news 21,000 scientists now sign article urging humanity to ditch meat

[ChooseyLover]

I'd also like to add a plant based diet is not that expensive or hardly accessible. Rice, beans, chickpeas, some fruit, pasta (regular or made of legumes), textured vegetable protein, seasoning, lentils, peas, potatoes, broccoli, soy milk... most of these things are cheaper than some meats people eat many times a week. A plant based diet can be as expensive/cheap as you want it to be really.
 

But I agree some plant based items should be subsidized because there is no reason why they should have to be more expensive than the animal based ones.

[Matchatea]

20 hours ago, Anthinos said:

I've already done it and I don't miss it one bit. I'm a vegan. I understand that it's difficult for many people for various reasons, but you don't have to do a 180 degree turnaround straight away. You can start by slowly reducing and adjusting.

Why do so many vegan recipes have nuts… if I eat any tree nut, I'm DEAD. I would be vegan otherwise 

[modeblock]

23 hours ago, Sazare said:

the way omnivores get so pressed and defensive over things like this that they end up doubling down on their meat eating  Making their cognitive dissonance everyone else's problem

the way human beings are not herbivores and we can't exist purely on plants - argue with MOTHER NATURE  

[Sazare]

Just now, modeblock said:

the way human beings are not herbivores and we can't exist purely on plants - argue with MOTHER NATURE  

? People can and do exist on plants every day. Do you think vegans are faking it?

[modeblock]

7 minutes ago, Sazare said:

? People can and do exist on plants every day. Do you think vegans are faking it?

Sure with modern technology and supplements, and I have never in my life met a vegan that looks healthy, sorry. Human beings need animal protein for optimal health. The cognitive dissonance seems to be projected from vegans who can't accept that they are human beings who happen to be carnivorous-leaning omnivorous creatures, but you want to pretend that's not true so you "save the planet" and look down on others who aren't wiling to give up eating meat. Sad. 

Edited October 15 by modeblock

[Sazare]

Just now, modeblock said:

Sure with modern technology and supplements, and I have never in my life met a vegan that looks healthy, sorry.

Wow that's a really persuasive anecdote. I'm totally swayed by what you, ATRL user @modeblock, claim to have seen and by your nebulous definition of what "looks healthy," despite the troves of scientific evidence to the contrary.

 

Yes I'm sure it's the vegans who are projecting

[modeblock]

1 hour ago, Sazare said:

Wow that's a really persuasive anecdote. I'm totally swayed by what you, ATRL user @modeblock, claim to have seen and by your nebulous definition of what "looks healthy," despite the troves of scientific evidence to the contrary.

 

Yes I'm sure it's the vegans who are projecting

That's not all I said, but good on you for latching on to that and ignoring the rest. I don't care about convincing anyone (two of my best friends are lifelong vegans), but it's good to realize your dogmatic veganism isn't going to save you or the planet because it's going against human nature in a very fundamental way. Good luck!

[Sazare]

2 minutes ago, modeblock said:

That's not all I said, but good on you for latching on to that and ignoring the rest. I don't care about convincing anyone (two of my best friends are lifelong vegans), but it's good to realize your dogmatic veganism isn't going to save you or the planet because it's going against human nature in a very fundamental way. Good luck!

I latched on to those parts because it was the easiest to seize upon in a pithy retort; I assure the rest of your comment was also piffle.

 

You're literally just clinging to a naturalistic fallacy; what's "natural" to humans is not always good, and what's good, either for the individual or on a global scale, is not always natural. Practically nothing about our day to day lives in the modern age is in accordance with the natural order anyway, and even if it were that wouldn't make it intrinsically good.
 

Nothing dictates — no, not even "nature" if it were capable of such a thing — that humans eat meat.  Herbivorous humans have existed for millennia; we are not obligate carnivores unlike, say, cats. There's no biological, moral, rational, or nAtUraL imperative to eat meat, your anecdotes and strawmen be damned.

 

Like, feel free keep eating meat but don't delude yourself into believing that it's justified by anything other than personal convenience and a kneejerk reaction to some deep-seated feelings of moral inferiority that vegans evidently stir up within you. Because I assure you no one else here is fooled.

[Sazare]

"People can't live off plants!!!!"

Yes they can and do and have done for ages

"Well the people who do aren't healthy!!!"

There is plenty of research indicating there health benefits to switching to a plant-based diet, and countless examples of healthy people who are vegan/vegetarian

"Well it's not natural!!!!"

 

Like, the moving of the goalposts with increasingly incoherent and fallacious arguments is just sad to watch  There are understandable reasons not to go vegan/vegetarian (e.g. geography, cost in some places, some conditions making it extremely burdensome) but damn it's like I'm talking to Ben Shapiro's abattoir shift manager cousin

[Into The Void]

On 10/14/2024 at 1:21 PM, NEX said:

This is genuinely gross. I tend to get oat milk, but when you see $8 prices for a tiny (less than 1L) bottle of oat milk that only has 3 ingredients (oats, water, salt) you start to wonder what they are charging you for. Oats are dirt cheap and doesn't cost much to extract flavourful liquid out of them. Water component of it is almost free and so is salt. It's packaged in a plastic or paper bottle which is dirt cheap. So what are you charging 8$ for when it cost you less than 20/30 cents to produce it???

Because fatty stuff is cheaper they went to make and keep people fat lol

[GraceRandolph]

4 hours ago, modeblock said:

the way human beings are not herbivores and we can't exist purely on plants - argue with MOTHER NATURE  

[MatiRod]

[Armani?]

13 hours ago, modeblock said:

Sure with modern technology and supplements, and I have never in my life met a vegan that looks healthy, sorry. Human beings need animal protein for optimal health. The cognitive dissonance seems to be projected from vegans who can't accept that they are human beings who happen to be carnivorous-leaning omnivorous creatures, but you want to pretend that's not true so you "save the planet" and look down on others who aren't wiling to give up eating meat. Sad. 

What supplements? The only one vast majority have to take is Vitamin B12 and it's not a "meat" Vitamin naturally

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7600829/

Quote

Conclusions: Mankai plant contains bioactive B₁₂ compounds and could serve as a B₁₂ plant-based food source.

 

[Mariano]

People that get so mad about the thought of not eating meat anymore truly remind me of religious lunatics and I'm not even vegan/vegeterian   Some of you look so unhinged and silly. Literally act the same way as some religious freaks when u tell them god isn't real and the bible is BS. 

 

[hallucinate]

[Aston Martin]

I will say that me having been vegan for five years has actually made my grocery bill a lot lower because the cheapest foods in the grocery store (rice, dried beans, potatoes, cabbage, bananas, peanuts/peanut butter, oats, frozen vegetables, and whatever produce is 50% off) are plant based and I live near a grocery store that regularly puts a lot of vegan substitutes at 50% off. Obviously that's a situation I'm lucky to be in, but even without the discounted vegan substitutes it's still cheaper than meat eating.  
 

Obviously more people going vegan would make the world a lot better place, but just eating less red meat would be a start. And the way anti-vegan people go ballistic when presenting the fact that factory farming is so damaging or that you can be healthy on an inexpensive plant-based diet needs to be studied

[A.R.L]

I'm not fully vegetarian yet, but I'm trying. I completely avoid red meat, though I haven't given up chicken and fish, but I'm working on reducing how meat much I eat.

 

That said, it's absolutely true that people around the world are overindulging, and what's worse is how some countries have disturbing practices of eating anything that moves and the cruel treatment of animals. I'm glad we're finally waking up to those monsters in the 21st century, thanks to the power of social media.

[Badgalbriel]

Do you guys seriously care about the future of humanity? I have such a hate relationship with the human race that i just cannot care about the future of the planet. 

 

Nature will come back. Animals will come back. We just have to make sure humans don't. 

[ScorpiosGroove]

good luck with that 

[pigeon]

23 minutes ago, A.R.L said:

I'm not fully vegetarian yet, but I'm trying. I completely avoid red meat, though I haven't given up chicken and fish, but I'm working on reducing how meat much I eat.

 

That said, it's absolutely true that people around the world are overindulging, and what's worse is how some countries have disturbing practices of eating anything that moves and the cruel treatment of animals. I'm glad we're finally waking up to those monsters in the 21st century, thanks to the power of social media.

Congrats! Even if you stop eating meat just for one meal a day, that makes a difference. People always treat this issue as black/white but even a small step to veganism/vegetarianism is a good start/difference

[FOCK]

16 hours ago, modeblock said:

because it's going against human nature in a very fundamental way.

First they came for the homosexuals, then - 

 

 

Anyway. Humanity remains one zoonotic disease outbreak away from being forced to reevaluate its consumption habits & arrogant disregard for animal life. 
 

That is, if the Earth's climate doesn't get us first. 
 

Get with it, or get got - it's not really up for debate at this stage? Any entity claiming otherwise can typically, evidently, be linked to the meat & dairy industry's self interest/funding/sponsorship. 
 

Veganism is not only a health issue. It's a climate issue. An emissions issue. A moral & philosophical issue. An indigenous rights & displacement issue. An air, soil & water issue. A world hunger issue. A slave labour issue. A mental health issue. An animal extinction issue. A big pharma issue. Etc…

 

And it's one of the simplest & most impactful things an individual can do to help combat the above, with personal health benefits as a bonus. It's not "perfect", but it's better. If it's viable for you to make the change, there's no worthwhile reason not to. If it isn't viable for you, just be honest with yourself about the reasons why & don't actively advocate against an initiative for good. Drink your oat milk. 

 

 

Edited October 16 by FOCK

[awesomepossum]

On 10/14/2024 at 1:46 PM, Anthinos said:

I've already done it and I don't miss it one bit. I'm a vegan. I understand that it's difficult for many people for various reasons, but you don't have to do a 180 degree turnaround straight away. You can start by slowly reducing and adjusting.

Let's see how long that lasts

[Vixen Eyes]

On 10/14/2024 at 1:52 PM, pisuke said:

I can go vegetarian, but vegan would be harder. I need my milk, yogurt, eggs and honey.

i would have to get my own chickens and cow(s) for those 

but ive already been mostly dairy-free pescatarian for the last 5 years.

[rzal]

I wish we promoted more plant based diets than total veganism which most people won't even attempt and even if they do, it's very hard to stick with it. 

On 10/14/2024 at 8:21 PM, NEX said:

This is genuinely gross. I tend to get oat milk, but when you see $8 prices for a tiny (less than 1L) bottle of oat milk that only has 3 ingredients (oats, water, salt) you start to wonder what they are charging you for. Oats are dirt cheap and doesn't cost much to extract flavourful liquid out of them. Water component of it is almost free and so is salt. It's packaged in a plastic or paper bottle which is dirt cheap. So what are you charging 8$ for when it cost you less than 20/30 cents to produce it???

Plant milk is basically the same price as normal where I live. Maybe few cents more. 

On 10/15/2024 at 3:53 PM, Matchatea said:

Why do so many vegan recipes have nuts… if I eat any tree nut, I'm DEAD. I would be vegan otherwise 

I barely eat any nuts, I probably should eat more tbh, so idk what recipes you mean

[BlondGuts]

On 10/14/2024 at 12:46 PM, Anthinos said:

I've already done it and I don't miss it one bit. I'm a vegan. I understand that it's difficult for many people for various reasons, but you don't have to do a 180 degree turnaround straight away. You can start by slowly reducing and adjusting.

Girl we ain't doing that