YellowRibbon Posted August 24, 2023 Posted August 24, 2023 (edited) One of the flaws of Lula's foreign policy is the blind hatred that he feels towards the US stance in the World, to the point where he would support Imperialist Russia in a heartbeat over a smaller nation like Ukraine (and would even support the unlawful annexation of some Ukrainian provinces just to appease the decaying Russian society in the name of "peace"). The US is no saint of my devotion btw, before some members come here claiming that. OT: I'm happy for the LGBTQ+ community in Brazil! Edited August 24, 2023 by YellowRibbon 1 2
AMIT Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 6 hours ago, YellowRibbon said: One of the flaws of Lula's foreign policy is the blind hatred that he feels towards the US stance in the World, to the point where he would support Imperialist Russia in a heartbeat over a smaller nation like Ukraine (and would even support the unlawful annexation of some Ukrainian provinces just to appease the decaying Russian society in the name of "peace"). The US is no saint of my devotion btw, before some members come here claiming that. OT: I'm happy for the LGBTQ+ community in Brazil! Not someone from Chile of all places coming in here with this type of nonsense. Both your country and mine were victims of US intervention which resulted in military coups that ended up with fascist regimes. We literally just had a scandal 10 years ago that showed the US illegaly spying on our government and that was one of the many reasons why we got Bolsonaro. Similar things happened in MOST of the other LatAm countries. "Blind hatred" like the hate is very much JUSTIFIED. "Imperialist Russia" as if the US itself isn't the biggest and most violent imperialist nation since like the WW2. Saying it is ''no saint'' is a HUGE understatement. And I don't agree with what Russia is doing btw, before you try claiming that. 1 1
Bloodflowers. Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 Only Gretchen is allowed to use the word that starts with "f"
YellowRibbon Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 44 minutes ago, AMIT said: Not someone from Chile of all places coming in here with this type of nonsense. Both your country and mine were victims of US intervention which resulted in military coups that ended up with fascist regimes. We literally just had a scandal 10 years ago that showed the US illegaly spying on our government and that was one of the many reasons why we got Bolsonaro. Similar things happened in MOST of the other LatAm countries. "Blind hatred" like the hate is very much JUSTIFIED. "Imperialist Russia" as if the US itself isn't the biggest and most violent imperialist nation since like the WW2. Saying it is ''no saint'' is a HUGE understatement. And I don't agree with what Russia is doing btw, before you try claiming that. I'm very aware of the atrocities that the US committed in the region during the 70's and through the decades that followed them. That has nothing to do with what I'm trying to say though. Aligning yourself with a nation like Russia (who's been Imperialist for far longer than the US, even before the American Independence War) is not justifiable even when we take in consideration all the bullsh*t that the US government did in other regions around the World. The correct position here is supporting Ukraine's right to not have their borders violated by an external force (regardless of the nature and intentions of the US support towards them). I think we can all agree on that 1
AMIT Posted August 25, 2023 Posted August 25, 2023 6 minutes ago, YellowRibbon said: I'm very aware of the atrocities that the US committed in the region during the 70's and through the decades that followed them. That has nothing to do with what I'm trying to say though. Aligning yourself with a nation like Russia (who's been Imperialist for far longer than the US, even before the American Independence War) is not justifiable even when we take in consideration all the bullsh*t that the US government did in other regions around the World. The correct position here is supporting Ukraine's right to not have their borders violated by an external force (regardless of the nature and intentions of the US support towards them). I think we can all agree on that It doesn't matter that the correct ''moral'' position is supporting Ukraine. This is not a moral issue, but a geopolitical one. I comdemn Russia's decision to illegally invade Ukraine and any other country, but what we're not gonna do is discuss morality of threatening the sovereignity of other countries when the ******* US is involved. Are you going to come for other countries that ''support'' the US even when it has invaded countless other countries in the name of imperialism? Be serious. How does US imperialism have nothing to do with you condemning Brazil of aligning itself with Russia? You really gonna sit there and say there's no correlation between the two? This is about geopolitics, not morals. The issue is far more complicated than you are willing to admit. 2
Scars Posted August 25, 2023 Author Posted August 25, 2023 (edited) 9 hours ago, YellowRibbon said: One of the flaws of Lula's foreign policy is the blind hatred that he feels towards the US stance in the World, to the point where he would support Imperialist Russia in a heartbeat over a smaller nation like Ukraine (and would even support the unlawful annexation of some Ukrainian provinces just to appease the decaying Russian society in the name of "peace"). The US is no saint of my devotion btw, before some members come here claiming that. OT: I'm happy for the LGBTQ+ community in Brazil! That was painfully off-topic, y'all definitely don't randomly bring up NATO's close relationship with Qatar whenever LGBTQIA+ rights in western countries are discussed. Neoliberalism is a disease. First of all, Brazil is the only country from the BRICS to constantly side with the ONU resolution demading Russia to withdraw it's military forces from Ukraine. Geopolitical relationships and the power dynamics within those relations are much more complexed and nuanced than what your post suggests. Lula was a victim of lawfare that was heavily influenced by US forces, he has personal reasons to 'hate' the US, but that's not the case. Not only he seeks to solidify Brazil-US relations even further, as the US is Brazil's second biggest trade pattern, but he's essentially an ally to Biden. Let's not get carried away with The Economist Magazine out-of-context headlines. Politics isn't some Marvel movie. Looking at the Russia-Ukraine issue, there's no reason to expect a NATO'd position coming from a Global South country that isn't even...a part of NATO. Unlike the meddling pattern of western forces, Russia (and China, but that's another topic) does a great job at mantaining their relations with emerging markets from South America, which is the case for Brazil. BRICS was founded in 2009 and it's only getting stronger, so neoliberal bs aside, I objectively ask: when it comes to having the best interests of Brazil in mind, why would Lula have a diplomatic position that creates tension between them and one of their strongest economic allies, especially about a conflict that has minimal influence on Brazil and the entire region? I mean, Ukraine itself has sided with NATO in very questionable stances and/or abstained vote on UN resolutions based on what was diplomatically viable to them. Despite Zelensky's silly comments on Latin America leaders not really help the scenario, I agree with anyone that says Lula shouldn't discuss the conflict as much because putting it bluntly: the entire Global South really have bigger fish to fry. Edited August 25, 2023 by Scars 2 1
Scars Posted August 25, 2023 Author Posted August 25, 2023 (edited) 11 hours ago, ontherocks said: Yes, he hopes for peace in the way that Ukraine stops defending itself and leaves the occupied territory to Russia That's not what the Brazil vote in the UN Assembly Resolution on Russia-Ukraine says, but regardless of that, not everything is about Europe. Stay on topic, please! Edited August 25, 2023 by Scars 1
Recommended Posts