news Israeli liberal: we should kill children, but with a government we trust

[Redstreak]

22 hours ago, N.M.K. said:

And here’s an article of people in Palestine celebrating the death and wounding of Israelis, including teens: 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/palestinians-celebrate-jerusalem-synagogue-massacre-with-fireworks-sweets/

 

Or should we discuss Alham Tamimi, who still lives free in Jordan, who planned a bombing of a pizza parlor that killed sixteen people, including eight children and a pregnant woman, and continued to go on interviews celebrating the murders?

We can pick and highlight inflammatory comments and people all we want- but what are you even trying to accomplish? Other than to flame tensions on a pop forum and make things even worse for those who live through the reality of this conflict? Get a grip. 

And you’re not doing the same? Very interesting this thread has as few responses as it does when threads about bad things from other groups get pages and pages 

[EarthJang]

A lot of israel supporters here, y'all should be ashamed of yourself 

[HungryByTheBuffet]

You're quoting fascist military personnel, posting a video of people who live by tense borders and occupations and are usually hateful and brainwashed cheering over what they perceive as "protection" and revenge, I don't believe you're misguided I think you somewhat purposely doing all this precisely as what you've said "a competition of who hates the other more"

 

people voted for a coalition they thought would actually have enough votes to make an impact in the government, that didn't work anyway.

There are arab-israelis, Palestinians, and of course left Israelis of all types protesting who want nothing to do with your war and fear-mongering, believe or not - most people just want to live quietly and peacefully and have their government take steps to ensure a better environment for everyone on the continent, these tend to not be the loudest ones.

 

You might not see it but all you're doing will just lead to more hate, call it "victim blaming" or whatever, you're bound to find whatever it is you're seeking online.

It won't change the fact that yes, while the protesters have become very diverse in overall opinions since a huge majority is against what's going on, the truth of the matter is both countries have a lot of hate within them, you're not making the point you think you're making.

With peace & love

[Communion]

4 hours ago, HungryByTheBuffet said:

You're quoting fascist military personnel, posting a video of people who live by tense borders and occupations and are usually hateful and brainwashed cheering over what they perceive as "protection" and revenge, I don't believe you're misguided I think you somewhat purposely doing all this precisely as what you've said "a competition of who hates the other more"

 

people voted for a coalition they thought would actually have enough votes to make an impact in the government, that didn't work anyway.

There are arab-israelis, Palestinians, and of course left Israelis of all types protesting who want nothing to do with your war and fear-mongering, believe or not - most people just want to live quietly and peacefully and have their government take steps to ensure a better environment for everyone on the continent, these tend to not be the loudest ones.

 

You might not see it but all you're doing will just lead to more hate, call it "victim blaming" or whatever, you're bound to find whatever it is you're seeking online.

It won't change the fact that yes, while the protesters have become very diverse in overall opinions since a huge majority is against what's going on, the truth of the matter is both countries have a lot of hate within them, you're not making the point you think you're making.

With peace & love

This a wild post to make targeted st the OP who literally lives in Palestine. 

[N.M.K.]

4 hours ago, Redstreak said:

And you’re not doing the same? 

That was my point…

[HungryByTheBuffet]

2 hours ago, Communion said:

This a wild post to make targeted st the OP who literally lives in Palestine. 

Yes, that was pretty obvious, as is the fact that he seems to be holding on to extreme right-wing ideologies and generalising literally a huge group of people fighting for change, basically "they're all bad no matter what" no different than basic propaganda does on both sides.

 

This was a wild thread to make, and I won't be supporting hateful propaganda from either side personally.

You can either fall for these traps and incite more violence and war, which ever "side" you're on, or you can be the change you want to see.

(Or try getting out like a ton of Israelis are currently doing.)

[Communion]

1 hour ago, HungryByTheBuffet said:

extreme right-wing ideologie

Anti-colonization is now an "extreme right-wing ideology"? 

 

Let alone the irony to try and make people feel bad over the idea of "Israelis trying to get out" when the entire conflict is due to Israel not allowing Palestinians the right to return home. This entire conflict is squarely on the shoulders of Israel as an apartheid state, and while some Israelis may leave because the find the conflict escalating, the reality is they're just now then understanding the reality that has befallen onto Palestinians by nature of Israel's existence. 

[Jjang]

28 minutes ago, Communion said:

Anti-colonization is now an "extreme right-wing ideology"? 

 

Let alone the irony to try and make people feel bad over the idea of "Israelis trying to get out" when the entire conflict is due to Israel not allowing Palestinians the right to return home. This entire conflict is squarely on the shoulders of Israel as an apartheid state, and while some Israelis may leave because the find the conflict escalating, the reality is they're just now then understanding the reality that has befallen onto Palestinians by nature of Israel's existence. 

like, they really think I’m not from here and don’t see/experience how common these kinds of opinions are amongst Israelis (left ones, not just right). Or how obsessed they are with the military and IDF and how the average Israeli to their very core believe that the IDF can do no wrong - like that ex pilot in the video. it’s quite literally a worship culture. They are raised on militarized state values since age 0. and it’s not even about direct racism (ex - i hate every Arab to ever exist) but rather the system that they so casually believe in and support that discriminates against an entire population. That’s why so many Arabs are laughing about these protests chants being “saving democracy” because to them its clear as the day that it was never a democracy while the average Israeli lives in an illusion that it’s a fair country that has no fundamental issues at its very foundational core and that rather its a “government” thing. 

 

Also, if they were truly against segregation and apartheid, or illegal occupation, why didn’t they mobilize these mass protests beforehand? these issues didn’t begin with the new government. It’s because they are mainly protesting their rights getting altered, while Palestinian rights are hardly ever a concern. 

——————

 

…I’ll reply to a few posts I found moronic here in detail later when I’m not busy. 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Jjang

[ClashAndBurn]

13 hours ago, ZIVERT said:

Wow, this chart really puts it into perspective for me. There have been more Ukrainian civilian casualties in a year and a half of war than any citizen casualty in the last ~20 years of on and off war in Israel and Palestine. of course it goes without saying that one civilian’s death is worth more than another’s but it does show the difference between when a country has regard for human life during war or conflict, and when one doesn’t.

 

How very like you to make US-sanctioned terrorism against Palestinians about Ukraine  

[HungryByTheBuffet]

1 hour ago, Communion said:

Anti-colonization is now an "extreme right-wing ideology"? 

 

Let alone the irony to try and make people feel bad over the idea of "Israelis trying to get out" when the entire conflict is due to Israel not allowing Palestinians the right to return home. This entire conflict is squarely on the shoulders of Israel as an apartheid state, and while some Israelis may leave because the find the conflict escalating, the reality is they're just now then understanding the reality that has befallen onto Palestinians by nature of Israel's existence. 

Inciting more war and fear using cited hate speech to further create division is 100% right-wing ideology that creates more death and violence, you can spin it in any way you want.

Like of course high up military personnel are full of hate and are war mongering, that's meant to be shocking?  why is OP trying so hard to say "yes all Israelis"?

Both governments are very right-wing at the moment and further escalate the situation.

 

You're not really arguing against anything I've said we simply have different thoughts about the proper solution, mine involves peace-making and allowing everybody to live peacefully whilst yours includes re-creating the past by what? kicking out everyone in Jerusalem from the homes they were born in in order to let a generation that wasn't involved in past conflicts 'back'? encouraging more fighting over pointless land no one who actually wants to live a life cares about? surely that will lead to actual integration and acceptance by both sides!

 

Personally am not going to abide by this idiology that Israel should not exist when it already does like any country founded and based upon war and taking land in the 1800-1960, or that the Middle East should only be a place of religious extreme law with no escape when I've worked with countless gay Palestinian refugees who would otherwise get burned to death by their own family and friends like had happened to their own friends and other gay Palestinian friends I've had to lose to this who literally kidnapped them back to murder them after they already escaped, but sure let's incite more violence and hatred no doubt that is the proper solution that OP has come up with, a brand new idea, groundbreaking! not at all clutching to the status quo

 

1 hour ago, Jjang said:

like, they really think I’m not from here and don’t see/experience how common these kinds of opinions are amongst Israelis (left ones, not just right). Or how obsessed they are with the military and IDF and how the average Israeli to their very core believe that the IDF can do no wrong - like that ex pilot in the video. it’s quite literally a worship culture. They are raised on militarized state values since age 0. and it’s not even about direct racism (ex - i hate every Arab to ever exist) but rather the system that they so casually believe in and support that discriminates against an entire population. That’s why so many Arabs are laughing about these protests chants being “saving democracy” because to them its clear as the day that it was never a democracy while the average Israeli lives in an illusion that it’s a fair country that has no fundamental issues at its very foundational core and that rather its a “government” thing. 

Oh the forced military draft that kills so many 18-year-old kids some of whom have yet to even develop a political ideology whilst traumatizing countless others for life? sure let's blame them, while completely ignoring the percentage of citizens who've fought to not be forced drafted or those who've failed - got drafted and committed suicide, I'll make sure to also bash any Russian and Ukrainian refugees I've met who've had to escape their forced draft, nothing wrong with that all!

 

I won't skit into "core beliefs" and what is being taught in either sides despite how easy it would be to refute your view that this is an issue for Israel only, because that's an extremely basic trap that holds to the status quo, wow shocking, when you get taught all your life the other side hates you, you hate back and see an entire land of people as "one" who would have thought, surely continuing to bash ALL is the solution and isn't just inciting more hatred from both sides, surely that can't be how all wars are managed and maintained! unheard of

 

Keep laughing at human rights protests luv, I'll keep advocating for proper rights and peace in Palestine & Israel whilst not laughing at important protests on either side trying to advance or secure human rights... such a joke right? more war MUST be the solution!

[Communion]

9 minutes ago, HungryByTheBuffet said:

kicking out everyone in Jerusalem from the homes they were born in in order to let a generation that wasn't involved in past conflicts 'back'?

...you literally just describes the modus operandi of Zionism? That thing that's currently been happening for decades to Palestinians? 

 

The only ideology that leads to the reality that Israel shouldn't exist is Zionism itself. As long as Israel operates as a Zionist state, its government is founded on the operating notion that a single ethnicity must make up an artificial majority as the subjugation of others. So thus, as long as a Zionist Israel exists, Palestinians will forever be victims to apartheid. So Israel must abandon its goals of Zionism, and many Zionists say Israel can only exist as a Zionist state or else it wouldn't be Israel, so well... 

Edited September 23, 2023 by Communion

[HungryByTheBuffet]

  

25 minutes ago, Communion said:

...you literally just describes the modus operandi of Zionism? That thing that's currently been happening for decades to Palestinians? 

 

The only ideology that leads to the reality that Israel shouldn't exist is Zionism itself. As long as Israel operates as a Zionist state, its government is founded on the operating notion that a single ethnicity must make up an artificial majority as the subjugation of others. So thus, as long as a Zionist Israel exists, Palestinians will forever be victims to apartheid. So Israel must abandon its goals of Zionism, and many Zionists say Israel can only exist as a Zionist state or else it wouldn't be Israel, so well... 

As in the Palestinian government's ideology is healthier and not racially based? shocking to hear, Israelis and Palestinians are not their government! this applies to all other countries in case this is new info, what I'm saying is that there are things that further promote peace and healthier governments for both states with leaders and parties who can support that, and there are threads like this that further the division that quite literally creates folk like who OP quoted, and OP themselves.

 

Yes, both states are ethnically segregated in law to different degrees, war itself feeds and stays alive by further division and seeing all from the other side as one, so saying things like "annihilate" the other country and all the people in it becomes easier to say without understanding the cognitive bias at play.

 

A healthier way to think about this that can lead to a better future is understanding that all citizens are victims when 2 countries are at war.

This applies to Russia-Ukraine as well as I've seen people throw around "Russians" and "all Russians" and the way they think etc around a lot too, the dissonance people have is so morally broken.

The generalizations by OP are literally how both states continue to manufacture racist war-happy individuals who end up believing their only choice is more violence.

Edited September 23, 2023 by HungryByTheBuffet

[Jjang]

On 9/22/2023 at 1:25 PM, ZIVERT said:

Wow, this chart really puts it into perspective for me. There have been more Ukrainian civilian casualties in a year and a half of war than any citizen casualty in the last ~20 years of on and off war in Israel and Palestine. of course it goes without saying that one civilian’s death is worth more than another’s but it does show the difference between when a country has regard for human life during war or conflict, and when one doesn’t.

 

the way this comment aged like milk and @Communion was correct like always and you showed your criminal bias towards Israel like always.