discussion Is massive immigration a bad thing?

[Communion]

21 minutes ago, Tropez said:

I don't really agree with this. Too many people from wealthy countries immigrate to poorer countries and drive up costs of living for people who lived there before. This is even happening in wealthy countries where in the EU, people could freely move between members. So as you could imagine housing in places like Greece or Portugal get more expensive as people with the means can afford it.
 

Housing shouldnt be a business, people need shelter to survive. Wealthy people shouldn't just buy up homes from other countries just because they think a place looks cool to become "digital nomads". There's like 800k Americans in Mexico right now. 

 

4 hours ago, shyboi said:

Thousands of americans, mostly white, privileged ones, are moving to México, and it's a mess, the gentrification is out of control

We seem to be talking about two different phenomenons:

:

4 hours ago, Communion said:

We should probably delineate that there's two different type of economic migrants:

- the often very highly educated and middle class kind who 'legally' migrate via work visas (what is referred to as brain drain) 

- those who are unwilling migrants who (often 'illegally') migrate due to collapsing or damaged economies, often working class migrants

Which again points to that the issue is ultimately class and requires class-based solutions.

You're not being denied housing by asylum seekers. You're being denied housing by global elites, whether that be the affluent in your own country or affluent migrant from abroad.

 

Migrants should be contextualized in the class character that they represent and belong to in their home country. 

[Tropez]

12 minutes ago, AvadaKedavra said:

This is happenin in Medellin in my country Colombia and people are hating the extranjeros more and more everyday cause the rent prices are too high now and the city is now turning into a place more for the people "outside" than the native ones. The inmigrants from US-Europe are also very messy and come for drugs and lookin for sex workers.  the rent in medellin is now like 4x times the average price in the rest of the cities of my country. 

I dont blame the inmigrants. I think the goverments should be the ones havin control of rents and how expensive things get and havin more laws for this types of situations or taxes. 
We are blaming inmigrants when the Goverments are the ones who should have some control over prices  Theyre so incompent or they only wanna benefit the rich
Canada is blaming all the inmigrants........But What is justin trudeau and the goverment doin to make things less expensive for canadian people? nothing
 

 

Yeah, which goes with one of my point. Housing shouldn't be a business or used as investment. It's all so messed up. People who own the property usually welcome wealthy immigrants because they can raise the price of the property and sell it for profit. And then refuse to build more housing to keep housing values high. With such low supply, the only people who can afford it are the wealthy whose currency is stronger than the local currency. So now locals can't even afford to live in their own country.  

[Domination]

Migrants often have to act as scabs and undeniably do weaken the labor force by being exploited by the owning class in addition to having to flee their home countries destroyed by war or economic conditions forced upon them by the global north. There should be nothing normal or necessary about mass migration.

[Tropical]

Obviously mass migration is bad - it's unmanageable and creates more inequality. 

[AvadaKedavra]

14 minutes ago, Domination said:

Migrants often have to act as scabs and undeniably do weaken the labor force by being exploited by the owning class in addition to having to flee their home countries destroyed by war or economic conditions forced upon them by the global north. There should be nothing normal or necessary about mass migration.

U made some points. Lookin the history of my country and neighboor countries and from africa,middle east and more.
They all were ruined by external influences from East Asia,Europe,Northamerica and ideals from those nations

Instead of blending into the countries like a good citizen...........I think its time for some reparations  
Ok whos' first  my bank account is ready   
 

 

Edited September 2 by AvadaKedavra

[BionicWooHoo]

The overarching theme of this thread seems to be the idea that massive waves of immigrants should somehow cause trouble due to limits in resources. However, the reality is that in the US at least, the idea that resources are limited is heavily heavily by corporations and the billionaires. They have the money to solve world hunger and homelessness but they choose not to. So in this case, don't blame the immigrants into the "lack of resources." Choose to blame the US govt and the billionaire class to collectively create these awful conditions overseas (oftentimes through proxy wars) such that these families have no choice other than to flee to other countries. 

[shyboi]

13 minutes ago, BionicWooHoo said:

The overarching theme of this thread seems to be the idea that massive waves of immigrants should somehow cause trouble due to limits in resources. However, the reality is that in the US at least, the idea that resources are limited is heavily heavily by corporations and the billionaires. They have the money to solve world hunger and homelessness but they choose not to. So in this case, don't blame the immigrants into the "lack of resources." Choose to blame the US govt and the billionaire class to collectively create these awful conditions overseas (oftentimes through proxy wars) such that these families have no choice other than to flee to other countries. 

 

[SapphireSky]

Yes of course it is

[Princess Aurora]

I think it's easy to point the finger at immigrants when it's something bigger than that. Many countries worldwide never or barely recovered from the 2008 financial crisis, China was barely affected for example but it's now going down that route due to the pandemic. Also, let's not forget there are different reasons such as climate change and many conflicts in many parts of the World that are causing mass immigration. If you wanna decrease immigration, maybe we should start fixing these issues. There should also be a reform regarding housing and landlords to make housing affordable for the new generations.... Deindustrialization also played a huge role in it, especially in countries like the UK and the US.

Edited September 2 by Princess Aurora

[Harrier]

Not in the way the right talks about it. Mass immigration can be a problem when wealthy people come in and displace poorer folks from the local population. We had a situation in my country where the massed return of international students after COVID - the majority of which are older teenagers being bankrolled by their wealthy parents - vastly exacerbated our housing crisis because they pushed out low income people from low-end apartment accommodation, including me personally. The international student who replaced me in my one bedroom apartment was willing to pay 60% more for it than I was - how could I possibly compete with that?

 

Our government is responding by capping international students, a move which I support because of my experience and what the data about it shows.

 

Meanwhile, asylum seekers often come in an work join the rest of us in the economy in a less disruptive way. So my overall point is that often the completely wrong people are talked about with this issue

[family.guy123]

Ask the Native Americans 

 

oh wait 

[liquiddiamonds]

Migration has always existed and it's been motivated for the same core motive for centuries: means of survival. There are many reasons why people migrate, but they are all based on survival instincts. If western countries were to look critically at those multiple reasons, they would point the fingers at themselves on a good chunk of them. The impoverishing continuous exploitation of non-western countries will only push people to migrate further. The climate crisis is the cherry on top and no one is going to stop looking for better opportunities over imaginary borders. Might as well build that wall and put the army to watch it, because it will only get worse if we don't solve the financial and climatic issues that plague most poor countries. The irony is that the West hasn't been the Western dream for westerners themselves, so very deep structural changes will have to be done if we don't want chaos in the coming years 

Edited September 2 by liquiddiamonds

[Patient Zero]

Nothing wrong with immigration when you want to add something of value to the society.

 

But a radical religous person should STAY AWAY. If you want your religious rules to become the new law, then it's better to just stay in the hellhole you escaped from. Why pollute other countries with your scheisse

Edited September 2 by Patient Zero

[shyboi]

the poll