Mr. Mendes Posted March 16 Posted March 16 7 hours ago, Moloko Plus said: The fact that they’re only facing large fines and no one is receiving prison time is the reason these corporations keep trying to skirt regulations. A ******* mess And what exactly would they be going to prison for? No one is dead. No one’s hurt. No planes have crashed. None of the issues other than the door plug are abnormal in the aviation industry. Yeah, don’t disagree with you that their fighting against regulation is shitty and pure corporate arrogance. But don’t let the dishonesty of the reporting here lead you into thinking there’s some giant disaster that nearly happened that was slimly averted. That has not happened. Not even close.
brraap Posted March 16 Posted March 16 Not a coverup 3 minutes ago, Mr. Mendes said: And what exactly would they be going to prison for? No one is dead. No one’s hurt. No planes have crashed. None of the issues other than the door plug are abnormal in the aviation industry. Yeah, don’t disagree with you that their fighting against regulation is shitty and pure corporate arrogance. But don’t let the dishonesty of the reporting here lead you into thinking there’s some giant disaster that nearly happened that was slimly averted. That has not happened. Not even close. Not you saying this in a thread where the whistle blower (who is now dead) said that if he dies it’s not a suicide
monologueNacafe Posted March 16 Posted March 16 8 hours ago, Mr. Mendes said: Absolutely begging people to stop losing their minds over this stuff. No one has been seriously injured. No one has died. No one will die. The media loves to sensationalize air incidents. Why? Because they’re rare. There has not been a fatal air crash in the US since 2009 and they’re desperate to latch onto any sort of mechanical issue and turn it into a near death experience. None of the planes that have had incidents in the last couple of months was EVER even close to crashing. At no point were the pilots or cabin crew EVER out of control of the situation. Airplanes are built with multiple failsafes. Airplanes can even stay airborne for a great deal of time even if both engines completely shut off. These flights making emergency landings were not landing because they were in danger of crashing, they were landing because they were flying close enough to an airport (which is a law) to immediately touch down and assess the problem and tend to any passengers that may be seriously hurt (and there were none). The media doesn’t know how airplanes work, nor do they know the actual details of what happened in these incidents they’re reporting. They will make it sound infinitely worse than it was in actuality because it drives clicks and engagement. The only wildly abnormal thing that has happened on a Boeing is the door on Alaska Air which is a design flaw that has been fixed. Instrument panel problems, shedding landing gear, all of it happens all the time and you never hear about it. Know why? Because it isn’t serious. The media would like you to believe it is but not a single one of the issues that have been reported on in regards to Boeing ever put the plane in danger of crashing. Not one. Zero. You’re only hearing about this because of the media storm, which will go away. And to that, Boeing is run by assholes im not gonna sit here and sing their praises and defend their stupidity, but its SO reckless to paint all this stuff as a mega disaster waiting to happen when it is nothing of the sort. Hundreds of thousands of flights take place on Boeing planes every week. Millions every year. And every one of those people has landed unharmed. Everyone is letting a small handful of less than deadly events cause a fuss and ignoring the billions of people who fly that are absolutely fine in every possible way. Do not let people who don’t know how airplanes work tell you that they’re dangerous. ….
AvadaKedavra Posted March 16 Posted March 16 10 hours ago, BraveNewSeth said: Lmaoooooo. And people wonder why I’m ******* terrified of flying. This we need to ships and cruise ships for international travel 1
airplane Posted March 16 Author Posted March 16 (edited) 9 hours ago, Mr. Mendes said: Absolutely begging people to stop losing their minds over this stuff. No one has been seriously injured. No one has died. No one will die. The media loves to sensationalize air incidents. Why? Because they’re rare. There has not been a fatal air crash in the US since 2009 and they’re desperate to latch onto any sort of mechanical issue and turn it into a near death experience. None of the planes that have had incidents in the last couple of months was EVER even close to crashing. At no point were the pilots or cabin crew EVER out of control of the situation. Airplanes are built with multiple failsafes. Airplanes can even stay airborne for a great deal of time even if both engines completely shut off. These flights making emergency landings were not landing because they were in danger of crashing, they were landing because they were flying close enough to an airport (which is a law) to immediately touch down and assess the problem and tend to any passengers that may be seriously hurt (and there were none). The media doesn’t know how airplanes work, nor do they know the actual details of what happened in these incidents they’re reporting. They will make it sound infinitely worse than it was in actuality because it drives clicks and engagement. The only wildly abnormal thing that has happened on a Boeing is the door on Alaska Air which is a design flaw that has been fixed. Instrument panel problems, shedding landing gear, all of it happens all the time and you never hear about it. Know why? Because it isn’t serious. The media would like you to believe it is but not a single one of the issues that have been reported on in regards to Boeing ever put the plane in danger of crashing. Not one. Zero. You’re only hearing about this because of the media storm, which will go away. And to that, Boeing is run by assholes im not gonna sit here and sing their praises and defend their stupidity, but its SO reckless to paint all this stuff as a mega disaster waiting to happen when it is nothing of the sort. Hundreds of thousands of flights take place on Boeing planes every week. Millions every year. And every one of those people has landed unharmed. Everyone is letting a small handful of less than deadly events cause a fuss and ignoring the billions of people who fly that are absolutely fine in every possible way. Do not let people who don’t know how airplanes work tell you that they’re dangerous. Quote No one has been seriously injured. No one has died. No one will die. So the LATAM 787 suddenly dropping in altitude, tossing 50 people around, the whistleblower dying is not enough of a red flag for you? Or how Boeing failed to correctly estimate the strength of the MCAS system due to inadequate testing which resulted in 2x737 Max crashes or how Boeing has been fraudelently speeding up their certification procedures, compromising safety in the process and then getting fined by the FAA? As someone who knows exactly how airplanes work and has done a case study on the 737 Max, the recent trend of incidents with Boeing aircraft is extremely alarming and i won't be surprised if the 777X never gets certified anymore. Quote Passenger on Boeing flight that suddenly dropped says pilot told him he lost control after instrument failure. “I immediately engaged with him and said, ‘What was that?’ And he openly admitted, he said, ‘I lost control of the plane. My gauges just kind of went blank on me,’” Jokat said. “He said for that brief moment he couldn’t control anything and that’s when the plane did what it did. Then he said the gauges came back and it reengaged, the plane just reengaged to its normal flight pattern. And we had no issues before, no issues after. But just that moment. Edited March 16 by airplane
Mr. Mendes Posted March 16 Posted March 16 11 hours ago, brraap said: Not a coverup Not you saying this in a thread where the whistle blower (who is now dead) said that if he dies it’s not a suicide And you believe that bullshit? Lmao It came from an unverified source that is supposedly someone close to the guy (this hasn’t been proven) and the claim itself also has no proof beyond “trust me bro”. Not only is he not the first person to “whistleblow” about Boeing, the claims he made were not new or unique. There was an entire Netflix documentary about Boeing making the same allegations and none of the people who made it are dead. Why would they off this man when these claims were out there for over a year before he ever made them? The whole notion that Boeing had someone killed is genuinely some tinfoil hat, flat earth, election was stolen, jet fuel doesnt melt steel beams level insane conspiracy ****. Please let’s be serious and use our brains. 1
Mr. Mendes Posted March 16 Posted March 16 (edited) 3 hours ago, airplane said: So the LATAM 787 suddenly dropping in altitude, tossing 50 people around, the whistleblower dying is not enough of a red flag for you? Or how Boeing failed to correctly estimate the strength of the MCAS system due to inadequate testing which resulted in 2x737 Max crashes or how Boeing has been fraudelently speeding up their certification procedures, compromising safety in the process and then getting fined by the FAA? As someone who knows exactly how airplanes work and has done a case study on the 737 Max, the recent trend of incidents with Boeing aircraft is extremely alarming and i won't be surprised if the 777X never gets certified anymore. At the moment from all the info we have, what happened to LATAM was not a failure of the aircraft but rather an accident in the cockpit: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/03/15/business/latam-airlines-flight-cause As for the MCAS crashes, yes they were tragic but how you’re describing them is a little misleading, though I do not in any way assume that is on purpose. Yes, Boeing rightfully took criticism and was fined due to their decision to not have a second sensor on the MCAS. The FAA also took blame for this as they are the ones who certified it. But that is where the fault stops. The other aspect of those two crashes were crews under trained on the use of the MCAS system but the official reports on these incidents unanimously agreed that there was an incredibly logical and solid reasoning for why Boeing didn’t supply this training; MCAS uses the horizontal stabilizers at the tail to push the nose down. The stabilizer trim system does the same exact thing. The latter system is commonplace in aviation on all jets and all certified pilots are very familiar with it. There is a specific failure often associated with this system called trim runaway that is well studied and has a specific procedure for. To fix it, all the pilot must do is turn this system off. Boeing, the FAA, and the airlines purchasing these planes all believed that the MCAS system would present itself in the same exact way that the trim runaway did, hence the procedure to correct the MCAS system being the exact same procedure as the one used to correct the trim runaway. It was also assumed that pilots’ experience with trim runaway would alert them to do the same with the MCAS even if they couldn’t identify the cause of the issue. That is why the official conclusion in the reports on these crashes indicated that had the pilots been thoroughly knowledgable about the system, the crashes likely wouldn’t have happened. Boeing is at fault for the one sensor design, but everyone involved was in agreement that the need for additional training on this system was not apparent at the time of the crashes. Of course, these two crashes proved the need which led to Boeing developing an entire new training program as well as completely redesigning the system. That is how airplanes got to be as safe as they are today. Manufacturers, regulatory boards, airlines, and pilots all make assumptions about the technology based on what they know and an unfortunate disaster exposes the weakness and it gets corrected. That is NOT to say that anyone dying is justified by what is learned from it and I don’t want it taken that way. I say that to instead make clear that making this incident be proof of Boeing’s unique failure is disingenuous when Airbus, McDonald-Douglas, and more manufactures all went through the very same process of serious error and correction. It is not unique to Boeing. And there in lies my entire point. The media is making it seem like Boeing’s planes are metal death traps when that is not the case. They’re using the MCAS incidents (a problem that has long been fixed) as a basis to now make mountains out of what is incredibly benign and common for the industry quality control issues. Yes, Boeing is deserving of criticism for QC issues, but it is untrue that QC issues automatically mean unsafe as well. Instead of elaborating on that myself, I’m going to instead let an expert’s words explain it. This is a quote directly from a certified pilot with more experience with these planes and this industry than you, me, and the media will ever have: Quote Journalism is really failing this moment in aviation unfortunately. Boeing undoubtedly has some quality control issues, but QC is a far cry from being unsafe, and journalists simply do not have the expertise to parse out what is important and what isn’t in the world of aviation safety. Unfortunately for fearful flyers (who also don’t have the expertise), that leads to the spiralling that occurs when too much information is presented without context. The context is that things happen to large machines. There simply is no way to create these incredible (and incredibly sophisticated) machines without the understanding that at some point, a part of them might break. However, what we do about that is precisely what makes aviation so safe. Our procedures, our training, and our redundancies mean that something breaking just isn’t a big deal. And that’s where journalism is failing; they have been wholly unwilling to dig a little deeper, understand our day to day, and because of that lack of context, they are publishing articles that do not give information that is worthwhile. That’s not to say that there isn’t good journalism going on; there is, and we should be active in seeking it for so many topics. But aviation is a topic that requires more expertise than most in order to truly parse out what is important and what’s not. Most journalists would not be willing to touch the deep aspects of neurosurgery because of its complexities, but for some reason they’re willing to write articles about HYD G LO PR ECAM messages and EGPWS warnings after only a cursory read about them. All this to say, that’s why we’re here. When someone writes an article about an incident and portends the downfall of aviation safety, we’re here to provide that context that journalists might’ve missed. Just remember that we have to get on those planes too (far more frequently than you do), and we wouldn’t do it if we were 100% certain it was safe. Edited March 16 by Mr. Mendes
BraveNewSeth Posted March 17 Posted March 17 13 hours ago, AvadaKedavra said: This we need to ships and cruise ships for international travel Facts. And a railway system for in-country travel.
Mr. Mendes Posted March 17 Posted March 17 Also just putting it out there as more news comes forward: NONE of the incidents that have made the news recently are shaping up to be a Boeing problem. All of them are being pointed to the airline itself or typical wear on the part in question that is universal across all manufacturers. I once again repeat that all this media storm in these initial reports that’s gotten everyone in a tizzy was for nothing. The media doesn’t tell the truth about aviation events because the truth doesn’t drive clicks and that’s why the follow ups revealing the benign truth don’t get much push. Stop allowing them to do it by believing them. 1
KFC Posted March 17 Posted March 17 I don't know much about planes but I know how the media likes to sensationalise things and they're not going to gaslight me into thinking that these planes that have been flying for years and just now suddenly all having issues #IStandWithBoeing Spoiler Not really. I stand with whatever plane can take me to my destination lmao
nadiamendell Posted March 17 Posted March 17 On 3/16/2024 at 2:08 AM, Mr. Mendes said: And what exactly would they be going to prison for? No one is dead. No one’s hurt. No planes have crashed. None of the issues other than the door plug are abnormal in the aviation industry. Not ATRL having a Boeing shill in its midst. The 737 Max 8 crashes that killed a combined 346 people being conveniently forgotten here...
diemoehre Posted March 17 Posted March 17 (edited) On 3/16/2024 at 2:35 AM, ZeroSuitBritney said: Can we see what plane flights would be using before we book it? If you look up your flight on google flights you definitely can! But I'm sure airlines also provide that info on their own booking sites. Edited March 17 by diemoehre Added something
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