discussion Is anger against singers performing in Israel misplaced?

[JawBreaker]

Its not misplaced but personally I couldn't care less. Its just a concert. Like others have said in here its just selective outrage. 

 

 

Anyways I myself cant wait to go to Israel someday. It has sucha rich history imagine missing out on that cuz SJWs on twitter says you're bad person if you do so

Just like I'll be visiting Hawaii! I find it so cringe how people on Twitter are dragging people for going there cuz apparently the locals dont want tourist there

[State of Grace.]

54 minutes ago, Miichael said:

I just don't understand why the outrage/anger is so selective. Lots of artists perform there but only some get backlash for it 

The bigger the artist, the bigger the outrage. Plus, people are getting more and more educated on the matter. 

 

Obviously a no1currie flop artist isn't gonna cause the same outrage or get the same backlash as an A lister.

5 minutes ago, JawBreaker said:

Its not misplaced but personally I couldn't care less. Its just a concert. Like others have said in here its just selective outrage. 

 

 

Anyways I myself cant wait to go to Israel someday. It has sucha rich history imagine missing out on that cuz SJWs on twitter says you're bad person if you do so

Just like I'll be visiting Hawaii! I find it so cringe how people on Twitter are dragging people for going there cuz apparently the locals dont want tourist there

What an amazing rich history of genocide and settler colonialism. Imagine missing out on that because of Twitter losers.  😍

[Nano]

2 hours ago, Gwendolyn said:

I know what a genocide is. My grandparents came from a country which was torn apart by the British, inside and out and had a war for 3 years which resulted in the deaths of 30,000. What Israel is doing to Palestinians since the beginning of its existence has been to take as much land as possible, destroy homes, and claim cultures that aren't theirs as their own. If there wasn't a genocide, why have so many Palestinians claimed mistreatment from the Israeli state, why has the Gaza Strip gotten smaller and smaller over the years? And why can't Palestinians from the West Bank/Gaza marry Israelis and become naturalised? Why did an Israeli official just a few months ago claim there was ‘no such thing’ as a Palestinian people?

I would love to know what you think, or are you going to give me The Times of Israel as a source to shut down years and years of deaths in Palestine by the IDF?

Please. Genocide is attempting to literally wipe away the existence of your people from an entire continent (and nearly succeeding over the course of 12 freaking years). Israel is treating the Palestinians badly, but a genocide this is not.

[Sergi91]

Yes. People who care for human rights should not only be boycotting performances in Israel. There are plenty of injustices happening in other countries including here in the USA. You can’t be selective. You either boycott all performances or not. 

[Outlaws]

All this over... concerts

[Abracadabra]

9 minutes ago, State of Grace. said:

The bigger the artist, the bigger the outrage. Plus, people are getting more and more educated on the matter. 

 

Obviously a no1currie flop artist isn't gonna cause the same outrage or get the same backlash as an A lister.

Hmm I don't know if that's completely true sis. Acts like Maroon 5 and Travis Scott are inarguably bigger than Lorde, Sam Smith, and Xtina but they didn't receive any notable backlash for their performances there.

[Solaria]

No. It's literally one country that they can easily refuse to perform in. Performing in Israel is supporting their government like already has been said here, EVERYTHING is propaganda to their government.

 

 

[Solaria]

That said, I have more of an issue with backlash against Israeli singers and pop stars like Noa Kirel who got vilified on Twitter without taking in context that she does not know any better, she was born and raised there.

 

The argument that ''the internet exists, she should inform herself'' is true and all, but when you've been told a certain truth your entire life and have such a connection with your country (Israelis are very patriotic) then how do you expect to hold the people that have been living there their whole life accountable for that?

[gatito]

no

 

FREE PALESTINE

[JawBreaker]

23 minutes ago, State of Grace. said:

 

What an amazing rich history of genocide and settler colonialism. Imagine missing out on that because of Twitter losers.  😍

Righhhht lol you totally get me those losers are so annoying 

Why would I miss out on seeing the IDF headquarters over sum Twitter losers 

 

[State of Grace.]

34 minutes ago, Miichael said:

Hmm I don't know if that's completely true sis. Acts like Maroon 5 and Travis Scott are inarguably bigger than Lorde, Sam Smith, and Xtina but they didn't receive any notable backlash for their performances there.

Nobody expects better from Maroon 5 and Travis Scott. I've definitely seen some comments criticizing them. The 3 acts you named have spoken about human rights before so the outrage was expected. You don't get to pick and choose human rights.

 

I do agree that the energy should be the same for everyone, but I also understand why some names cause a bigger uproar than others.

25 minutes ago, Love Again said:

That said, I have more of an issue with backlash against Israeli singers and pop stars like Noa Kirel who got vilified on Twitter without taking in context that she does not know any better, she was born and raised there.

 

The argument that ''the internet exists, she should inform herself'' is true and all, but when you've been told a certain truth your entire life and have such a connection with your country (Israelis are very patriotic) then how do you expect to hold the people that have been living there their whole life accountable for that?

Noa's entire song and Eurovision campaign is literally Israeli propaganda and textbook pinkwashing. And of course the Eurovision gays fell for it cause its a bawp.  

 

https://twitter.com/ellasrhapsody/status/1657491349799665669?t=HC3HlytUVlY_ZhZAk7kdKQ&s=19

 

You can't really use the "she doesnt know better" card when this happened meanwhile several teenagers there refuse to join the IDF and actually speak up against their government.

 

Edited June 15, 2023 by State of Grace.

[WildHeart]

2 hours ago, Pendulum said:

Are you seriously comparing something that happened a century ago with the current Israeli state?  

The US has caused the death of more than 1 million people in the last 20 years alone 

[Solaria]

1 minute ago, State of Grace. said:

Nobody expects better from Maroon 5 and Travis Scott. I've definitely seen some comments criticizing them. The 3 acts you named have spoken about human rights before so the outrage was expected. You don't get to pick and choose human rights.

 

I do agree that the energy should be the same for everyone, but I also understand why some names cause a bigger uproar than others.

Noa's entire song and Eurovision campaign is literally Israeli propaganda and textbook pinkwashing. And of course the Eurovision gays fell for it cause its a bawp.  

I'm not saying it wasn't, even I who loved Unicorn's performance could see through that smoke screen  but that anger should be directed towards the Israeli broadcaster and the government. I don't think Noa should be receiving death threats or for people to make fun of her health condition for that

[State of Grace.]

Just now, Love Again said:

I'm not saying it wasn't, even I who loved Unicorn's performance could see through that smoke screen  but that anger should be directed towards the Israeli broadcaster and the government. I don't think Noa should be receiving death threats or for people to make fun of her health condition for that

You missed my edit sis nn.

 

Noa willingly joined the IDF and hasn't denounced the crimes committed by Israel till this day. She deserves all the lashings and more. 

[JawBreaker]

4 minutes ago, JawBreaker said:

Righhhht lol you totally get me those losers are so annoying 

Why would I miss out on seeing the IDF headquarters over sum Twitter losers 

 

But seriously tho what a stupid comment that was The british, spanish and Dutch enslaved my ancestors so because of that I shouldn't visit Spain, Netherlands or England??? Like what 

[Solaria]

1 minute ago, State of Grace. said:

You missed my edit sis nn.

 

Noa willingly joined the IDF and hasn't denounced the crimes committed by Israel till this day. She deserves all the lashings and more. 

My main point being is is that it's unrealistic to expect every single Israeli artist to speak up about the war crimes that they're committing against Palestine. They SHOULD, but they're not going to because they'll be afraid of being blacklisted or worse, being arrested

 

I do agree that her willingly joining the IDF even after she got exempted is very weird though and she does deserve the lashings for that

[Bosque]

It’s easy performative outrage that makes people feel good without having to do literally anything. I’ve never seen one of the (mostly American) users who do it say “well I’m not attending my faves American concert because the USA has committed war crimes” 

[State of Grace.]

10 minutes ago, Love Again said:

My main point being is is that it's unrealistic to expect every single Israeli artist to speak up about the war crimes that they're committing against Palestine. They SHOULD, but they're not going to because they'll be afraid of being blacklisted or worse, being arrested

 

I do agree that her willingly joining the IDF even after she got exempted is very weird though and she does deserve the lashings for that

Okay so some Israeli artists disagree with their government but they are scared of speaking up to avoid getting blacklisted/fined/jailed. True. But silence is still an act compliance. 

 

And in Noa's case, it's not even silence. Her *volunteering* to join the IDF after being exempted because of her condition and being proud of it + representing Israel at the Eurovision with Unicorn says enough about her stance. 

Edited June 15, 2023 by State of Grace.

[Jjang]

25 minutes ago, Love Again said:

That said, I have more of an issue with backlash against Israeli singers and pop stars like Noa Kirel who got vilified on Twitter without taking in context that she does not know any better, she was born and raised there.

 

The argument that ''the internet exists, she should inform herself'' is true and all, but when you've been told a certain truth your entire life and have such a connection with your country (Israelis are very patriotic) then how do you expect to hold the people that have been living there their whole life accountable for that?

Noa Kirel flaunts her military service every chance she gets and she's pro-occupation. I'm so tired of explaining: the majority of Israelis are pro-apartheid and occupation. Both left and right governments in Israel are pro-occupation. Meretz, which used to be the only anti-occupation leftist party literally didn't even pass the threshold last elections. That's how much Israelis don't give a crap about Palestinians living under their mercy and apartheid laws. The "normal" there is to be pro-occupation. Just because it's normal within Israel itself to be a semi-fascist it shouldn't be normalized elsewhere - and that's why its extra important to put people like Noa Kirel in her place. Not to send a message to her, personally, but to the world. 

 

Noga Erez is also an Israeli singer and she criticized the occupation and even praised BDS.  you don't see her getting the same hate, don't you? Although she did get tons of hate and death threats from Israelis. 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Jjang

[Solaria]

6 minutes ago, Jjang said:

Noa Kirel flaunts her military service every chance she gets and she's pro-occupation. I'm so tired of explaining: the majority of Israelis are pro-apartheid and occupation. Both left and right governments in Israel are pro-occupation. Meretz, which used to be the only anti-occupation leftist party literally didn't even pass the threshold last elections. That's how much Israelis don't give a crap about Palestinians living under their mercy and apartheid laws. The "normal" there is to be pro-occupation. Just because it's normal within Israel itself to be a semi-fascist it shouldn't be normalized elsewhere - and that's why its extra important to put people like Noa Kirel in her place. Not to send a message to her, personally, but to the world. 

 

Noga Erez is also an Israeli singer and she criticized the occupation and even praised BDS.  you don't see her getting the same hate, don't you? Although she did get tons of hate and death threats from Israelis. 

This is a good point and I honestly hadn’t looked at it that way before.

 

What is your stance on streaming her music then? Do you see it as actively funding her views or would you be able to seperate art and artist?

[bliaz]

3 hours ago, vale9001 said:

Yes. Not every israelian person believe in the government so you just perform for people and art it's the most powerful way way to send messages and let people aware. 

 

All the iphones you're using are made in China, where dissidents are killed and tortured but you don't care. You are performative and only cares to show how you care about things when it's free and easy if doesn't have any impact in your actual life. Boycotting China would completely change the way we live.

 

If iphones would have been made in Israel  you would still use it. If twitter would change his headquater in Israel you will still use it. At that point the performative interest would be translate to something  else is easy, free and doesn't affect your actual life. 

 

 

Finally, a coherent comment. They only see what is convenient for them. Hypocrites.

[Jjang]

1 minute ago, Love Again said:

This is a good point and I honestly hadn’t looked at it that way before.

 

What is your stance on streaming her music then? Do you see it as actively funding her views or would you be able to seperate art and artist?

I think banning Isreal from Eurovision is what should happen if you're asking me. I don't think the responsibility should fall on the back of a couple of gays who just want to give a bop a stream, lol. It's not like Israeli singers' streams are this big revenue income for the state or something  mainly they try to push artists through big institutions like Eurovision - which they shouldn't have an equal opportunity to participate in because they literally have been committing the war crimes Russia was instantly banned for, for nearly a century now. 

[Swirl900]

Yes. It's blatant antisemitism. This is evident because there is not a peep from people about if you perform in China (genocide against Muslim  Uyghurs occuring), India (persecution against Rohingyas), Middle Eastern countries for their persecution of gays Christians and other minority groups, France for them bombing many African countries, US for being the world police, etc etc.

 

Basically most of the world. But for some reason the focus is on the only Jewish state...

 

Meanwhile, everyone here regularly uses products produced in the countries I mentioned above and thus by this logic are actively funding genocide or persecution. Sometimes just so we can save 5 bucks on a product. If we aren't guilty of crimes - neither is a pop star who performs in Israel. Saying otherwise just reveals a distaste or hatred of Jews through  extreme hypocrisy.

[Jjang]

4 hours ago, vale9001 said:

Yes. Not every israelian person believe in the government so you just perform for people and art it's the most powerful way way to send messages and let people aware. 

There's not a single party in the current government (left or right) that is anti-occupation. Israel is a democracy, no? Why, out of all Israelis who voted in a free election, not even 10% of their votes aligned with anti-occupation / anti-apartheid values? They sure rioted and burnt streets in Tel Aviv when they heard about the possible political reform, but for 75 years now, they couldn't mobilize their society even once to protest for Palestinian rights in large amounts, why do you think that?  

[byzantium]

2 hours ago, Contessa said:

Yes, for this reason I don't feel anger toward xtina performing there.

Lol.    
 

 

But not wrong.

Edited June 15, 2023 by byzantium