base talk Gaga couldn't reach Taylor's heights. Why?

[The Music Industry]

7 hours ago, Jay07 said:

other hawk 34 variants

[The Music Industry]

39 minutes ago, Eternium said:

Can you show me where sales are dead? Adele just lost the record for highest first week sales ever last year to Stray Kids (5.5M+ in one week) and we've already had more 1M+ first weeks than any other decade.

Sales are decreasing everywhere but in the K-Pop industry. They are obviously decreasing on a global scale, as indicated yearly by IFPI reports, especially for western artists/in western countries. Why do you constantly act dense about this?

Edited Thursday at 07:23 PM by The Music Industry

[Jay07]

21 minutes ago, The Music Industry said:

They don't look like 34. I guess in addition to reading, you guys need help with counting too.

Edited Thursday at 07:40 PM by Jay07

[The Music Industry]

2 minutes ago, Jay07 said:

They don't look like 34. I guess in addition to reading, you guys need help with counting too.

Considering those failed to sell, what would've been the point of adding more anyway? 

Edited Thursday at 07:41 PM by The Music Industry

[Jay07]

6 minutes ago, The Music Industry said:

Considering those failed to sell, what would've been the point of adding more anyway? 

Maybe if she added a voice note or the exact same song but "acoustic" for 4.99.

 

 

Better luck next time sweetie.

Edited Thursday at 07:48 PM by Jay07

[Blue Monday]

Not to sound like a Little Monster or whatever but Gaga has a flourishing film career, an Academy Award a bunch of Grammy's and is clearly still in demand enough to tour and have a residency I think she's doing fine 

[Dual Lips]

One sings about exes and has a discography that is a teenage girl's dream.

The other one sang about being who you are and saved lives.

[MatiRod]

Gaga was a global stadium act by 2011 and the best-selling pop star in the world from 2009-2011 so not that different tbh. Of course touring has changed and streaming is now a thing so it's hard to compare numbers.

 

But 'Born This Way' was a very risky, polarizing album that almost intentionally curtailed her appeal to the general public in a way that Midnights or TTPD didn't. Like, a lead single that explicitly mentioned LGBT was always going to hurt her appeal especially back then, most of the album is aggressive electronic rock with her 'bad kidz in the city' word salad lyrics of that time (which I LOVE, don't get me wrong), the whole thing is camp art pop, it was a tough sell and people forget it now but it alienated a lot of her previous fans. The most accessible song ("The Edge of Glory") was about dying. Compare to Fame/Fame Monster..."Just Dance" is just a party song, "Poker Face" is basically a pun masquerading as a sex song, "Paparazzi" and "Bad Romance" are (twisted) love songs, "Telephone" is an empowering breakup song at heart, "Alejandro" is a bit more of a cypher but the easy sing a long hooks do the job. All her hits that established her were engineered to be easily understood, clear messages, very obvious hooks.

 

[lg6chromatica]

who cares?

[elincomprendid]

5 hours ago, Eternium said:

Girl, Autoplay started in 2013.

Oh so basically when Spotify started? So when you said taylor was bombing on Spotify before autoplay started you were talking about when it didn't exist. Well I guess you got at least one thing right after all! Cause she has been dominating Spotify since forever im RED era when WANEGBT was in the top 10 most streamed songs ever or with SIO being #1 up until removal or with LWYMMD breaking first day streaming records 

 

5 hours ago, Eternium said:

It's not news that Taylor was struggling in Europe with 1989 being her breakout hit and only massive era there pre-2020.

 

Well if you expected a country album to be her breakout album in a continent dominated by dance pop you are in for a sad awakening... and the funniest thing is that regarding this convo "Joanne" that is Gaga's country attempt got literally outsold IN PURE (before you start crying about autoplay or whatever) by all Taylor's country albums in Eurupe but debut that was literally never promoted ww and even that one is close 

 

5 hours ago, Eternium said:

Complaining about The Fame + Monster counting as one record when comparing to TS is so funny. Your fave is the face of releasing a ton of variants and multiple re-releases - why would you be mad when someone else does it?

Multiple things to say about this...

1) No one is mad here, or not on my side. If you are getting mad over an atrl conversation I would recommend you to go to therapy for your own good cause that's not healthy at all

2) Taylor being the face of multiple re-releases but Gaga is the one with like 4 Remixes albums )?
3) I guess you have som reading issues but I didn't complain about you combining The Fame + TFM, I was just bringing up your double standards when what to combine for Taylor and what to combine for Gaga.

 

 

[UrMom]

Gaga is a provacateur like Madge. She won't be for everyone. 

 

I think audiences like Taylor because she makes them feel safe.

[Kylie Jenner]

Gaga actually spoke about social issues that mattered at the time which was polarising. Taylor plays it too safe. 

[Digitalism]

I was kinda wating for the two fan bases with the biggest percentage of delulu stans in them to start attacking each other 

The monsters hiding behind Taylor's success wasn't going to last forever 

[elincomprendid]

 

4 hours ago, Jay07 said:

Maybe if she added a voice note or the exact same song but "acoustic" for 4.99.

 

 

Better luck next time sweetie.

Well that would need people being interested in alternative versions with low prices but considering a whole album of remixes discounted couldn't even make it to top 5 of iTunes US (a dead chart) idk!

https://twitter.com/LG_Views/status/1434878246596849665

[Ethereaaal]

You put ther careers side by side and the answer is pretty clear. Taylor was and is never as polarizing as Gaga. She never did anything remotely close to the things Gaga did with Born This Way + TFM.

[Doctor Dick]

22 hours ago, Space Cowboy said:

I think Taylor having the highest grossing tour of all time, The second highest first week sales for an album in a climate in which sales are dead, Occupying the whole top 10 in the hot 100 twice, Selling 20 million units in the one calendar year only in the US… is way more impressive than anything Gaga has ever achieved.

 

Gaga having some smashes in one era (it's actually two eras since The Fame and TFM shouldn't be counted as one album) is not that impressive. Other female artists like Madonna, Rih or Katy have done it and have done it better than Gaga.

 

If we are talking about heights then HEIGHTS it is. It means PEAKS. Gaga's imperial phase as already mentioned by so many other on here was equally as big as Taylor's fame-wise but both reigned in different areas. Taylor's smashing album charts and touring but Gaga smashed single charts and shaped the entire pop music industry and pop culture back then. The equivalent of that would be if post-2023 every r&b girl, hip hop artist, pop artist and legacy acts picked up a guitar and started writing Taylor-esque songs and working with Jack Antanoff. That's what happened during Gaga's imperial phase. 

 

Touring is stupid to compare because stadiums are booked for artists with more than one album. As I've already posted in this thread you need to ask yourself this question: would you pay expensive concert tickets to see someone you only like a few songs by or someone who you like many albums by? Because that's the comparison between Gaga not doing stadiums during TF/M and Taylor doing them after released 11 albums. Fame-wise and popularity wise both are equal. Taylor smashed an all-time streaming record for "Fortnight", Gaga smashed a digital all-time record for "Born This Way". Both have the same large peak on Google, Taylor has one of the biggest albums in streaming history, Gaga literally has the best-selling digital album. It's the same. 

 

22 hours ago, Comedor said:

Gaga = gays

 

Taylor = gays and straights (and conservatives)

Gaga had the straights in a chokehold from 2009-11. She became "gay" when she did Born This Way. She wouldn't have broken all her records from only gay stans. 

 

This is a stupid discussion. Both reached the same popularity heights in different muscial landscapes. Gaga just couldn't keep it going because of her brand. 

[wkpw]

On 7/3/2024 at 9:45 PM, Lagerfeld said:

Taylor's place in the music industry is undoubtedly one of the most important. One of the reasons for this is her very loyal and strong fan base. Similarly, Gaga has the Little Monsters, who are just as dedicated to her, but why hasn't she been able to reach Taylor's heights in terms of commercial performance and impact?

 

 

 

taylor is 100% market tailored 

[charot]

The way ASIB and Shallow made more noise with the GP than anything Taylor Swift since Blank Space and she did that during her 'decline'. And the way Always Remember Us This Way and Bloody Mary are more recognized by the GP than Taylor's #1s. 

 

Taylor hasn't done anything memorable or iconic, all she's got is sales, sales driven by her cult base.

 

One is clearly fan driven and has 0 impact outside stan bubble, while the other girly's success always has the GP involved. 

Edited Friday at 05:20 AM by charot

[MissedTheTrain]

This thread

 

To answer the OP: who has matched Taylor's peak?  You could make this thread for anyone, but it says a lot that Gaga is the first to come to mind when comparing....she had such a massive peak herself and demanded the culture's attention in a different way.  I do think she drove herself into overexposure quickly and could have made better decisions along the way to extend her peak, but she was also less palatable than Taylor and took some risks that alienated people along the way.

 

Taylor's peak is built on a perfect storm of quite a pile of things that have compiled over the years, but she's also been pretty strategic about staying at this level while minimizing overexposure.  I don't think Gaga was ever super cautious about it (not that there's anything wrong with that, just an observation)

[MissedTheTrain]

8 minutes ago, charot said:

The way ASIB and Shallow made more noise with the GP than anything Taylor Swift since Blank Space and she did that during her 'decline'. And the way Always Remember Us This Way and Bloody Mary are more recognized by the GP than Taylor's #1s. 

 

One is clearly fan driven and has 0 impact outside stan bubble, while the other girly's success always has the GP involved. 

 

I love Gaga, but do you really think Bloody Mary (and even Always Remember Us This Way) is more recognizable to the GP than a song like Shake It Off or Anti-Hero?

 

The second part of your post is also odd because Taylor's success is very clearly helped by the GP as well....the tour and its high demand (and insane resale prices) is physical evidence for it. The streams are massive, as is her news coverage.

[charot]

31 minutes ago, MissedTheTrain said:

 

I love Gaga, but do you really think Bloody Mary (and even Always Remember Us This Way) is more recognizable to the GP than a song like Shake It Off or Anti-Hero?

 

The second part of your post is also odd because Taylor's success is very clearly helped by the GP as well....the tour and its high demand (and insane resale prices) is physical evidence for it. The streams are massive, as is her news coverage.

I meant #1s this decade.

 

Anti-Hero? Debatable. In the US maybe but we all know Bloody Mary did blow up with the GP and ARUTW a song loved by the locals esp outside the USA. It's evident on the youtube views and they're not even proper/official singles. 

 

Spoiler

Bloody Mary's most viewed video has 456M views

ARUTW's official MV 551M, audio 260M + randoms 303M, 269M, 148M and lots of uploads with millions of views.

 

and the way the fan made remixes are on par with the views of Anti Hero Official MV with only 203M. 

 

ARUTW and BM views are lit on par with the biggest global smashes this decade like Watermelon Sugar, Driver's License, Good 4 U, Say So, WAP...

 

Taylor's hits scream local and fan driven. Her supposed hits don't translate to youtube views which is a good metric for global reach and popularity with the GP. The platform may have declined but the popularity of songs somehow reflects there like those global smashes I mentioned.

 

Edited Friday at 05:59 AM by charot

[Cleanromantic]

Taylor did not take the risk of releasing unlistenable albums like Gaga did with Artpop, Joanne, and Chromatica . 

Anyways, I love how certain Britney Spears stans stan every single pop girl on earth*, you guys are such girls girls .

Spoiler

*except Taylor Swift.

 

[Funnyfatty]

5 hours ago, Ethereaaal said:

You put ther careers side by side and the answer is pretty clear. Taylor was and is never as polarizing as Gaga. She never did anything remotely close to the things Gaga did with Born This Way + TFM.

But she used black lipstick during reputation. Isn't that polarizing for her fanbase? 

[The7thStranger]

GaGa boxed herself into a corner and burned herself out with BTW and then the very polarizing Artpop. She went a bit too fast for her schtick to last.

 

Taylor's only true risk was releasing the Taylor's Verisons. She played the game quite cooly. But I think TTPD is a clear sign that she has crested.

Edited Friday at 06:45 AM by The7thStranger

[Arrows]

On 7/4/2024 at 3:00 AM, Eternium said:

she's never had an era with four global smashes. 

1989 has 5 smash hits.

 

Gaga's appeal was meant to explode, but not to last. She was extremely good at getting attention early on, but not very good at making the masses like her, sadly. She was more of a novelty act initially, although I personally loved her.