8 minutes ago, SchmoodRing said:

Were Kygo, Calvin Harris, Dua Lipa, Blackpink, Kylie Minogue, Doja Cat, Zedd, Missy Elliott or Anitta not available or something 

Why would those artists even consider a collab with this flop? 

2 minutes ago, TayDuaStan said:

Why would those artists even consider a collab with this flop? 

you're still here?  @Element can this troll be thread-banned?

8 minutes ago, halcyonday said:

you're still here?  @Element can this troll be thread-banned?

Banning me from this thread won't change the fact that Katy has been flopping for almost a decade now and the chances of her getting any of the artists mentioned on a track produced by Dr. L*** are basically 0%

49 minutes ago, Ramcoro said:

Where is the Chris Brown rumors coming from?

twitter, saw it there, so who knows if its real or someone made it to bring more hate

12 hours ago, Illuminati said:

Katycats have been saying that but Bonnie isn't out there waiting for Katy to call her. She doesn't work with Dr Luke anymore, like many women he's worked with.

 

She also praised Kesha's Praying and Gaga's Till It Happens To You Oscars performance and literally called Dr Luke the devil, which makes me wonder if she knows something

I thought Bonnie was just a lyricist?
For example, I read that for Taoi Cruz's "Dyanmite", Dr. Luke and Benny Blanco made the instrumental; then they sent it to Max Martin to come up with writing the melody, and then Dr. Luke wrote the other parts of the melody(Max did half, Luke did half). The finished melody was completed and then all Bonnie did was placed lyrics to an already completed melody.

 

So why would they need her when they can grab anyone from Prescription Records to do the same?

Edited July 20, 20242 yr by Junipero

3 hours ago, longjohn9898 said:

Both 

So how is this trend following when this hasn't been a trend since 2010 according to you guys. 

1 hour ago, Ramcoro said:

I hate to jump back into this, but you do not prove your innocence, of ANY crime.  It is the state's burden (the prosecution) to prove guilty, not the other way around.  That is all I wanna say. I don't want to defend that guy at all, but let's not make up stuff about how criminal justice system works... 

But they didnt prove anything either lol, they settled, both Luke and Kesha to finish the court fight and Cats acting like that didnt happened and he was suddenly proved innocent lmao, he wasnt either, the suit was settled after idk how many years that ugly ass man dragged Kesha into a legal battle

31 minutes ago, Itz_Dani! said:

So how is this trend following when this hasn't been a trend since 2010 according to you guys. 

She's following trends. Just because you follow trends 10 years later doesn't mean you're not following trends. 

 

Katy Cats never getting past the IQ accusations 

1 hour ago, Junipero said:

I thought Bonnie was just a lyricist?
For example, I read that for Taoi Cruz's "Dyanmite", Dr. Luke and Benny Blanco made the instrumental; then they sent it to Max Martin to come up with writing the melody, and then Dr. Luke wrote the other parts of the melody(Max did half, Luke did half). The finished melody was completed and then all Bonnie did was placed lyrics to an already completed melody.

 

So why would they need her when they can grab anyone from Prescription Records to do the same?

The only thing I really know about Bonnie McKee is that she helped invent teenage dream and had that amazing notebook of alternate lyrics for that song that she helped brainstorm so yes she is a lyricist.

 

But it's only common sense that she contributed to the melody as well as the lyrics. Right? Like I thought you have to write the lyrics with a melody in mind, that it just doesn't land on an existing melody? Keep in mind that I know jackshit about music 

 

I do think it would have been more strategic for Katy to recruit the exact original team including Bonnie. That way it kind of justifies Dr. Luke's presence in a stronger way. She could have been like "oh we got the OG Teenage Dream crew back, I'm just bringing the whole dream team back." but. I'm not complaining seeing a lot of these other names on the credits though as a kim petras fan tbh

I don't understand, didn't she announce the track list and there is no chris brown there , where did this collab came from 

10 minutes ago, longjohn9898 said:

She's following trends. Just because you follow trends 10 years later doesn't mean you're not following trends. 

 

Katy Cats never getting past the IQ accusations 

No, following trends means following current trends.

 

If it's not a trend currently then there's no trend being followed.

There goes @Communion on a downvoting spree again.  He stays living in this thread 

This thread has 27 pages and nobody is discussing the song but the same 4 weeks old news.

 

basic and generic, but sounds better than woman's world, we kind of won

23 minutes ago, Itz_Dani! said:

There goes @Communion on a downvoting spree again.  He stays living in this thread 

Why wouldn't someone downvote a claim that Dr. Luke was exonerated in court? You now want no one to criticize Katy's decisions to work with Luke let alone don't want anyone to disagree with you or others trying to praise the man accused of rape? This isn't a Katy Perry forum. It's... a music forum with a thread about her music.

 

The below was meant as a reply to @Ramcoro but you can be told it if you're confused why people are going to downvote anyone defending or lying in defense of Luke.

 

Kesha could not accuse Dr. Luke of a crime in a court of law because the statute of limitations ran out. Thus a criminal trial could never take place despite Kesha being on record since 2005 consistently telling others the same story - that Dr. Luke gave her some kind of "sober pill" and she woke up naked in his bed in his hotel room in pain after Nicky Hilton's birthday. 

 

There were never any criminal cases filed and thus rhetoric like  "innocent until proven guilty" is arbitrary language. Both filed civil suits alleging to be victims of harm.

 

All that ended up being ruled in a court of law was:

• Kesha could not sue Dr. Luke / Kemosabe to be let out of her contract in California, despite being where Kemosabe operated business and where the assault took place, because of a stipulation in her contract that she would agree to address all legal issues within the jurisdiction of New York State;
• That being a victim of rape and workplace harassment does not justify the dissolving of a music recording contract, with the judge in Kesha's case against Dr. Luke / Kemosabe / Sony Music Entertainment in New York finding she could still deliver recorded music to Sony without needing to physically work with Luke and that Kesha's recording contract was negotiated by normal industry standards;
• That Luke could not sue Pebe Sebert for defamation in Tennessee or California due to lacking jurisdiction and that his defamation case against her in New York lacked merit;
• That Luke's defamation case against Kesha largely went nowhere for 3 years until the discovery of texts between Gaga and Kesha about what John Janick claimed about Katy, and that the court ruled these claims were not true; but the appeals court of New York State also found that Dr. Luke is a semi-public figure and thus Luke had to prove that Kesha made such statements with malicious intent. And thus Luke made a settlement offer instead of risking a jury trial where he'd have to prove Kesha's statement to Gaga was done with malicious intent AND still have to prove that Kesha's own claims of rape were untrue. 

If you're trying to litigate Kesha's case, then all the same people seemingly trying to defend Katy by making the insane claim that "Kesha was spreading gossip about Katy" should have to answer to that Luke admitted he would not be able to prove these claims were made by Kesha with malicious intent, and thus conceded that Kesha herself must have vehemently believed them to be true when repeating them to Gaga and earnestly believed Katy to be another victim of the same man. 

 

Dr. Luke's attorney literally petitioned the appeals court that he would have never filed a defamation case against Kesha if knowing he'd have to meet the burden of proof that Kesha acted in malicious intent over the claims she made and that this ruling was unfair - just days before settling out of court.

 

Maybe there should be a banner linking to a summary of what Kesha vs. Kemosabe and Dr. Luke vs. Kesha actually resulted in because it's insane to make posts that incorrectly claim that Dr. Luke "was proven an innocent man" or that he "was exonerated in a court of law" - all untrue - and then get mad such a post gets downvoted. You're literally perpetuating the same cycle you claim to be mad at via defending a rapist. 

Edited July 21, 20242 yr by Communion

35 minutes ago, frankgutz said:

But they didnt prove anything either lol, they settled, both Luke and Kesha to finish the court fight and Cats acting like that didnt happened and he was suddenly proved innocent lmao, he wasnt either, the suit was settled after idk how many years that ugly ass man dragged Kesha into a legal battle

Depending on who you mean by "they." I might agree with you. Lol 

 

I think we, ATLR community in general, are confusing criminal cases with civil cases. 

 

They settled a civil case. There was never a criminal case, because of statute of limitations, IIRC. Terms like "innocent" or "guilty" are for criminal cases. Civil cases do not determine guilt or innocence. They determine whether someone is responsible for damages. Regardless, it's not up to the respondent (Dr. Luke) to prove his no responsible. The burden of proof in a civil case is on the plaintiff (Kesha), similar to how the prosecution in a criminal case has to prove. The defendant/plaintiff does not have to prove their innocence. This is a GOOD thing because that could be impossible to prove your innocence when you are falsely accused or there is a misunderstanding (I am NOT saying that's what happened here, but we all know there are plenty of examples of that happening in the US criminal justice system). 

 

Let's forget Dr. Luke counter-sued for defamation, so in that case, Dr. Luke was the plaintiff who had the burden of proof and Kesha was the respondent. It's a good thing Kesha did not have to prove her innocence of defamation. Dr. Luke had to prove that and I believe a judge decided in Dr. Lukes's favor, IIRC. I am not sure of the details of the settlement, out-of-court settlements are not part of public record. Honestly, I'm guessing both signed a NDA or some agreement to not talk about considering Kesha has not spoken about it publicly, but I might be wrong.  

 

Anyways, back to the presumption of innocence, Dr. Luke is innocent until proven guilty. It may be a technicality due to the statute of limitations, and whether you like it or not or whether he did it or not, he is innocent until proven guilty. I hate sounding like his lawyer. I don't like the guy, I just like the music of one person who works with the guy. I say this as someone who graduated with poli sci and was pre-law, presumption of innocence is a good thing and is the cornerstone of a fair justice system.                

5 minutes ago, Communion said:

Why wouldn't someone downvote a claim that Dr. Luke was exonerated in court? You now want no one to criticize Katy's decisions to work with Luke let alone don't want anyone to disagree with you or others trying to celebrate and praise the man accused of rape? This isn't a Katy Perry forum. It's... a music forum with a thread about her music.

 

The below was meant for @Ramcoro but you can be told it if you're confused why people are going to downvote anyone defending or lying in defense of Luke.

 

Kesha could not accuse Dr. Luke of a crime in a court of law because the statute of limitations ran out. Thus a criminal trial could never take place despite Kesha being on record since 2005 consistently telling others the same story - that Dr. Luke gave her some kind of "sober pill" and she woke up in his bed in pain after Nicky Hilton's birthday. 

 

There were never any criminal cases filed and those rhetoric like  "innocent until proven guilty" is arbitrary language. Both filed civil suits alleging to be victims of harm.

 

All that ended up being ruled in a court of law was:

• Kesha could not sue Dr. Luke / Kemosabe to be let out of her contract in California, despite being where Kemosabe operated business and where the assault took place, because of a stipulation in her contract that she would agree to address all legal issues within the jurisdiction of New York State;
• That being a victim of rape and workplace harassment does not justify the dissolving of a music recording contract, with the judge in Kesha's case against Dr. Luke / Kemosabe / Sony Music Entertainment in New York finding she could still deliver recorded music to Sony without needing to physically work with Luke and that Kesha's recording contract was negotiated by normal industry standards;
• That Luke could not sue Pebe Sebert for defamation in Tennessee or California due to lacking jurisdiction and that his defamation case against her in New York lacked merit;
• That Luke's defamation case against Kesha largely went nowhere for 3 years until the discovery of texts between Gaga and Kesha about what John Janick claimed about Katy, and that the court ruled these claims were not true; but the appeals court of New York State also found that Dr. Luke is a semi-public figure and thus Luke had to prove that Kesha made such statements with malicious intent. And thus Luke made a settlement offer instead of risking a jury trial where he'd have to prove Kesha's statement to Gaga was done with malicious intent AND still have to prove that Kesha's own claims of rape were untrue. 

If you're trying to litigate Kesha's case, then all the same people seemingly trying to defend Katy by making the insane claim that "Kesha was spreading gossip about Katy" should have to answer to that Luke admitted he would not be able to prove these claims were made by Kesha with malicious intent, and thus conceded that Kesha herself must have vehemently believed them to be true when repeating them to Gaga and earnestly believed Katy to be another victim of the same man. 

 

Dr. Luke's attorney literally petitioned the appeals court that he would have never filed a defamation case against Kesha if knowing he'd have to meet the burden of proof that Kesha acted in malicious intent over the claims she made and that this ruling was unfair - just days before settling out of court.

 

Maybe there should be a banner linking to a summary of what Kesha vs. Kemosabe and Dr. Luke and Kesha actually resulted in because it's insane to make posts that incorrectly claim that Dr. Luke is "was proven an innocent man" or that he was exonerated in a court of law - all untrue - and then get mad such a post gets downvoted. You're literally perpetuating the same cycle you claim to be mad at via defending a rapist. 

See my post before. It is not arbitrary language.  If you think that is arbitrary, that's like saying free speech is arbitrary. Like move to North Korea or recreate Nazi Germany if you wanna live in a witch-hunt society, some kind of neo-McCarthyism, where  not only people are assumed guilty until proven otherwise, but people who work for those who had allegations are also deemed "just as bad."  Damn, 1950's is that you? Red Scare is back! 

8 minutes ago, Communion said:

Why wouldn't someone downvote a claim that Dr. Luke was exonerated in court? You now want no one to criticize Katy's decisions to work with Luke let alone don't want anyone to disagree with you or others trying to celebrate and praise the man accused of rape? This isn't a Katy Perry forum. It's... a music forum with a thread about her music.

 

The below was meant for @Ramcoro but you can be told it if you're confused why people are going to downvote anyone defending or lying in defense of Luke.

 

Kesha could not accuse Dr. Luke of a crime in a court of law because the statute of limitations ran out. Thus a criminal trial could never take place despite Kesha being on record since 2005 consistently telling others the same story - that Dr. Luke gave her some kind of "sober pill" and she woke up in his bed in pain after Nicky Hilton's birthday. 

 

There were never any criminal cases filed and those rhetoric like  "innocent until proven guilty" is arbitrary language. Both filed civil suits alleging to be victims of harm.

 

All that ended up being ruled in a court of law was:

• Kesha could not sue Dr. Luke / Kemosabe to be let out of her contract in California, despite being where Kemosabe operated business and where the assault took place, because of a stipulation in her contract that she would agree to address all legal issues within the jurisdiction of New York State;
• That being a victim of rape and workplace harassment does not justify the dissolving of a music recording contract, with the judge in Kesha's case against Dr. Luke / Kemosabe / Sony Music Entertainment in New York finding she could still deliver recorded music to Sony without needing to physically work with Luke and that Kesha's recording contract was negotiated by normal industry standards;
• That Luke could not sue Pebe Sebert for defamation in Tennessee or California due to lacking jurisdiction and that his defamation case against her in New York lacked merit;
• That Luke's defamation case against Kesha largely went nowhere for 3 years until the discovery of texts between Gaga and Kesha about what John Janick claimed about Katy, and that the court ruled these claims were not true; but the appeals court of New York State also found that Dr. Luke is a semi-public figure and thus Luke had to prove that Kesha made such statements with malicious intent. And thus Luke made a settlement offer instead of risking a jury trial where he'd have to prove Kesha's statement to Gaga was done with malicious intent AND still have to prove that Kesha's own claims of rape were untrue. 

If you're trying to litigate Kesha's case, then all the same people seemingly trying to defend Katy by making the insane claim that "Kesha was spreading gossip about Katy" should have to answer to that Luke admitted he would not be able to prove these claims were made by Kesha with malicious intent, and thus conceded that Kesha herself must have vehemently believed them to be true when repeating them to Gaga and earnestly believed Katy to be another victim of the same man. 

 

Maybe there should be a banner linking to a summary of what Kesha vs. Kemosabe and Dr. Luke and Kesha actually resulted in because it's insane to make posts that incorrectly claim that Dr. Luke is "was proven an innocent man" or that he was exonerated in a court of law - all untrue - and then get mad such a post gets downvoted. 

I'm not reading this novel 

 

The thing is, you claim you're downvoting posts that claim Dr Luke is innocent, or defending Katy's decisions, which is valid, but no, I literally see you downvoting every post, those only talking about the song & how they liked the snippet. 
 

Hiding your hatred & your petty desire for stan wars behind a holier than thou "social warrior" facade is not fooling us. Drop that BS. 

11 minutes ago, Ramcoro said:

ee my post before. It is not arbitrary language. 

It is arbitrary language because the nature of the cases filed were not criminal cases but civil suits. 

 

Any defense of Dr. Luke that starts with "well he has never been convicted of a crime" is dishonest because his victim was blocked from filing a criminal case due to the statue of limitations running out on the crime in question, in part due to documented threats of retaliation against Kesha for telling anyone the story about what happened that night.

 

Debating the nuance of legal language is one thing. @'ing someone like another user did and angrily yelling at them for downvoting a post that essentially calls Kesha a liar is something totally different and has no merit being engaged with.  No one is - or should - downvote people just expressing liking the song. But it's not a defense of "I just want to enjoy Katy's music!!" to suggest no one's allowed to downvote posts that include things as egregious like false claims such as "Dr. Luke was proven innocent in court".

Edited July 21, 20242 yr by Communion

These f***ing 5000 word essays. Is anyone actually reading those keyboard warrior posts

 

 

4 minutes ago, Communion said:

It is arbitrary language because the nature of the cases filed were not criminal cases but civil suits. 

 

Any defense of Dr. Luke that starts with "well he has never been convicted of a crime" is dishonest because his victim was blocked from filing a criminal case due to the statue of limitations running out on the crime in question, in part due to documented threats of retaliation against Kesha for telling anyone the story about what happened that night.

 

Debating the nuance of legal language is one thing. @'ing someone like another user did and angrily yelling at them for downvoting a post that essentially calls Kesha a liar is something totally different and has no merit being engaged with.  No one is - or should - downvote people just expressing liking the song. But it's not a defense of "I just want to enjoy Katy's music!!" to suggest no one's allowed to downvote posts that include things as egregious like false claims such as "Dr. Luke was proven innocent in court".

No it's not honey. Go ask any lawyer. Go take a class or something.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presumption_of_innocence#:~:text=The presumption of innocence is,a judge or a jury).

 

Edit: I agree with you, it was a civil case. Like I said before, "guilty" is not something that occurs in civil cases. Even in civil cases, the plaintiff has the burden of proof. 

Edited July 21, 20242 yr by Ramcoro

when is this generic excellence coming

27 minutes ago, Itz_Dani! said:

literally see you downvoting every post

Hmmm I wonder why I downvoted these posts. Let's re-read them.

 

Spoiler

 

5 hours ago, NothingIsReal said:

pretty sure there's a thread to speak about that matter appropriately 

instead of presenting it in a "gotcha" moment fashion that is spammed on every thread 

It's very transparent in the replies, turning a very serious matter into a "drag".

You're turning people off to a woman's valid story by the way you're all presenting it,

and doing Kesha a disservice. 

5 hours ago, TOKYO. said:

Doesnt matter bcuz its about the fact that its produced and written by her abuser. She only likes to mk it when it does gain her something..

6 hours ago, TOKYO. said:

Its the hypocrisy, when kesha is recently promoting Blow. A luke track.. kesha still wants to gain profit from her luke songs.. doesnt that say something. Also the fights between fanbases regarding woman need to STOP

13 hours ago, AcidPrince said:

So, if people bullied you cause you are gay. And you are bullying someone else, its ok then? I dont get it.

Katy, a WOMAN, gets bullied online by gays who are bullied all the time in real life (something thats NOT OK). 
in life, we need to try to be a good person. I didnt see this type of bullying against Nicki Minaj or Doja Cat. This is gross.

11 hours ago, halcyonday said:

And then the Gaga Kesha convo got public in 2018 and she knew that Kesha was spreading lies behind her back.  

11 hours ago, halcyonday said:

That's no "desperate" defending. Just pointing out facts that Kesha and Gaga were saying about Katy something that wasn't true, and also were calling her mean. God knows who else heard from them these lies. The difference is that Gaga came through and showed her love for Katy, unlike Kesha. Katy called Kesha her friend 7 years ago. It's clear she doesn't feel this way anymore. 

11 hours ago, Jarr1507 said:

I'm sorry but Dr. Luke was never found guilty. So I don't understand why you keep calling him a r*pist. And Katy doesn't owe Kesha anything. Also let's be clear that Kesha is using all this to her advantage, because if it weren't for Katy, Joyshit didn't even have 300k daily streams.

10 hours ago, Jarr1507 said:

"A woman's rape story" But at the same time she INVENTED that another woman had been raped by the same guy just to be able to win a case is not very morally accepted either. As Kesha herself said it, only God knows what happened that night. Katy has nothing to do with any of this and she is free to work with whoever she wants or should.

6 hours ago, Nashe said:

Also there no legal grounds to call Luke an abuser when they settled the case

and you can whine about it how much you want. Katy is working with an innocent man 

 

This Ish't the avenue to express if you think someone is unfairly downvoting posts, let alone @'ing another user over it. 

Edited July 21, 20242 yr by Communion

24 minutes ago, Ramcoro said:

Depending on who you mean by "they." I might agree with you. Lol 

 

I think we, ATLR community in general, are confusing criminal cases with civil cases. 

 

They settled a civil case. There was never a criminal case, because of statute of limitations, IIRC. Terms like "innocent" or "guilty" are for criminal cases. Civil cases do not determine guilt or innocence. They determine whether someone is responsible for damages. Regardless, it's not up to the respondent (Dr. Luke) to prove his no responsible. The burden of proof in a civil case is on the plaintiff (Kesha), similar to how the prosecution in a criminal case has to prove. The defendant/plaintiff does not have to prove their innocence. This is a GOOD thing because that could be impossible to prove your innocence when you are falsely accused or there is a misunderstanding (I am NOT saying that's what happened here, but we all know there are plenty of examples of that happening in the US criminal justice system). 

 

Let's forget Dr. Luke counter-sued for defamation, so in that case, Dr. Luke was the plaintiff who had the burden of proof and Kesha was the respondent. It's a good thing Kesha did not have to prove her innocence of defamation. Dr. Luke had to prove that and I believe a judge decided in Dr. Lukes's favor, IIRC. I am not sure of the details of the settlement, out-of-court settlements are not part of public record. Honestly, I'm guessing both signed a NDA or some agreement to not talk about considering Kesha has not spoken about it publicly, but I might be wrong.  

 

Anyways, back to the presumption of innocence, Dr. Luke is innocent until proven guilty. It may be a technicality due to the statute of limitations, and whether you like it or not or whether he did it or not, he is innocent until proven guilty. I hate sounding like his lawyer. I don't like the guy, I just like the music of one person who works with the guy. I say this as someone who graduated with poli sci and was pre-law, presumption of innocence is a good thing and is the cornerstone of a fair justice system.                

I get the stand of cuz "the law bla bla bla" and whatever, that doesnt remove the fact he spend a decade bleeding Kesha money & harrass her through court after the allegations + lots of artists has been spoken of how horrid human being he is like Pink, Bebe Rexha, Bonnie lmao

 

We dont care how much yall try to white washing him cuz they settled

The preview seems catchy.

Kats, why are you even feeding those roaches? they are gonna hate her no matter what and spewing hate rather than using those energy that's actually useful for the community.

You are just giving those insects what they want. Just scroll through and swish swish bish.

 

Im claiming this energy to lead a positive life.