Vermillion Posted June 30, 2023 Author Posted June 30, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sannie said: Like, of course. Who is surprised? The GOP can cheer this on all they want, but these decisions are only going to fire the Dems up. I agree that Dems are not doing enough, but Dems are going to be pissed come next year and the messaging from the left needs to focus on how insane these decisions are. Literally the dozens of studies and focus groups I've read indicate the exact opposite on this issue, specifically. The fall of Roe (and '22 wave) and student loans are apples and oranges when it comes to turn-out. It's two different facets of political science entirely.
Sannie Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 Just now, Communion said: People don't vote against things. They vote for things. Voting is transactional. The era of Trump having a one-time exception does not change human psychology. Sure, the average voter is like this, but we are talking about a bloc of voters who are far more educated on these topics than any other bloc in history. Young people understand the processes and know what needs to be done. I am fully aware that I am running on hopium right now, but I do genuinely have faith in these people. I guess we will see.
ATRL Moderator khalyan Posted June 30, 2023 ATRL Moderator Posted June 30, 2023 2 minutes ago, Sannie said: This logic just does not make sense to me because it is basically saying "people will be so mad at Biden for the GOP striking down his plan that they will let the GOP take control". Gen Z and the younger voting population are much more in tune with what is going on right now and they understand the problem standing in their way is the GOP. They are not going to sit back and let the GOP take over when the GOP is who are making these horrible decisions. I have faith in this kids because they know this is what their future holds if they sit back and do nothing, and nothing points to them not doing anything. They will just get angrier than ever before. Younger voters will not decide to vote for the GOP because of this, but they'll sit home completely unmotivated because time after time, it's been proven that no matter who's in charge the issues that affect younger people the most do not get resolved. 8
makeme Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 (edited) Spoiler This is why I got a sugar daddy when I was 18 so I didn't remain a loser in my small town or take out 40k worth of loans I knew I couldn't pay back. 0 college debt 0 help from parents and i'm not even attractive. Not bad for a 4 with no talent! No but in all seriousness I feel bad for my peers that are stuck in debt this sucks. Edited June 30, 2023 by makeme 3
Armani? Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 8 minutes ago, Sannie said: Like, of course. Who is surprised? The GOP can cheer this on all they want, but these decisions are only going to fire the Dems up. I agree that Dems are not doing enough, but Dems are going to be pissed come next year and the messaging from the left needs to focus on how insane these decisions are. Maybe if Biden hadn't agreed to resuming the payments in the debt ceiling bill they would. It's disingenuous 1
LustSpell Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 I don't care anymore I hope all of 6 of them perish 1
Sannie Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 Just now, khalyan said: Younger voters will not decide to vote for the GOP because of this, but they'll sit home completely unmotivated because time after time, it's been proven that no matter who's in charge the issues that affect younger people the most do not get resolved. We have been seeing over the past five years that this is changing, and changing in a big way. We just saw Biden of all people score one of, if not the biggest midterm victories in a very long time hugely in part thanks to the young voters. 1 minute ago, Espresso said: Literally the dozens of studies and focus groups I've read indicate the exact opposite on this issue, specifically. The fall of Roe (and '22 wave) and student loans are apples and oranges when it comes to turn-out. It's two different facets of political science entirely. I understand what you are saying, I just do not think it is that easy. It is one thing to say "I will be pissed if Biden's loan forgiveness does not go through", while "I will sit back and let Trump take over and ruin my life even more" is a whole other story. Most educated voters, which a lot of the younger bloc is, understand the machinations of SCOTUS and how they are going over Biden to hurt the working class. 1
Sannie Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 Just now, Armani? said: Maybe if Biden hadn't agreed to resuming the payments in the debt ceiling bill they would. It's disingenuous Oh for sure, that is going to be a huge hurdle for him to justify. Not sure how he will get over it. I am not exactly sure what steps he can take to be like, "take backsies". But he does have a lot of young, educated people on his team who may be savvy enough to come up with a workaround.
Sombre Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 Can someone explain why this would ultimately make Biden lose in 2024? Shouldn't this alienate people from the republican party, considering republican justices have struck down the loan forgiveness program?
perfect blue Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 1 minute ago, Sombre said: Can someone explain why this would ultimately make Biden lose in 2024? Shouldn't this alienate people from the republican party, considering republican justices have struck down the loan forgiveness program? Because he has executive power to cancel them but he's too much of a ***** ***** to do it.
ATRL Moderator khalyan Posted June 30, 2023 ATRL Moderator Posted June 30, 2023 1 minute ago, Sannie said: We have been seeing over the past five years that this is changing, and changing in a big way. We just saw Biden of all people score one of, if not the biggest midterm victories in a very long time hugely in part thanks to the young voters. This is completely unrelated to the issues of student loan forgiveness. Biden announced his plan for student loan forgiveness in August 2022. The midterm elections occurred on November 8, 2022 and then the application for student loan forgiveness was paused November 11, 2022. 1
luckythisway Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 (edited) Good. Overpaying for unnecessary education has become such an epidemic in the United States. All you need to be successful is a solid education (which you can get from a much cheaper state school), real-world experience, and drive. Other people’s mistakes/misunderstandings of what you need to extract from a college education shouldn’t be a federally controlled, financial responsibility for taxpayers Edited June 30, 2023 by luckythisway 13
Cruel Summer Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 6 minutes ago, khalyan said: What is the government going to do with the $39 tax return I received last year? I mean, it's situational. I usually get a few thousand dollars back due to what my employer withholds based on my W-4, and I know a lot of other people are in the same boat. Those people rely on that windfall for a little more wiggle room, and many of them may not be able to adjust their withholdings such that they get that money throughout the year - so that entire sum is then up for grabs to pay delinquent student loans if they refuse to pay. If your tax return is small, then sure, it's no big deal, but then they just garnish your wages at a relatively steep 15% to 25%, which I know a lot ot people can't immediately afford.
qurl Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 hmmm a case on LGBTQ discrimination “after” pride weekend and the student loan debt cancellation CANCELLATION on the friday before 4th of July seems fine !
Gavin. Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 10 minutes ago, Sannie said: Sure, the average voter is like this, but we are talking about a bloc of voters who are far more educated on these topics than any other bloc in history. Young people understand the processes and know what needs to be done. I am fully aware that I am running on hopium right now, but I do genuinely have faith in these people. I guess we will see. I mean if Biden clearly says hat he doesn’t want to expand the court then what’s the point in voting for him tbfh congress is where change needs to happen tho, presidency…I wish Biden an ounce of luck
nadiamendell Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 I thought they'd at least give us ONE win this week, but no. **** this country.
Pheromosa Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 i went back to school so I wont have to pay. wonder how long I can keep that up
Rotunda Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 21 minutes ago, Sannie said: This logic just does not make sense to me because it is basically saying "people will be so mad at Biden for the GOP striking down his plan that they will let the GOP take control". Gen Z and the younger voting population are much more in tune with what is going on right now and they understand the problem standing in their way is the GOP. They are not going to sit back and let the GOP take over when the GOP is who are making these horrible decisions. I have faith in this kids because they know this is what their future holds if they sit back and do nothing, and nothing points to them not doing anything. They will just get angrier than ever before. Some people aren’t gonna vote if they don’t think the Dems will give them something in return, even if they know the GOP is worse. 1
Vermillion Posted June 30, 2023 Author Posted June 30, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sannie said: We have been seeing over the past five years that this is changing, and changing in a big way. We just saw Biden of all people score one of, if not the biggest midterm victories in a very long time hugely in part thanks to the young voters. I understand what you are saying, I just do not think it is that easy. It is one thing to say "I will be pissed if Biden's loan forgiveness does not go through", while "I will sit back and let Trump take over and ruin my life even more" is a whole other story. Most educated voters, which a lot of the younger bloc is, understand the machinations of SCOTUS and how they are going over Biden to hurt the working class. Literally ALL that matters is Latino and young black turnout in cities in swing states in the Upper Midwest (I'd add Georgia to that but the Republicans have taken a lot of steps post 2020 regarding ballots, etc. that will severely hinder that). Biden isn't willing to expand the court. They will not show up as a result. It's literally that simple. Shaming them or warnings of encroaching fascism aren't working.
Rotunda Posted June 30, 2023 Posted June 30, 2023 7 minutes ago, Pheromosa said: i went back to school so I wont have to pay. wonder how long I can keep that up Phermosa, MPP, MPA, MSW, MFA, MPH, JD, PhD
Vermillion Posted June 30, 2023 Author Posted June 30, 2023 12 minutes ago, Sombre said: Can someone explain why this would ultimately make Biden lose in 2024? Shouldn't this alienate people from the republican party, considering republican justices have struck down the loan forgiveness program? Alienation from the Republican Party is not an automatic equivalent to any turn-out, even if unenthusiastic, for the top-line candidates for the Democratic Party. People need to understand that.
ATRL Moderator khalyan Posted June 30, 2023 ATRL Moderator Posted June 30, 2023 9 minutes ago, Pheromosa said: i went back to school so I wont have to pay. wonder how long I can keep that up Thank goodness I’m in school right now too
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