discussion Gay Palestinian Murdered

[Communion]

37 minutes ago, DonSiblon said:

So what ARE we gonna do? 

"Zimbabwe isn't progressive on LGBT rights so it should have stayed a plantation colony as Rhodesia."

[Specter]

36 minutes ago, DonSiblon said:

For Israel to shut its doors to... Palestenians? 

 

I'm in tears. Where do I start with this? 

 

 I just wish some of y'all came to the table with some awareness. The "doors of Israel" have been closed to Palestenians even in a literal sense for... Decades  and in so many ways - be it work permits, validity of inter-racial/religious relationships, human rights etc.

 

Some of y'all make it so clear that its not worth engaging with y'all. I just hope a Palestenian user - be it a member of the LGBTQ community it not - never reads "so what? Do we be quiet as the doors of Israel shut to Palestenians?" ghgjffj I PROMISE y'all... 

[Protocol]

The problem is not Palestine itself. This sort of thing happens in plenty of countries in the region. Because of an ideology/religion they follow that says gay men should be killed.

 

The problem is Islam. And no gay man with dignity and self-respect should ever fear saying that.

[Bosque]

He managed to escaped and was literally dragged back…. Just evil. The Arab countries are incredibly backwards with regards to gay acceptance 

[A.R.L]

Look, there is no doubt Israel is the only best place for the gays in the Middle East, but me as a gay person myself, I won't fully defend that because Israelians hands are also stained with blood. I feel sorry for what happened to the Jews throughout history in so many places in the world and the hatred they had to go through.

 

I 'm not going to talk about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, because I still need to learn more about it - yes it is also clear that the Jews have strong ties to those lands, and therefore they have the right to live there as well. But now I want to talk about the human rights in Israel, you can say what you want but I don't believe in the Israeli democracy that much, for sure they will never put human rights first over their political interests. 

 

Speaking of asylum, there's a youtuber I know that is known for her opposition to the dictatorial regime in her country, so when she decided to flee to Israel, she claimed the Israelian authorities did not take her application seriously because of the good relationship they have with the dictator ruler in her country. However, when it comes to the Jewish refugees who flee to Israel from that same country, it is totally another story. I donno but there is something hypocritical about the Israeli government. The woman's asylum was finally approved in China, imagine??

 

Finally, I would like to say that the recent killing of journalist Shireen Abu Akleh and the poor children at the hands of Israelis is just like what happened to Ahmed with these Muslims. 

 

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by A.R.L

[kawk]

wait they still do that in Palestine? suddenly I'm pro-annexation 

[Delirious]

6 hours ago, Protocol said:

The problem is not Palestine itself. This sort of thing happens in plenty of countries in the region. Because of an ideology/religion they follow that says gay men should be killed.

 

The problem is Islam. And no gay man with dignity and self-respect should ever fear saying that.

well i mean it literally says in the quran that sex between 2 men is haram

[FOCK]

There are zero reputable sources reporting this and the ones that are, are not reporting any facts about the matter or details that would indicate that this was due to his sexuality or that it was religiously motivated. 

 

The reason for the crime is still unknown and the suspect was arrested by the PALESTINIAN authorities, who described it was one of the worst crimes they've seen and out of the ordinary. He was stabbed several times before being beheaded. 

 

And he had not intended to stay in Coloniser Israel... (where gay marriage remains illegal btw, but keep drinking that pink wash), he was in Coloniser Israel in preparation to move to Canada. 

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by FOCK

[ZIVERT]

1 hour ago, FOCK said:

There are zero reputable sources reporting this and the ones that are, are not reporting any facts about the matter or details that would indicate that this was due to his sexuality or that it was religiously motivated. 

 

The reason for the crime is still unknown and the suspect was arrested by the PALESTINIAN authorities, who described it was one of the worst crimes they've seen and out of the ordinary. He was stabbed several times before being beheaded. 

 

And he had not intended to stay in Coloniser Israel... (where gay marriage remains illegal btw, but keep drinking that pink wash), he was in Coloniser Israel in preparation to move to Canada. 

 

So a gay Palestinian that ran away from his home because of his sexuality, was granted asylum in Israel two years ago, eventually wanted to seek refugee status in Canada to get further away from his family, and was then kidnapped back to Hebron where he was beheaded. All of this, but according to your logic, we can't determine conclude that his his being gay was the reasoning behind his gruesome murder... Alright. 

 

 

Here is an article from the Washington Post:

 

Quote

The severed head and decapitated torso of a 25-year-old Palestinian were discovered on the side of a road in the occupied West Bank, police said Friday, confirming gruesome details of a killing that shocked Palestinian society.

But accounts that the victim, Ahmad Abu Murkhiyeh, was a gay man who feared persecution for his sexuality and had sought asylum in Israel two years ago turned the terrible crime into a socially and politically explosive case.

It was unclear how Abu Murkhiyeh wound up in Hebron, the conservative West Bank city that he had reportedly fled. Palestinian police officials told The Associated Press on Friday that Abu Murkhiyeh’s head and torso were found near his family’s house.

Palestinian social media was gripped by the grisly killing, but silent on the question of Abu Murkhiyeh’s sexuality. Homosexuality remains deeply taboo in the Palestinian territories, where traditional norms play a prominent role in social and political life.

Still there was plenty of outrage across the West Bank. Graphic footage taken by Palestinian youths who happened upon Abu Murkhiyeh’s dismembered body on a hillside rippled through WhatsApp groups, provoking shock and horror, before being taken down...

The family claimed that Abu Murkhiyeh lived and worked between Hebron and neighboring Jordan, where his late father was from.

As news of Abu Murkhiyeh’s death spread, a starkly different version of events emerged from Israel. LGBTQ organizations and emergency shelters helping gay asylum seekers said they knew he was gay and desperate to escape the Palestinian territories, where he was a target.

Rita Petrenko, founder of Al Bait Al Mokhtalef, an Israeli gay rights organization catering to the Arab community, said Abu Murkhiyeh’s fear was distinct when they met in 2020.

“He told me people not only in his family but in the village wanted to kill him,” she said, adding that he fled to Israel as word of his sexual orientation spread through Hebron two years ago. “He was scared of his brothers, his uncles, his cousins.”

Abu Murkhiyeh bounced around from shelter to shelter and scraped by on occasional restaurant jobs in Tel Aviv, Petrenko said, while she helped him apply for resettlement to Canada.

He had no prospects in Israel. On temporary status, he was barred from working until last July, when Israel started granting work permits to Palestinians who have sought refuge due to violence and persecution for their sexual orientation, Petrenko said...

Just hours before Abu Murkhiyeh was killed on Wednesday, he spoke to volunteers at his shelter in Tel Aviv for a regular check-in, Petrenko said. Nothing was amiss. The next day, the story of his beheading dominated the media.

Gay Palestinians tend to be careful for fear of drawing unwanted attention from their socially conservative community and backlash from authorities. Palestinian Authority police in 2019 barred gay and transgender rights group from holding events in the West Bank and threatened to arrest participants.

Gay people within Israel’s Arab minority have also faced violence and ostracism in their communities.

West Bank Palestinians like Abu Murkhiyeh have long have crossed into Israel to live openly. There are nearly 100 such Palestinians living under asylum, said Mara’ana-Menuhin, the lawmaker, but the number is likely far higher.

“It’s not that these people even come out of the closet. They’re found and they’re hunted,” said Hila Peer from Aguda, an Israeli LGBTQ rights organization. “Ahmad’s case is just another example of how bad the situation is and how seriously dangerous it is.”

 

Full article here.

 

There is outrage within both communities, but for starkly different reasons. And no, this isn't an attack on the concept of a future Palestinian state, this is just the cold, hard truth. The idea that some of you will put your fingers in your ears and scream "pinkwashing!!!!11!!!!" just because Israel is involved is actually ludicrous... I know damn well that this thread would have many more replies and MUCH more vitriol/Islamophobia if this thread was about a gay Arab murdered in ANY other country.

Edited October 9, 2022 by ZIVERT

[Bosque]

A Palestinian family kidnapped their own son/brother/etc. from a foreign country, beheaded him and left his head on a public road solely because he was gay. But the real problem is that there is no gay marriage in Israel  

[Communion]

Imagine trying to brag about Israel being some safe haven while posting an article where you deliberately try to obscure that the man in question had to choose between homophobia at home or racism a few miles away:

 

Quote

He had no prospects in Israel. On temporary status, he was barred from working.

 

[ZIVERT]

1 hour ago, Dephira said:

A Palestinian family kidnapped their own son/brother/etc. from a foreign country, beheaded him and left his head on a public road solely because he was gay. But the real problem is that there is no gay marriage in Israel  

There are plenty of problems to rightfully attack Israel for, but these people are just being purposely obtuse  

[Mean Trees]

5 hours ago, FOCK said:

There are zero reputable sources reporting this and the ones that are, are not reporting any facts about the matter or details that would indicate that this was due to his sexuality or that it was religiously motivated. 

 

The reason for the crime is still unknown and the suspect was arrested by the PALESTINIAN authorities, who described it was one of the worst crimes they've seen and out of the ordinary. He was stabbed several times before being beheaded. 

 

And he had not intended to stay in Coloniser Israel... (where gay marriage remains illegal btw, but keep drinking that pink wash), he was in Coloniser Israel in preparation to move to Canada. 

 

Oop.

 

There's reputable sources talking about the orthodox man who stabbed all those people at the Jerusalem Pride though.

 

Man who attacked Jerusalem gay pride last year accused of fresh plot | Israel | The Guardian

 

Anyway, this is the first case I've ever heard of Palestinians killing a lgbt person so that's very sad. Still does not justify Israeli blockades and occupation of a whole population though.

Edited October 9, 2022 by Mean Trees

[Cloudy]

Failing to see what correlation does the Palestina cause have to do with whatever homophobia exists in it's community/religion. That's a totally different issue that should be brought attention to but not detract from the fair and right cause of the Palestine as a rightful state actively attacked by the zionist state of Israel.

[FOCK]

5 hours ago, Dephira said:

A Palestinian family kidnapped their own son/brother/etc. from a foreign country, beheaded him and left his head on a public road solely because he was gay. But the real problem is that there is no gay marriage in Israel  

1. It’s unclear how he got there, so “kidnapped” is unproven.

2. There’s no indication it was a family member other than his body being found left near their home.

3. There are no details on the suspect or the motivation - it’s actually more likely it was due to “betrayal”/affiliation with Coloniser Israel, but that’s speculation. 

4. The community is outraged and it’s being described as an unspeakable crime by Palestinian authorities & locals.

 

When Coloniser Israel commits a crime,  ya’ll are quick with the “let’s wait for the facts”, yet in this scenario you’re happy to jump to conclusions & make sweeping generalisations. Far right coloniser Israel is also not some type of “gay haven” bar a few select locations. If their public were to have a vote on a gay issue, its unlikely it would pass in favour & there have also been countless attacks on the gay community there, so cut the bs.

[Gov Hooka]

Yall will post anything (now it’s pinkwashing bull crap) to deflect from the literal genocide the terrorist state of Israel and its complicit population is committing.  

[Mean Trees]

41 minutes ago, FOCK said:

1. It’s unclear how he got there, so “kidnapped” is unproven.

2. There’s no indication it was a family member other than his body being found left near their home.

3. There are no details on the suspect or the motivation - it’s actually more likely it was due to “betrayal”/affiliation with Coloniser Israel, but that’s speculation. 

4. The community is outraged and it’s being described as an unspeakable crime by Palestinian authorities & locals.

 

When Coloniser Israel commits a crime,  ya’ll are quick with the “let’s wait for the facts”, yet in this scenario you’re happy to jump to conclusions & make sweeping generalisations. Far right coloniser Israel is also not some type of “gay haven” bar a few select locations. If their public were to have a vote on a gay issue, its unlikely it would pass in favour & there have also been countless attacks on the gay community there, so cut the bs.

 

@Gov Hooka It's so common on here now. If a politician or society does not fit in the worldview of Western elites then they're dismissed and denied. It's sad.

[State of Grace.]

1 hour ago, FOCK said:

1. It’s unclear how he got there, so “kidnapped” is unproven.

2. There’s no indication it was a family member other than his body being found left near their home.

3. There are no details on the suspect or the motivation - it’s actually more likely it was due to “betrayal”/affiliation with Coloniser Israel, but that’s speculation. 

4. The community is outraged and it’s being described as an unspeakable crime by Palestinian authorities & locals.

 

When Coloniser Israel commits a crime,  ya’ll are quick with the “let’s wait for the facts”, yet in this scenario you’re happy to jump to conclusions & make sweeping generalisations. Far right coloniser Israel is also not some type of “gay haven” bar a few select locations. If their public were to have a vote on a gay issue, its unlikely it would pass in favour & there have also been countless attacks on the gay community there, so cut the bs.