news France and EU to support China and abandon US

[Dialamba]

30 minutes ago, Swirl900 said:

This. Remember when Macron said NATO is dead and then the invasion of Ukraine happened. Literal egg in the face.

 

Also this. Macron is particularly embarrassing because he LOVES to hang out with authoritarians. At first I thought it was because he was an idiot and thought he could actually change their trajectory. Now it's clear he just wants to emulate them!

Macron lives for the cameras. He’s the least serious we ever got. It’s insane 

[Bloodflowers.]

As long as US keep electing war hawks, EU should stay away from this mess. Marianne for President so she can open Department of Peace!

[thetea]

as they should. if what was going in the US right now happened in any other country, then they'd probably impose sanctions 

[magazine]

who said that? 

[TheRealGâteau]

4 hours ago, Zaram said:

I'm pretty sure they dragged the EU the entire planet in more wars in than out

so sad  https://watson.brown.edu/costsofwar/costs/human

 

 

[Bosque]

What is this fake ass thread title?  
 

also Politico is basically Yellow Press and should not be taken seriously. They are constantly publishing outright fake quotes 

[Miracle]

5 hours ago, wastedpotential said:

There are a few things wrong with the assumptions here

 

A) Is China in a position to actually provide the EU with any benefit beyond the goods that they manufacture? They don't have the military capability to step in and defend Europe from Russia or to break up fighting between the Europeans, and nor do they want to. They don't have the financial capability to bail out the Euro when an economic crunch occurs which has happened multiple times in the past 20 years. They don't have the food or fuel resources to spare to Europe in a time of a crisis (and they don't have the cultural and historical links which would drive them to do so, even if they did). 

 

B) Is France in a position to set the tone of EU foreign policy? France has a long history of desperately wanting to lead European politics and EU foreign policy, taking an action in one particular way, and then the rest of the EU ignoring them (ie the war in Iraq or Macron's failed negotiations with Putin last year). France is by far the least militarily and economically dependent country in the EU on the US, so they've often felt stifled by US influence and power in the region. Even if France chooses to take this step unilaterally, there's basically no way that any other country in the EU will follow them.

 

C) Is strategic autonomy from the US a viable path forward? No. The French have been trying to pull away from the US militarily since they left the NATO command structure in 1958 and it's literally never worked for them. The French alone do not have the financial or natural resources to completely re-build the complete supply chain of all military goods that are manufactured in the US (since, in order to keep the French in line with their policy goals, weapons sales are usually conditional), and any of the European partner nations that might have the resources to help increase strategic autonomy (the UK and Germany, with some degree of assistance from Spain, Italy, or Poland) have all doubled down on buying US planes and weapons and the like. 

 

France has the mindset of an Imperial Power, with an Empire's worth of manpower and money and resources and that's... not reality anymore. If France wants to go its own way and become the 'middle power' between the US and China then there's nothing stopping them, but they can't expect the rest of the EU to try and follow. 

China has more than enough military power to scare Russia from not attacking Europe. But even without China, France has nuclear warheads, therefore an EU/Europe only coalition would be enough. Europe can be independent, but the best thing possible is that USA and Russia are left alone while the EU and China and the rest of South Asia, South America join a coalition

 

Lets leave the two most violent, basically the only ones who start war nowadays along Israel and ISIS, alone.

 

[CBC]

10 hours ago, Tropez said:

He’s the French president, and believes that France is the natural leader of the EU. And seeks to create a third superpower with the EU led by the French. 

He should worry about the guillotine first

Also:

 

[Dula Peep]

And How many times have we saved France 

[Komet]

So you went from "Europe must resist pressure to become ‘America’s followers,’ says Macron" to "France and EU to support China and abandon US" ??  Maybe stick to checking BB charts and dragging pop girls

[Bang Up]

Sound like he wants to play both sides, but neither China nor the US is going to be okay with that. You're either okay with China invading Taiwan or you're not. There's really no middle ground here. Is he really under the impression France wouldn't be affected by China invading Taiwan? That is something every western country would be affected by on a technological standpoint at the very least.

 

I get wanting to distance yourself from the US considering Trump proved to the world how fragile our system really is, but it's silly to say stuff like this.

[FightForTanas]

17 hours ago, Swirl900 said:

This. Remember when Macron said NATO is dead and then the invasion of Ukraine happened. Literal egg in the face.

 

Also this. Macron is particularly embarrassing because he LOVES to hang out with authoritarians. At first I thought it was because he was an idiot and thought he could actually change their trajectory. Now it's clear he just wants to emulate them!

Right? He's becoming a mini Trump. Wtf??  

[Kitty Kat]

Macron never had an interview with Politico lmfao, he gave this interview to the French newspaper Les Échos, and Politico misrepresented what was stated.

[John Slayne]

time for the united states of europe  neither the usa nor china could compete 

Edited April 11, 2023 by John Slayne

[Hurem]

Not y’all thinking Macron is the leader of “Europe”

[Communion]

On 4/10/2023 at 3:05 AM, wastedpotential said:

They don't have the military capability to step in and defend Europe from Russia or to break up fighting between the Europeans, and nor do they want to. They don't have the financial capability to bail out the Euro when an economic crunch occurs which has happened multiple times in the past 20 years. They don't have the food or fuel resources to spare to Europe in a time of a crisis

Doesn't this highlight the absurdity of the US and those who defend it? Why does France opening itself up to opportunities with China mean the US would punish it if, for example, Russia attacked or recession hit?

 

However one feels about China, it bares repeating to know we all accept some basic facts:
China is objectively in no way a military threat to America.
And no, I don't mean that like "cause America would easily beat them". I mean it literally -
China has posed no threat nor given any indication of threatening America militarily. 

 

"But Taiw--"

China is not going to invade a place it already considers legally part of itself. Which legally Taiwan is.

 

That's the reality. People can feel how they want, but the *current status quo* where Taiwan *refuses to declare actual independence* makes China fully consider Taiwan what it legally is - a province of China.

 

There's little-to-no appetite even within Taiwan to change that. This is seen in recent elections where the pro-legal independence party lost to the "de-facto independence cause we're REAL China" party.

 

So it's not odd that leaders, like Macron, feel the need to pivot when US military leaders say things like "the US should preemptively send weapons to Taiwan" or "we have to attack China before they attack us". World leaders value stability, so of course America being a chaos agent causes fear.

 

The only defense being given for America's threats to disrupt the global status quo is "well can France beat America if it doesn't side with America's insanity? I think not!"  

 

Again, China is not a military empire. It is not threatening American lives. America is trying to weaponize military strength (via meddling in Taiwan) to block China's economic prosperity and punish China for thinking decades of being the world's factory means it deserves to now keep some of what it produces 

 

Most sane leaders want to avoid a globally destabilizing conflict that would only be spurred on by America attacking a country for becoming rich enough to no longer accept freights of its trash. 

 

Should the world suffer because America's ego rejects the idea by the Chinese government that the economy of China should work first for Chinese people, not Americans with an Amazon Prime subscription? 

Edited April 12, 2023 by Communion

[Aethereal]

On 4/10/2023 at 4:37 AM, Tropez said:

 

 France and EU to support China and abandon US

 

You wish.