news Ukraine Gov’t posts offensive image of Hindu Goddess Kali, insults India

[loliza]

Is the invasion of ukraine an act of war which we should condemn? Yes

Is Russia the wrong guy in the conflinct? Yes

Does Ukraine have the right to defend itself? Yes

Are there many nazis in Ukraine? Yes

 

See you could admit both things. Ukraine does have a problem of racism and it still is on the right side in this conflict. 

[PopKills]

oh no

[WhoWho]

11 minutes ago, loliza said:

Is the invasion of ukraine an act of war which we should condemn? Yes

Is Russia the wrong guy in the conflinct? Yes

Does Ukraine have the right to defend itself? Yes

Are there many nazis in Ukraine? Yes

 

See you could admit both things. Ukraine does have a problem of racism and it still is on the right side in this conflict. 

Facts.

 

[WhoWho]

 

[Margaux]

isnt kali a work of fiction?

Edited May 1, 2023 by Margaux

[Communion]

2 hours ago, vale9001 said:

western leftists when someone makes a joke about Jesus: ahahahah freedom religions sucks

when someone makes a joke about other religions: racism!

This discourse and wordplay is played out. No one believes that you actually think this is a Western thing.

 

Everyone sees that you're trying to use that some Westerners may view themselves as privileged as a silencing tactic despite that people making the offensive post are Westerners themselves, and far right Westerners at that given the proliferation of neo-nazism throughout Eastern Europe. Russia and Ukraine are both Western countries. It is an instance of one Western country illegally invading the sovereign borders of another Western country. 

 

Jokes from atheists mocking organized religions they previously were part of is a form of punching up. That's why no one finds ex-Christians joking about Jesus to be offensive.

 

Someone who is not a former member of a non-Christian religion within the West mocking such religions is of course going to be questioned because it's no longer punching up. It's often in fact punching down. What does your average Ukrainian even know about Hinudism to criticize it thoughtfully? Ukraine is largely a single faith nation due to the historical treatment of religious minorities in Ukraine. 

 

You can't just try and use "Western" as some snarl term to defend the white supremacy of other lWesterners because you hope it will silence criticism. News flash - Eastern Europeans live in the West. 

 

There is no such thing as Westplaining to an Eastern European. They are the West! They experience every curvature of the Western experience, including the prolifteration of whiteness and white supremacy, no matter how much their Western European neighbors may even be prejudice towards them, The documented history of how fast each country sprung into action and eradicated their neighbors and friends who fell into historical divisions that deemed them non-white to hopefully save their own families shows us this. 

 

No one believes this idea that Eastern Europe missing out on the gravy train that was colonization somehow forever excludes them from being a mechanism in the tyranny that is the West. 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Communion

[midnightdawn]

4 hours ago, Communion said:

What does mocking a Hindu goddess have to do with India buying Russian oil?

Take a look at what their government is doing before worrying about a twitter post.

 

[Navy4Life]

3 hours ago, Kavish said:

we should not be making fun of millions of people's faith and religion

Well this is where we disagree so no point in continuing this conversation. I don’t think religion (any) should be protected and if people want to make fun of it they should be able to do so. 

[ZIVERT]

6 hours ago, ClashAndBurn said:

If anyone other than Putin is a villain here, it's Biden for deluding you into thinking you can win against a nuclear power whose leader is so reckless and selfish that he wouldn't hesitate to end all life as we know it as a final desperation play. Never have I claimed that Ukraine is wrong to pursue its existential fight for survival, even though you want to make me out to be a Putin supporter SO bad.  

 

But... maybe the Ukrainian government should stop posting racist caricatures and offending the neutral actors that would be needed to broker a final peace deal when the Spring Counteroffensive flops due to Biden's inability to replenish their stockpiles after Zelenskyy blew it all on Bakhmut.

You want Ukraine to be the villain in this war SO bad  [x2]

[ontherocks]

In all seriousness, I have had it with some of you here and will contact the mods about this. Let them deal with your pro Russia asses. 

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by ontherocks

[Communion]

52 minutes ago, midnightdawn said:

Take a look at what their government is doing before worrying about a twitter post.

 

Again, there are more Hindus who are not Indian nationals than there are overall Ukrainian nationals in the world. 

 

If the Ukrainian government wants to make rightful (!) criticisms of Modi's India, they should just criticize Modi and the government itself. 

 

Because not only are there Hindus within Indian who probably don't support Modi yet may find such mocking of religious figures crass, there are also Hindu populations in the tens of millions who are not citizens of India and thus do not have to answer for the actions of the Indian government. 

[Stimulus]

Those who are posting pro-Russian garbage in response to Russia's invasion of Ukraine need to review this:

 

Don’t Be a Tankie: How the Left Should Respond to Russia’s Invasion of Ukraine

 

Quote

Those who don’t stand in solidarity with the oppressed cannot call themselves leftists.

 

With Russia’s massive invasion of Ukraine from three directions, Russian President Vladimir Putin seems determined to overthrow Ukraine’s government and install a puppet regime. If he persists in this mad act of imperial aggression, it will be catastrophic not only for Ukraine but for Russia and all of Europe — and maybe even the entire world. With his forces encircling Kyiv but bogged down after five days of heavy combat, Putin placed Russia’s nuclear forces on alert.

 

If you identify as a leftist, wherever you live and whatever your nationality, your duty now is to stand by the people of Ukraine as they resist Russian state terrorism — and to stand by those thousands of Russian citizens courageously protesting the war in dozens of cities across their country. If you opposed the criminal U.S. attack on Iraq in 2003, then you must oppose this criminal attack on Ukraine. Not just consistency, but a minimal degree of decency and human solidarity requires it. Putin’s war is a blatant violation of international law against an independent country that posed no threat to Russia.

Having said this, the tweet should not have been posted since it had no chance of creating any positive outcome.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Stimulus

[Scars]

I'm sure this will resonate quite well with the hindu diaspora living in western countries which are actively supporting Ukraine.

 

For a government that puts a lot of effort to stay in the global consciousness and gather support from foreign audiences, not letting culturally insensitive language get in the way of their communication shouldn't be an after-thought. Despite people in the first page doing their best to silence the conversation, Ukraine and it's administration are not above criticism, other countries struggling with invasion are certainly not given that privilege here in ATRL or on western media discourse.

[Bang Up]

8 hours ago, ZIVERT said:

You want Ukraine to be the villain in this war SO bad

Of course they do. It's what the Republicans want so they fall in line.

[RyuHinode]

8 hours ago, Archetype said:

The Indian government's obsession with the USSR and Russia has always been very weird to me, 

 

They have history 

 

 

 

 

[Bosque]

No religion is above mockery or jokes so the general feigned outrage over that topic is tired. It’s especially funny cause Russia is guilty of a multitude of actual governmental suppressions of minority religions, yet I’ve never seen a thread about that topic made on ATRL made by the people who are “extremely concerned” about this deleted tweet  I sure wonder why that is 

[SmittenCake]

India doesn't choose sides. They've always been neutral. They simply seek out what's best for their people. Justifying racism because India buys Russian oil is unfair and ignorant. 

[Kavish]

3 hours ago, Navy4Life said:

Well this is where we disagree so no point in continuing this conversation. I don’t think religion (any) should be protected and if people want to make fun of it they should be able to do so. 

I am not religious myself, but I find it immature to be disrespectful to people who are religious, especially when it's unprovoked like in this case. There is a time to criticise religion and discuss why it shouldn't be "protected", but there is also a time to respect people's beliefs. They should have mocked the Indian government here, not Hindus. These are two separate entities. Looks like they recognised their faux-pas and deleted their post though, so all good.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Kavish

[SlowGinFizzzz]

Y'all probably would've cancelled Charlie Hebdo too, huh? 

 

Personally, I believe that freedom of speech includes being able to make fun of others' imaginary friends, whether they're called Kali, God, or Allah. 

Edited May 1, 2023 by SlowGinFizzzz

[scenekiller]

Religious mockery is not racism because race =/= religion, so most of the posts in here are just feigned outrage from privileged white gays as usual.

Edited May 1, 2023 by scenekiller

[Archetype]

19 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

India doesn't choose sides.  They've always been neutral.

It's not neutral when you go directly go to the aggressor in an ongoing war and start making economic deals to "benefit your people".  That is complete BS no matter how you spin it and is a clear indicator that they are willing to support Putin in his war efforts.  India is funding the destruction and killing that is ongoing in Ukraine.  I find that to be more offensive than a drawing, which yes, is offensive, but significantly less so than the funding a regime which aims to wipe the Ukrainian identity off the face of the planet.

 

19 minutes ago, SmittenCake said:

They simply seek out what's best for their people.

This statement is so stupid.  You could justify literally anything by saying "it's what's best for our people". 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Archetype

[Communion]

38 minutes ago, scenekiller said:

Religious mockery is not racism because race =/= religion

Not sure countries who eliminated entire ethno-religious minority groups from their borders within the last century are given this kind of benefit of the doubt. 

[Specter]

1 hour ago, RyuHinode said:

 

They have history 

 

 

 

 

Sis, why are you posting videos from a channel that seems to be called Veins of Hindutva?  (If Google translate is to be trusted on that watermark) 

 

But regardless. @Archetype there is actually a lot of history between India and the USSR, and though I still don't think it should absolve the Indian government of its clear lean towards Russia (not exactly neutrality), it makes sense given that a huge amount of Indian military equipment is overwhelmingly Russian made. 

 

Edit: yeah fam y'all openly posting Russian apologia used by Modi stans online

 

 

Russia did not even exist in 1971

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Phantom

[Archetype]

2 hours ago, Phantom said:

But regardless. @Archetype there is actually a lot of history between India and the USSR, and though I still don't think it should absolve the Indian government of its clear lean towards Russia (not exactly neutrality), it makes sense given that a huge amount of Indian military equipment is overwhelmingly Russian made. 

I'm fully aware of their history together.  It just seems like something that would have naturally been left in the 90's instead of carrying on to this day.  China and India fight over borders using military equipment as a threat.  India uses Russian equipment, Russia is China's ally, China is India's rival.  It just doesn't make sense anymore to keep this going, ESPECIALLY given how Russia is doing to Ukraine what China wants to do to India along the border. 

[ClashAndBurn]

7 hours ago, ontherocks said:

In all seriousness, I have had it with some of you here and will contact the mods about this. Let them deal with your pro Russia asses. 

 

Why are you okay with Ukrainians being openly racist? Why do they get a pass when nobody else in the world would or should?

 

You people scramble to defend them and downplay whenever their historical links to Nazism come up. Especially when their reverence for Nazi collaborators as national heroes (like Stepan Bandera, literally awarded Hero Of Ukraine in 2010 and celebrated with a national holiday) is mentioned. When their soldiers are tattooed with swastikas and **** and they’re celebrated and awarded with medals in America. It’s clearly not something that has been stamped out of their culture like you guys claim is the case.