massacres, and human rights abuses for years. The pick-and-choose approach that many users on this site like doesn't work here. There is an occupier (Israel) and an occupied land (Palestine). There is an oppressor (Israel) and an oppressed (Palestinians) side and no amount of gaslighting or defense of an apartheid regime shrouded in claims of being "against antisemitism!", "against terrorism!", or "for women and gay rights!" will ever change this fact. I'm sorry (not sorry) to burst your bubble, but you are really not more intelligent if you keep both-sidesing a conflict where only one side has the ability to cut basic life utilities and systemically starve millions, and the other side is trapped inside facing constant massacres and being used as an experimental ground for new weapons. One side is imposing an apartheid regime. Two can't. This is an inherently flawed position and being neutral is just as bad as supporting the oppressor, even if your "intentions are good" or claim that you want "peace for everyone". There’s also no shortage of condemnation of Hamas by media outlets internationally, but the absolute silence about Israel's medieval tactics and the last few decades of brutality and abuse against Palestinian citizens leads to this illusion that the Hamas attacks were unprovoked. Yes, innocent civilians dying is absolutely horrific. But do you know what’s even more horrific? The longest-running military occupation in history. Free Palestine, from the river to the sea. 🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸

THE BIGGEST ARTIST OF THE CENTURY

taylor swift has a lot of mean and suspicious personality traits that the swifties don't want to acknowledge