discussion Communism vs Capitalism Jubilee

[Headlock]

28 minutes ago, Delirious said:

What are they then? Democratic?

Dear god, do you only know of two forms of government  Google is free.

[Delirious]

10 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

Love how you couldn't refute anything else I've said, so you brushed off a personal plan of mine with a scoff.

 

 

Because everything you said was false? Duh? I'm literally East Asian myself so you really tried the racism arguments lol.

 

And china is a great place to visit. I've visited there 2 times and it was great (apart from the air and water) but north Korea? Girl be serious 

 

14 minutes ago, Communion said:

kjnkjnkjnjknkjnjknknkkjn I love this website so much. 

 Russia calling themselves a "federal, democratic republic"

 I have to LAUGH if you actually believe in that 

 

More like communism + authoritarianism

[Mr. Blue_Shirt]

When one of the capitalists said that the US government is not a capitalist government, I just burst out laughing  It has to be one of the funniest sh*ts I've ever heard in 2023.

 

How the f*ck do people say this with confidence without any sense of irony AT ALL?!

[DAP]

I watched the original Jubilee vid. The capitalists were so out of their depth they couldn’t even define capitalism beyond “free trade” and the fact notorious scammer Tai Lopez was chosen as a representative. Sounds about right. 

 

 

[Delirious]

Also notice how it's always the SAME few users on ATRL promoting communism? Color me shocked! 

[Headlock]

33 minutes ago, She-Rah said:

I love capitalism since I have a competitive nature. You CAN get ahead and thrive. Some people are just lazy and justify their bad living conditions on capitalism while not moving a finger to improve their lives. 

I hate the idea of communism. Why do I have to pay for other people’s food while they sit at home doing nothing? 

 

29 minutes ago, She-Rah said:

Also, the older I get the more my views have been moving to the right. 

You don’t say 

Right-wing ATRL-ers are the strangest breed of queer 

[Communion]

1 minute ago, Delirious said:

Russia calling themselves a "federal, democratic republic"

 I have to LAUGH if you actually believe in that 

 

More like communism + authoritarianism

Wait until you find out that Russia is both capitalist and authoritarian.

[SmittenCake]

Just now, Delirious said:

Because everything you said was false? Duh? 

You said: there's no music 

 

that's a lie

 

You said: there's no entertainment 

 

that's also a lie

 

The idea of DPRK/Communist countries having an ounce of tech progress frightens you because this concept is new to you. Your bubble has been burst. You keep suggesting I move to a different country like a tired old racist hack who just got his account ban lifted from Facebook. You cant refute anything I've pointed out, so you concocted a mix of lies and your emotions to direct the conversation and its not going the way you thought. Now you are spouting even more recycled, low-deficient takes. 

[She-Rah]

5 minutes ago, Headlock said:

 

You don’t say 

Right-wing ATRL-ers are the strangest breed of queer 

I’m center (leaning right) for now 

[Delirious]

2 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

You said: there's no music 

 

that's a lie

 

You said: there's no entertainment 

 

that's also a lie

 

The idea of DPRK/Communist countries having an ounce of tech progress frightens you because this concept is new to you. Your bubble has been burst. You keep suggesting I move to a different country like a tired old racist hack who just got his account ban lifted from Facebook. You cant refute anything I've pointed out, so you concocted a mix of lies and your emotions to direct the conversation and its not going the way you thought. Now you are spouting even more recycled, low-deficient takes. 

That was exaggeration duh? Let me ask you this, are entertainment sources allowed to create any material that they want? Will they be restricted/censored from releasing crude, LGBT or anti economy/government etc songs? This is what I mean.

 

And lol not at you constantly thinking North Korea has any tech progress. Idk what news you're reading but ok. Care to share what tech progress that is? And china still hasn't been able to replicate the processing of advanced chips (they're like 10 years behind)

[Trent W]

The 3-hour video

 

Anyway, communism doesn’t work and is hell on earth

 

It’s basically transferring your rights and freedom to an elite and never have access to anything good again

 

Capitalism has a lot of flaws but is still way way better

 

And honestly the US has become more of an oligarchy than a capitalist country.

 

I think is easier to balance capitalism and try to modify it into social democracy or something more balanced than its current state.

 

People also confuse the words capitalism and corruption a lot online.

 

The wave of communism in the last few years online is nothing more than ignorance and trying to be edgy

 

I don’t think anyone really wants to live in a country like North Korea or Cuba.

[Communion]

37 minutes ago, She-Rah said:

I love capitalism since I have a competitive nature. You CAN get ahead and thrive. Some people are just lazy and justify their bad living conditions on capitalism while not moving a finger to improve their lives. 

there are people who move to the US from other countries with zero money and don’t speak any English and they work hard and become successful or even millionaires. So I don’t want to hear any excuses for people who are born in the US and already have a language advantage. 

I hate the idea of communism. Why do I have to pay for other people’s food while they sit at home doing nothing? 

I do wonder if people who try and deny the inherent contradictions of capitalism as a global economic system then don't question the bold.

 

If capitalism is an inherently equalizing force... why would people have to move to the US? 

If capitalism is an inherently equal system, why does so much capital concentrate itself into one part of the world? Surely the natural conclusion of such a mindset is also then that the US and its citizens are just inherently more deserving and whatever qualifiers associated with that (smarter, better, stronger) than 90% of the rest of the world? I don't know if such can parse out at true when put to the test. 

[Miss Show Business]

14 minutes ago, Mr. Blue_Shirt said:

When one of the capitalists said that the US government is not a capitalist government, I just burst out laughing  It has to be one of the funniest sh*ts I've ever heard in 2023.

 

How the f*ck do people say this with confidence without any sense of irony AT ALL?!

It technically isn't though. It largely has a lot of Capitalist aspects, but it's actually considered a mixed market system because we have a public stock market. There are also, albiet poor imo, government regulations in place.

[SmittenCake]

1 minute ago, Delirious said:

That was exaggeration duh? Let me ask you this, are entertainment sources allowed to create any material that they want? Will they be restricted/censored from releasing crude, LGBT or anti economy/government etc songs? This is what I mean.

 

And lol not at you constantly thinking North Korea has any tech progress. Idk what news you're reading but ok. Care to share what tech progress that is? And china still hasn't been able to replicate the processing of advanced chips (they're like 10 years behind)

China may be behind in chip manufacturing, but they're ahead of the curb when it comes to nearly everything else such as housing and transportation. Maybe if these countries (CU, DPRK, IR) weren't heavily slapped with sanctions and bans that are meant to hurt any progress economically and socially could they actually progress. US imperialism and government overthrow will always be the reason for countries and their aggressive leaders. 

 

[She-Rah]

1 minute ago, Communion said:

I do wonder if people who try and deny the inherent contradictions of capitalism as a global economic system then don't question the bold.

 

If capitalism is an inherently equalizing force... why would people have to move to the US? 

If capitalism is an inherently equal system, why does so much capital concentrate itself into one part of the world? Surely the natural conclusion of such a mindset is also then that the US and its citizens are just inherently more deserving and whatever qualifiers associated with that (smarter, better, stronger) than 90% of the rest of the world? I don't know if such can parse out at true when put to the test. 

Political instability in their countries, religious persecution, LGTBTQ asylum seekers etc there are a bunch of reasons why millions move to the west to start from zero. There are people who live comfortably in Qatar that choose to move to the US so they can be in a same sex marriage something that wouldn’t be allowed in their country 

[Delirious]

4 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

China may be behind in chip manufacturing, but they're ahead of the curb when it comes to nearly everything else such as housing and transportation. Maybe if these countries (CU, DPRK, IR) weren't heavily slapped with sanctions and bans that are meant to hurt any progress economically and socially could they actually progress. US imperialism and government overthrow will always be the reason for countries and their aggressive leaders. 

 

But If you're asking about sanctions and bans, let's talk about China banning all American social media since 2010.

 

And housing? Really? Didn't Evergrande have a huge scandal last year?

Edited December 26, 2023 by Delirious

[Kassi]

Communism is deadly because it is force, not freedom. The entire philosophy is centered on forcing entire populations into ideological purity. There is nothing voluntary nor consensual about it.

[SmittenCake]

1 minute ago, Delirious said:

But I you're asking about sanctions and bans, let's talk about China banning all American social media since 2010.

 

And housing? Really? Didn't Evergrande have a huge scandal last year?

The same way America is banning Chinese social media and shops? I had to recently make an Alipay account and verify my passport just to have goods be shipped to me because the US banned websites such as Taobao and continue to push this effort to ban TikTok. 

[Gov Hooka]

49 minutes ago, Delirious said:

Well the Jubilee video was wrong for comparing communism to capitalism. They should've been comparing democracy to communism. Or capitalism to socialism.

 

And technically any money that a person raises in china belongs to the Chinese government. Which is also the reason why land ownership only lasts for 70 years.

Wait til you find out there are elections in China with higher voter participation rates than most Western “liberal democracies.” Or the fact that Chinese home ownership rates are higher than the US…
 

Look no further than India vs China in terms of development and central planning for everything you need to know about capitalism “vs” communism. Two countries ravaged by the horrors of colonialism & imperialism with obscene levels of wealth and labor extraction experiencing very different societal/economic outcomes. 

[Communion]

1 minute ago, She-Rah said:

Political instability in their countries, religious persecution, LGTBTQ asylum seekers etc there are a bunch of reasons why millions move to the west to start from zero. There are people who live comfortably in Qatar that choose to move to the US so they can be in a same sex marriage somethingYou'r that wouldn’t be allowed in their country 

You're not actually addressing the question. Again, you're supposing that capitalism is an inherently fair system. Your evidence to this (and I'm not sure there's actually much evidence to this claim) is the claim that immigrants from around the world can come to America and become successful themselves.

 

The question is then - why would success be different in America than other countries? Why can someone become wealthier in America than they can in other countries? Why does America have more wealth than most other nations in the world? Are then - if capitalism is an inherently equal global economic system - Americans just by large smarter and harder working than 90% of the global population to explain why so much of the world's wealth is concentrated in their hands?

 

I don't think I as an officer worker in America work harder than a child working in a cobalt mine in the Congo. Would you say I do? 

 

If you wouldn't, then you'd have to pause and acknowledge that - at some step in this economic system - there is some kind of innate unfairness and exploitation occurinng.

[Gov Hooka]

8 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

China may be behind in chip manufacturing, but they're ahead of the curb when it comes to nearly everything else such as housing and transportation. Maybe if these countries (CU, DPRK, IR) weren't heavily slapped with sanctions and bans that are meant to hurt any progress economically and socially could they actually progress. US imperialism and government overthrow will always be the reason for countries and their aggressive leaders. 

 

Thankfully we’re moving into the multipolar world order so western sanctions will become increasingly obsolete 

[SmittenCake]

1 minute ago, Gov Hooka said:

Wait til you find out there are elections in China with higher voter participation rates than most Western “liberal democracies.” Or the fact that Chinese home ownership rates are higher than the US…
 

Look no further than India vs China in terms of development and central planning for everything you need to know about capitalism “vs” communism. Two countries ravaged by the horrors of colonialism & imperialism with obscene levels of wealth and labor extraction experiencing very different societal/economic outcomes. 

I sometimes watch Firstpost and I cant help but roll my eyes when the news anchor boasts about India's economy and GDP and then manages to mock China's apparently crashing economy... 

[bad guy]

1 hour ago, Delirious said:

If you don't like capitalistic countries then move to Russia or China

If you don’t like capitalistic countries move to even more aggressive capitalist countries? 

[Gov Hooka]

8 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

I sometimes watch Firstpost and I cant help but roll my eyes when the news anchor boasts about India's economy and GDP and then manages to mock China's apparently crashing economy... 

India is kinda doomed. No viable proper left wing party (Congress is trash) stands a chance against the BJP😭 the farmers protest was a great workers movement and exercise in the unions’ organization but it wasn’t ultimately successful either

Edited December 26, 2023 by Gov Hooka

[Kassi]

For anyone wondering what communism is like when implemented, just imagine your family. 
 

A basic family unit is comparable to communism in that:

• They both emphasize the welfare of the group over individual success
• Resources (like food, money, and living space) are shared among members
• Family members are expected to exhibit mutual support and responsibility
• Planning and decision making is centralized in the hands of a few, in this case parents

Now imagine you come out as gay and your family doesn’t agree with your “lifestyle”. So they force you to enroll in conversion therapy, aka a “re-education” camp, until you subscribe to the dominant ideology set by your homophobic dad.

 

That’s collectivism in a nutshell.