celeb news "Beyoncé's country album drowns out the Black music history it claims to celebrate"

[PrettyHurts]

1 minute ago, Josh said:

They were on a song longer than a minute but Miley gets a full verse?

The album also has a duet with Willie Jones, and two songs with Shaboozey. But I guess since they're smaller names we can just pretend like they aren't there..

[BOAZ]

Quote

Perhaps if Cowboy Carter had featured more working-class Black country artists, or leaned on the scholarship of the likes of Dom Flemons, formerly of the Carolina Chocolate Drops, or collectives such as Black Opry, which represents Black artists, fans and industry workers, or the now-defunct Black Country Music Association of the 1990s, it might have been as thrilling as Modern Sounds.

Forcing Beyoncé, a billionaire superstar, into a working-class narrative would have been absolutely disingenuous though I don't get why she's the only one who needs to justify her EVERY action and musical directions as if she really was a political figure. Her premises for the album were really simple: "This is not a country album, this is a Beyoncé album - close your eyes and experience the music".

[Katamari]

i will say it was a mess to waste a Tanner Adell collab on a folk cover  

 

 

 

 

[BOAZ]

Double post

Edited April 4 by BOAZ

[Katamari]

1 minute ago, PrettyHurts said:

The album also has a duet with Willie Jones, and two songs with Shaboozey. But I guess since they're smaller names we can just pretend like they aren't there..

the fact these are 2 examples of the "working class country artists" the author swore up and down bey never worked with  

[Mean Trees]

Most of the drowning out was by the Think piece  Xitterati who decided to put uber importance on one wealthy individual's desire to fund an album of a certain genre. 

[QueenBLadyG]

8 minutes ago, americanshameless said:

The Post song shouldn't have been there, he himself is better suited for a Taylor album  

Funny, the finished product proves otherwise. 

[PrettyHurts]

Just now, Katamari said:

the fact these are 2 examples of the "working class country artists" the author swore up and down bey never worked with  

'Flamenco' and 'My Rose' were also co-written and produced by Mamii, a relatively unknown young black musician and multi-instrumentalist who is also NOT mentioned in this article 

[Redstreak]

21 minutes ago, CoolNebraskaGuy said:

I mean, shes said herself- its a Beyonce album, not a country album. They're doing a bit much with this list of perceived grievances  

 

 

This is personally my issue with the campaign, it's a Beyoncé album to sidestep critical analysis but when discussing gatekeeping it suddenly becomes an unquestioned country album again

[americanshameless]

1 minute ago, QueenBLadyG said:

Funny, the finished product proves otherwise. 

I'm an OLJH

[Virgos Groove]

28 minutes ago, Sheep said:

Sorry but this is a straight up "I want to be smarter than Beyonce" hit piece. The author acknowledges then completely sidesteps Bey's intentions at several points, which in an article this short is actually unforgiveable, its not like this is a 40 page published essay where there was room to get lost in the sauce like this.

 

Then continues with the narrative of of it being a genre record when the point is to shame these systems and sidestep them

 

If they got any closer to the point here it would impale them.

 

 

Like much of Bey's work both in her art and in real life for the past decade, CC is an exercise in criticizing and using her enormous influence/respect to dismantle power structures that have kept her and people like her in a box where they have to follow expectations(whether it's as a woman, a mother, a black person, somebody who makes black music, somebody who makes top 40 music, etc).

 

Given how little press she's done and how consistent the messaging about her intentions have been here both in the press and in the very literal lyricism in the album, I don't know what more she could have done to avoid stupid responses like this.

Counterpoint: an author's intentions are irrelevant, it's the reader's (or, in this case, the listener's) perception that defines the meaning.

 

The idea that these three acts are an act of reclaiming or stepping out of boxes, or that CC is a straight-up country or that it's actually "not a country album, but a Beyoncé album"... these are all just interpretations. Just because some of them don't line up with Bey's intentions, it doesn't make those less valid (and them being valid doesn't mean one has to agree with them).

 

For example, I don't agree that Bey choosing a more working class imagery for some songs is an "inauthentic" thing. All songwriting is fictional to a degree. But ultimately, I see where the author is coming from - country music's history and the working class have always been intertwined. I just don't agree with it because I don't share the same basic interpretation of the album as her. She sees it as (attempting to be) an all-out country album, I don't. Art can be interpreted in multiple ways and one doesn't have either get defensive or weaponize it to attack an artist.

Edited April 4 by Virgos Groove

[PrettyHurts]

1 minute ago, Redstreak said:

This is personally my issue with the campaign, it's a Beyoncé album to sidestep critical analysis but when discussing gatekeeping it suddenly becomes an unquestioned country album again

multiple things can be true. bey worked with musicians in the country world and created great songs that exemplify country (16, texas, protector, just for fun etc etc) while also wanting to include other genres. the album is not an exercise in genre purity, just good music  being from the south, beyoncé has a right to explore country like any other artist, and she did it her own way. 

[swissman]

30 minutes ago, Virgos Groove said:

This is actually a really good article that makes interesting points on authenticity and how Bey's position in the industry influences the perception of her art. It doesn't stop me from loving the album, but I see where the author is coming from.

 

Sadly, ATRL is going to turn this into fuel for stan wars, with OBHs going "See!!! It's a bad album!!" and the Hive dismissing the author's credibility.

It's hard to take this article seriously when it gets facts wrong, puts words in Beyoncé's mouth, disregards the Black musicians that are actually ON the album, quotes lyrics incorrectly or selectively to support her point (ie. implying being on a bus with a band is the hardship discussed in 16 CARRAIGES), accuses it of being a cash grab (made in 2019 and then not released, mind you) because it leans on country aesthetics despite admitting it is and aims to be far more than that... should we continue? ... admits an assumption (for no reason whatsoever, especially given what the "hit" was) that it was going to be some indie album not one with mainstream appeal...from...Beyoncé...who according to the author should have de-centered herself from her own work.

 

Now, she may have interesting points or thoughts to bring up, but a lot of this is based on pure personal assumption and misunderstanding of Beyoncé as an artist. Of course she's going to be the protagonist of her own work. Both lead singles are pretty clear on that, too.

Instead of assessing the Black musicians present, the only mention any of them get in this article pretending to want to celebrate Black music with this record is a remark about Linda Martell speaking to genre (with a brief descriptor of who Linda is). It doesn't get deeper than that, but we are to think this is a credible opinion-piece that isn't just one person saying they assumed something and were wrong?

[Kassi]

We wanted a country album, not a flop album.

 

What he's suggesting would have made it less dynamic and transgressive. 

[KatyPrismSpirit]

7 minutes ago, Josh said:

They were on a song longer than a minute but Miley gets a full verse?

she's really damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. miley's race shouldn't even matter as to why beyoncé chose to work with her. maybe she just liked miley? maybe she connected to miley's southern roots. why can't people just enjoy this album without using the featured against her? when beyonce had 8 different female black artists featured on The Gift NOT ONE of these journalists wrote an article about it. Doesn't that literally give away the intend behind these "thinkpieces"? 

[Redstreak]

3 minutes ago, PrettyHurts said:

multiple things can be true. bey worked with musicians in the country world and created great songs that exemplify country (16, texas, protector, just for fun etc etc) while also wanting to include other genres. the album is not an exercise in genre purity, just good music  being from the south, beyoncé has a right to explore country like any other artist, and she did it her own way. 

I agree, I just think it would have a made stronger case to fully plant her flag down and say "my vision *is* country whether you like it or not", I think saying "this isn't country, this is Beyoncé,” kinda waffles that a bit

[Kristie Kuwa]

Beyonce: Literally includes THE Linda Martell to record a monologue in which she addresses how genres can feel confined aka wants people to just appreciate her art for what it is, regardless of who sings on her songs, what genres she blends, etc

 

People: criticize its not fully Country.

 

Like, are u dumb?

 

Edited April 4 by Kristie Kuwa

[Josh]

1 minute ago, KatyPrismSpirit said:

she's really damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. miley's race shouldn't even matter as to why beyoncé chose to work with her. maybe she just liked miley? maybe she connected to miley's southern roots. why can't people just enjoy this album without using the featured against her? when beyonce had 8 different female black artists featured on The Gift NOT ONE of these journalists wrote an article about it. Doesn't that literally give away the intend behind these "thinkpieces"? 

but of all the country artists why Miley? Why not Shania or Faith

[KatyPrismSpirit]

Just now, Josh said:

but of all the country artists why Miley? Why not Shania or Faith

why not miley? it wasn't my 1st choice either but it is what it is. it's her album. she's allowed to work with whoever she wants to work with. thats her right as an artist. 

[swissman]

6 minutes ago, Redstreak said:

This is personally my issue with the campaign, it's a Beyoncé album to sidestep critical analysis but when discussing gatekeeping it suddenly becomes an unquestioned country album again

How does saying it's a Beyonce album sidestep critical analysis? The point of saying "This ain't a Country album. This is a 'Beyoncé' album." is that she's making country...her way. It's really as simple as that. It's very clearly a country album when looking at the sounds most featured, the writers, the producers, the lyrics, the imagery, and the featured guests. To be so literal with the statement that it's not country, it's Beyoncé is not being critical in itself. If we want to critically analyze it we need to look at the reasons why Beyoncé added her own flavour into the genre instead of outright honouring it to a tee. Perhaps it's to state that country isn't one sound, that not one kind of artist can make it, that combining it with other genres doesn't make it less country, etc. etc. etc. The statement is purposefully confusing and nearly circular because it's meant to provide a framework to understand it. Don't take it as a country album. Take it as a Beyoncé album (which is something that is quite loaded with meaning at this point in her career, too). It doesn't mean it's not country music though.

[Redstreak]

1 minute ago, swissman said:

How does saying it's a Beyonce album sidestep critical analysis? The point of saying "This ain't a Country album. This is a 'Beyoncé' album." is that she's making country...her way. It's really as simple as that. It's very clearly a country album when looking at the sounds most featured, the writers, the producers, the lyrics, the imagery, and the featured guests. To be so literal with the statement that it's not country, it's Beyoncé is not being critical in itself. If we want to critically analyze it we need to look at the reasons why Beyoncé added her own flavour into the genre instead of outright honouring it to a tee. Perhaps it's to state that country isn't one sound, that not one kind of artist can make it, that combining it with other genres doesn't make it less country, etc. etc. etc. The statement is purposefully confusing and nearly circular because it's meant to provide a framework to understand it. Don't take it as a country album. Take it as a Beyoncé album (which is something that is quite loaded with meaning at this point in her career, too). It doesn't mean it's not country music though.

I'm talking about fan discourse sidestepping critics, not Beyoncé 

[Kristie Kuwa]

1 minute ago, Redstreak said:

I agree, I just think it would have a made stronger case to fully plant her flag down and say "my vision *is* country whether you like it or not", I think saying "this isn't country, this is Beyoncé,” kinda waffles that a bit

But why can people not use their brains a bit? Act ii started off as a Country album, but in the later stages of the album, songs like Spaghetti and Ya ya were included, which clearly do not sound classic Country. Bey clearly switched to a more cinematic approach than a genre approach because she figured that this would tell her story and Vision better. Hence it being a Beyonce album and not a Country album.

 

HOWEVER: Never did she say there were no Country songs on it. Songs like 2 Most Wanted, Just For Fun, Protector, and Jolene are all traditional Country songs. There nothing subtle or genre-defying about them 

 

 

[CaptainMusic]

I love Bey and the album, but the author made some points.

 

I felt the same way when I saw Post and Miley were included as features:

[Redstreak]

Just now, Kristie Kuwa said:

But why can people not use their brains a bit? Act ii started off as a Country album, but in the later stages of the album, songs like Spaghetti and Ya ya were included, which clearly do not sound classic Country. Bey clearly switched to a more cinematic approach than a genre approach because she figured that this would tell her story and Vision better. Hence it being a Beyonce album and not a Country album.

 

HOWEVER: Never did she say there were no Country songs on it. Songs like 2 Most Wanted, Just For Fun, Protector, and Jolene are all traditional Country songs. There nothing subtle or genre-defying about them 

 

 

But that's my point, and what I thought the larger point is, playing with genres doesn't eliminate categories all together, it's about expanding our classifications

[dumbsparce]

She's a cultural appropriator what's new

Edited April 4 by dumbsparce