discussion Is Animal Abuse Apology An Issue On ATRL?

[GraceRandolph]

1 minute ago, ugo said:

isn't the problem more industrialisation ? 

Then can you meat eaters explain how we can continue to kill millions of animals for you?

[Devin]

6 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said:

It’s really not though.  
 

The biggest drivers of environmental racism is the lagoons of **** created by meat eaters favorite tasty dead animals and the constant **** that comes out of their asses. 

Instead of “deflecting” further. How would you like us to improve?

[ugo]

3 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said:

Then can you meat eaters explain how we can continue to kill millions of animals for you?

I don't see the issue with eating meat and I do the effort to always get sustainable meat and fish. 

[Sheep]

12 minutes ago, Devin said:

Instead of “deflecting” further. How would you like us to improve?

To be clear, pigs, some of the most intelligent and emotionally complex creatures on Earth are being forced in the hundreds of millions to eat **** and live in the most torturous conditions imaginable, and the OP is more concerned with grandstanding over niche issues and accusing other animal rights supporters of not being being supportive enough. It's about their sense of moral superiority and not about improving anything.

 

If you actually want to improve educate yourself on the farming practices in the US and you'll get a clear picture of where to go from there. Real activism that doesn't make a joke out of serious issues to regular people and reducing consumption are both huge Ws.  

Edited September 3, 2023 by Century

[lacy]

5 minutes ago, ugo said:

I don't see the issue with eating meat and I do the effort to always get sustainable meat and fish. 

You're paying for an innocent animal to suffer a life of abuse just to ultimately be murdered for you, causing damage to our planet in the process.

 

No "grass fed" or "local farm" or "sustainable" sticker on the packaging changes that I fear.

[lacy]

2 minutes ago, onapearl said:

I think there could be more nuance in the conversation about making the ways we procure meat and other animal products less inhumane, such as reducing industrialization in farming, rather than an all-or-nothing hardcore veganism vs wanton torture of livestock fight that goes nowhere.

I fear whenever the process involves taking an innocent beings life, it's never going to be humane.

[ugo]

1 minute ago, lacy said:

You're paying for an innocent animal to suffer a life of abuse just to ultimately be murdered for you, causing damage to our planet in the process.

 

No "grass fed" or "local farm" or "sustainable" sticker on the packaging changes that I fear.

and it's perfectly legal to eat meat 

 

ur phone and laptop also use animal byproducts 

 

[Headlock]

Just now, lacy said:

I fear whenever the process involves taking an innocent beings life, it's never going to be humane.

Genuine question: what makes the animal innocent? How would you define an ‘guilty/evil’ animal? How do you prescribe morality onto a thing which does not speak or is not the same species? Is there such thing as a morally corrupt animal? See, the thing with absolutes like you are pushing is it creates thought problems that did not exist before.

[lacy]

Just now, ugo said:

and it's perfectly legal to eat meat 

 

ur phone and laptop also use animal byproducts 

 

legality ≠ morality neither

 

i don't have a phone so that would surprise me, but yes i'm aware deep within some element of my macbook there is probably an animal product in the battery or in the screen, you're so right, so why don't i go out now and slaughter 10,000 animals for the kii since i'll never be morally pure for having owned a macbook

[lacy]

Just now, Headlock said:

Genuine question: what makes the animal innocent? How would you define an ‘guilty/evil’ animal? How do you prescribe morality onto a thing which does not speak or is not the same species? Is there such thing as a morally corrupt animal? See, the thing with absolutes like you are pushing is it creates thought problems that did not exist before.

I deem them innocent as these animals were not causing harm; it's not a necessary slaughter, an us or them situation for example.

 

Therefor they do not deserve to be killed.

[Headlock]

Just now, lacy said:

I deem them innocent as these animals were not causing harm; it's not a necessary slaughter, an us or them situation for example.

 

Therefor they do not deserve to be killed.

And what does ‘causing harm’ mean? Would you find it justified to kill (and eat) an animal that was harming other animals?

[GraceRandolph]

Just now, Headlock said:

And what does ‘causing harm’ mean? Would you find it justified to kill (and eat) an animal that was harming other animals?

Why would you feel the need to eat an animal if you had to kill it to defend yourself or a pet?  

[ugo]

1 minute ago, lacy said:

legality ≠ morality neither

 

i don't have a phone so that would surprise me, but yes i'm aware deep within some element of my macbook there is probably an animal product in the battery or in the screen, you're so right, so why don't i go out now and slaughter 10,000 animals for the kii since i'll never be morally pure for having owned a macbook

I don't think my consumption amounts to 10000 animals  but anyway I actually don't feel bad at all for eating meat because in my beliefs it's ok specially if I go the extra mile to get better sourced products. And I totally respect your choice of being a vegan (I guess not to the strict since you own a MacBook)

 

The truth is you're not helping the planet when you look down on people for eating meat and a lot of vegan products are actually awful for the planet.

 

 

[vale9001]

In some cultures people are just poor . This Is why some food traditions exists and people eat animals. 

 

Calling meat eaters devils Is stupid and not connected with nature. Animals eat other Animals and we are Animals. If a Wolf kills another animal he's not cruel, actually he partecipate to that spiritual process Is nature. All the not civilized and not capitalist cultures eats Animals too and they respect their sacrality and their Spirit more than our cultures where Animals are in the best scenario "our cute puppies", as they are children. Eating animals in these cultures is respecting them, a reconnection between all the spirits and souls in that thing nature is. The end of a long process in the life of any Animals. 

Telling them to eat tofu is arrogance.

 

Then of course we don't have to be cruel with Animals, we should't eat industrial meat bought in the supermarkets, we eat too much meat from Animals are just created to be killed and then eaten. That's not the Natural process between species. So It's wrong and it's destroying the environment too. I agree with this.

 

But if you are a family with that cow in the garden and you grew her, you cure her and then at the end of her Life, with a not cruel system, you kill her to eat their meat for all the year you're not cruel. It's the Natural process between species. 

[lacy]

1 minute ago, onapearl said:

You could extend the same thought process to plant life. Or argue that clearing out forests for human settlement destroys and fragments wild animals' homes, which also causes suffering. Tbh, the entire modern human lifestyle is detrimental to all other forms of life on this planet. I respect people trying to reduce their impact, but no one should get it twisted that they don't contribute to non-human suffering in some way.

Okay but plants don't have a central nervous system nor a brain, killing a plant isn't the same as killing an animal but lets be honest you already knew that

 

It's ironic you bring up deforestation when so often this happens to make space to grow crops to feed to livestock

[GraceRandolph]

Just now, onapearl said:

So that the lost life of that animal doesn't go to waste? It wasn't its fault that its instincts are to fight and hunt.

We wouldn’t immediately jump to eating a person if we had to kill them in self defense, and most cultures wouldn’t eat a dog if it attacked them, so that’s not a thought process that makes much sense. 

[lacy]

Just now, GraceRandolph said:

We wouldn’t immediately jump to eating a person if we had to kill them in self defense, and most cultures wouldn’t eat a dog if it attacked them, so that’s not a thought process that makes much sense. 

I fear we're only on page 2 and certain users have turned to bad faith arguments

[I♥Toronto]

Veganism is frequently mocked

 

wah 

[lacy]

1 minute ago, ugo said:

I don't think my consumption amounts to 10000 animals  but anyway I actually don't feel bad at all for eating meat because in my beliefs it's ok specially if I go the extra mile to get better sourced products. And I totally respect your choice of being a vegan (I guess not to the strict since you own a MacBook)

 

The truth is you're not helping the planet when you look down on people for eating meat and a lot of vegan products are actually awful for the planet.

 

 

I fear you're not clear on the definition of vegan; it's a lifestyle that involves limiting the suffering of animals as far as practically possible, i'm no less of a vegan for owning a macbook as there is limited information as to what is specifically in the device that contains animal products and there is not a vegan alternative.

[Devin]

2 minutes ago, vale9001 said:

In some cultures people are just poor. This Is why some food traditions exists and people eat animals.  

Also a good point. 

[Headlock]

10 minutes ago, GraceRandolph said:

Why would you feel the need to eat an animal if you had to kill it to defend yourself or a pet?  

Wouldn’t it be morally worse to allow the animal’s life to go to waste?

[ugo]

3 minutes ago, lacy said:

I fear you're not clear on the definition of vegan; it's a lifestyle that involves limiting the suffering of animals as far as practically possible, i'm no less of a vegan for owning a macbook as there is limited information as to what is specifically in the device that contains animal products and there is not a vegan alternative.

yeah but my point still stand you're not helping the planet or anyone when you're calling out people for eating meat in fact you're just reinforcing the sentiment against veganism  

[lacy]

1 minute ago, ugo said:

yeah but my point still stand you're not helping the planet or anyone when you're calling out people for eating meat in fact you're just reinforcing the sentiment against veganism  

I disagree;

 

I haven't been vegan all my life. I went vegan a few years ago because someone online was arguing it and when you follow the logic, it's the right thing to do.

 

There's a lot of push back because people don't want to change their ways, but posting like this does change some peoples minds and progress is made.

 

But what would being a pick me vegan telling everyone it's totally fine to keep eating meat accomplish? You'd feel better about yourself but nothing would change.

 

What change are you making? You can type here that you think it'd be cool if you could eat meat without there being any consequences but this miracle isn't coming.

[nostalgic]

Anybody else in the mood for a steak? 

[lacy]

Just now, nostalgic said:

Anybody else in the mood for a steak? 

nooo he got us noooooo stoppp