base talk Here's The Problem With Swifties (and all fanbases)

[PoisonedIvy]

Quote

Disclaimer: I know most ATRLers can't comprehend anything beyond 2 paragraphs or so, so the second half of this post is purely for the people with functioning brains and fully developed frontal lobes.

 

The intense loyalty of a fanbase — we'll use Taylor Swift's fans, known as "Swifties," as our example here — leads them to passionately defend their favorite artist whenever they are criticized by non-fans.
 

This cycle begins when a non-fan criticizes Swift, provoking a strong defensive response from her fans. In their defense, Swifties may also attack the interests of the non-fan, giving the impression that they are aggressive. This behavior can lead non-fans to perceive the fanbase as antagonistic, even though the Swifties are primarily reacting defensively.

The cycle perpetuates as non-fans, fueled by their negative perceptions, continue to criticize Swift and her fanbase, prompting further defensive and aggressive reactions from the Swifties. This continuous cycle reinforces the non-fans' negative opinions and results in the Swifties appearing more antagonistic, "validating" the preconceived criticisms and sustaining the conflict.

 

 

 

(The extended thoughts, or the "I ain't reading all that I'm happy for you tho or sorry that happened" edition.) 

 

 

If you think a fanbase are primarily the aggressors of conflicts, you tend to treat them with disrespect or disdain. When you treat them as such, you provoke them and they become defensive. Defensiveness is often coupled with aggression or retaliation, this is an observable reaction both in biology and sociology. This then "reinforces" your lack of respect for the fanbase, leading you to continue to treat them negatively. Leading them to remain defensive, and the cycle goes on and on. 
 

The fans are unable to understand why you continue to lash out at them and their favorite artist, and you are unable to understand why they lash out at you & your favorite artists or interests. 
 

I hope thinking about this is able to help bridge that gap for all of you. The solution is simple: stop wasting so much of your time criticizing the things you don't enjoy. It's natural to not like certain things, to disagree with others. It's not natural to make that your entire  personality. There's no reason you should be defined more by something you dislike as opposed to something you are interested in. 

 

 

Edited Thursday at 09:44 AM by PoisonedIvy

[PoisonedIvy]

Also I can already tell someone is going to come in here claim that "Swifties victimize themselves" when I am

 

(1) applying this analysis to ALL fanbases, I'm only using the Swifties as my primary example as a member of the fanbase and because we attract the most attention on this site, thereby inviting the most discussion,

 

and

 

(2) not even painting the fanbase as "victims" of "aggression," I'm just highlighting the disconnect of the conflict and how it perpetuates and intensifies. It's a snake eating its own tail, or a self fulfilling prophecy, and unless it's called out it will only continue to worsen. 

 

If you want -any- fanbase to be less annoying, retaliatory, and "antagonistic," you need to not antagonize them first. It's that simple. You'd think.
 

 

[PoisonedIvy]

"Not this meltdown"

"a job is needed"

"log off sis"

"it's time to go outside and touch grass"

 

There I got all of that out of the way for yall, now we can actually have an intellectually stimulating discussion. 
 

[tost1]

The problem with Swifties is that they stan Taylor Swift 

[Kern]

is it that serious?

 

 

[RideOrDie]

more than the problem with swifties is the amount of obsessed haters who use every opportunity to attack her under the guise of criticism and then gaslight swifties into thinking they are the problem if they so much as to utter a word defending her

[Dear Reader]

7 minutes ago, PoisonedIvy said:

The fans are unable to understand why you continue to lash out at them and their favorite artist, and you are unable to understand why they lash out at you & your favorite artists or interests. 

 

I hope thinking about this is able to help bridge that gap for all of you. The solution is simple: stop wasting so much of your time criticizing the things you don't enjoy. It's natural to not like certain things, to disagree with others. It's not natural to make that your entire  personality. There's no reason you should be defined more by something you dislike as opposed to something you are interested in. 

 

 

You ate here 

[Hurem]

My take on this issue is that I believe Swifties stan Taylor because of her success, not because of her music. That's why they get so extremely defensive over any kind of criticism and start throwing out stats and shading other pop stars.

 

Sure, all fan bases defend their faves, but Taylor is the biggest star at the moment. The fact that Swifties are still so insecure says a lot.

[Breakdown]

the irony of this by starting off with a disclaimer unnecessarily insulting most people on this website

[Dear Reader]

Just now, Hurem said:

My take on this issue is that I believe Swifties stan Taylor because of her success, not because of her music. That's why they get so extremely defensive over any kind of criticism and start throwing out stats and shading other pop stars.

 

Sure, all fan bases defend their faves, but Taylor is the biggest star at the moment. The fact that Swifties are still so insecure says a lot.

You can clearly see which swifties stan Taylor for her talent though. If you visit the TTPD thread, you can see countless posts talking about the music and not numbers and you can see which ones comment in music threads and the ones that only comment on the charts section and let me tell you the latter are a small number of them. A lot of swifties in this forum are here for Taylor and her artistry and music, from what I've seen. Those "stats" are only used in useless stan fights that end up being circles because a stan won't convince a non stan to become a swiftie and vice versa. 

[Hurem]

Just now, Dear Reader said:

You can clearly see which swifties stan Taylor for her talent though. If you visit the TTPD thread, you can see countless posts talking about the music and not numbers and you can see which ones comment in music threads and the ones that only comment on the charts section and let me tell you the latter are a small number of them. A lot of swifties in this forum are here for Taylor and her artistry and music, from what I've seen. Those "stats" are only used in useless stan fights that end up being circles because a stan won't convince a non stan to become a swiftie and vice versa. 

Of course there are stans who stan Taylor for the "right" reasons, I didn't want to make this about all Swifties on here. My point was moreso about those who engage in stan fights, who tend to fight any criticism with numbers. 

[Burn]

You're overthinking it. It's not even worth putting this amount of thought into.

[tost1]

6 minutes ago, RideOrDie said:

more than the problem with swifties is the amount of obsessed haters who use every opportunity to attack her under the guise of criticism and then gaslight swifties into thinking they are the problem if they so much as to utter a word defending her

I like you more when you fight with @KatyPrismSpirit

[Dear Reader]

Just now, Hurem said:

Of course there are stans who stan Taylor for the "right" reasons, I didn't want to make this about all Swifties on here. My point was moreso about those who engage in stan fights, who tend to fight any criticism with numbers. 

I see, but you can clearly see that in every fan base so I fail to see how that's a "swiftie" issue. 

[Meev]

Taylor Swift gets a lot of flak than other pop girls for the most mundane things, and that's mainly because she is so much more successful than other pop girls in music, which is what this forum and twitter cares about.

 

The issue on ATRL is that hate threads for Taylor are almost encouraged by the mods here. I have never seen a hate thread for Taylor being closed in this forum, while hate threads for other artists get closed all the time.

 

That being said, swifties should not engage with threads from trolls.

[Mordecai]

nah, taylor just sucks

[PoisonedIvy]

13 minutes ago, Breakdown said:

the irony of this by starting off with a disclaimer unnecessarily insulting most people on this website

I've been on this site long enough to know the audience

 

[PoisonedIvy]

5 minutes ago, Mordecai said:

nah, taylor just sucks

My OP is not about Taylor or Swifties. So your post literally contributed not a single modicum of substance to this discussion. Thanks, Mordecai! 

[glitch]

We can't be friends and I wouldn't like to pretend. You cling to your stats and acclaim, wait until she's flopping again.

[PoisonedIvy]

11 minutes ago, Burn said:

You're overthinking it. It's not even worth putting this amount of thought into.

It's worth it if it gets even 1 neutral party to understand the paradox and abstain from adding fuel to this dumpster fire. 

[PoisonedIvy]

20 minutes ago, RideOrDie said:

more than the problem with swifties is the amount of obsessed haters who use every opportunity to attack her under the guise of criticism and then gaslight swifties into thinking they are the problem if they so much as to utter a word defending her

This is exactly what my OP said sis  it's ok, I wouldn't have read it all either

[PoisonedIvy]

23 minutes ago, Kern said:

is it that serious?

 

 

Everything means nothing 

[State of Grace.]

Does anyone think global warming is a good thing? I love Chappell Roan.  I think she's a really interesting artist.

[Kern]

12 minutes ago, Meev said:

Taylor Swift gets a lot of flak than other pop girls for the most mundane things, and that's mainly because she is so much more successful than other pop girls in music, which is what this forum and twitter cares about.

 

The issue on ATRL is that hate threads for Taylor are almost encouraged by the mods here. I have never seen a hate thread for Taylor being closed in this forum, while hate threads for other artists get closed all the tim

I disagree.

There are a lot of Beyonce hate threads being made, def more than Taylor

70% of the time when you put someone in your avi you get "not with that avi" (Normani, Ava Max, Camila etc.) posts

Generally this forum is full of haters and it doesn't involve just Taylor

 

 

 

[PoisonedIvy]

1 minute ago, Kern said:

I disagree.

There are a lot of Beyonce hate threads being made,

 

True

 

Quote

def more than Taylor

Probably not true and could be proven with enough time and data but I do not care to actually go check. 
 

Overall I wish we didn't entertain threads created by people who only want to generate negative discussions, but that's idealistic and never happening as I've said many times over the years. I just like to appeal to logic every now and then and maintain the median level of sanity and rationality of this site's population.