SmittenCake Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 Xi and his thugs need to go to jail. The CCP needs to be held accountable.
Sesame Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 How long have people been saying it for, only for others to deny its existence? Waiting for the typical users to run in here and deflect to something something US imperialism yada yada. China needs to be held accountable.
SmittenCake Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 Watch all the communists deny the genocide in China and pretend to care about Muslims in Palestine
HausOfGerard Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 Yeah, there's a particular communist on this website who will deflect back to the US for sure. Xi needs to be held accountable.
Oxy Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, SmittenCake said: Watch all the communists deny the genocide in China and pretend to care about Muslims in Palestine Those who care about Palestine doesn’t mean they don’t care about this too or in Myanmar or India. This shouldn’t just be labeled just as human right violation, also it should be mentioned that Muslims are being targeted in multiple countries. Basically a crime against a religion. Edited September 1, 2022 by Oxy
Gov Hooka Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 It’s a joke to see them bend over backwards on these reports about what’s finished back in 2017 and then stay completely silent on Western countries. Y’all can say whataboutism all you want but if the US and West have constructed an entire global legal paradigm that only polices the Global South and let’s themselves off the hook then they don’t have any credence to fuss about these reports.
AlanRickman1946 Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 7 minutes ago, Gov Hooka said: It’s a joke to see them bend over backwards on these reports about what’s finished back in 2017 and then stay completely silent on Western countries. Y’all can say whataboutism all you want but if the US and West have constructed an entire global legal paradigm that only polices the Global South and let’s themselves off the hook then they don’t have any credence to fuss about these reports. But does that matter to the uyghurs?
Gov Hooka Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 12 minutes ago, AlanRickman1946 said: But does that matter to the uyghurs? The so called re-education centers are no more. AP published that article that said many of the formerly interned people have returned who according to the CPC were sent there for deradicalization efforts. I don’t know why this story is brought up repeatedly when several envoys from Muslim countries have gone to the region and don’t have the same “concern” that the US has for Muslim lives (insert laugh here). As for the Adrian Zenz lies about organ harvesting and the other nonsensical claims yall can believe what you want. I’m still waiting for the UN report on forced labor in the US prison system which targets black and brown ppl who’ve committed petty crimes.
Nano Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 9 minutes ago, Gov Hooka said: when several envoys from Muslim countries have gone to the region and don’t have the same “concern” that the US has for Muslim lives (insert laugh here) Are you being sarcastic, or do you actually think Muslim leaders care about what happens to Muslims in other countries?
Gov Hooka Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 1 hour ago, Nano said: Are you being sarcastic, or do you actually think Muslim leaders care about what happens to Muslims in other countries? No I don’t which is why I find the selective outrage on this eyeroll-inducing when there is an obvious genocide being committed in Yemen and Palestine that goes deliberately unnoticed by the same countries and UN bodies feigning concern over Xinjiang
Communion Posted September 1, 2022 Posted September 1, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, AlanRickman1946 said: But does that matter to the uyghurs? The report is ironically being criticized as "weak" and "soft China apologia" by hardline interventionists because it explicitly doesn't mention genocide and disclaims that testimonies, many reported on over the last 5 years, can't be independently verified by the UN and thus recommendations veer closer to diplomacy than intervention. The conversation has essentially stagnated over 5 years of different geopolitical campaigns. Of course China has repression and illiberal policies... but they've never claimed to be a liberal society. Many Chinese would argue that the way their government functions and succeeds is finding a balance of enough economic prosperity to justify why not all liberties are necessary to have. Not every society views liberalism as highly functioning. For example, interventionists have struggled in framing family planning as evidence to the claim of genocide - the report similarly avoids doing so - because the Chinese government openly says it uses family planning laws and all citizens must comply. By definition, family planning laws are illiberal, sure, but that leads to what level of liberalism Chinese people want. Some Han Chinese have wanted relaxed family planning laws for ethnic minorities restricted to be equal. That is a conversation Chinese society must reconcile with. Western campaigns not utilizing how other ethnicities within China feel about Xinjiang seem to miss that it's possible for many Chinese to not want ill-intentioned intervention from the West while feeling ethnocentrism is an issue in China like many ethnic-majority states. Comparisons can likely be made to the ethnocentrism prejudice and criminalization Uyghurs may face as largely no different to what Roma experience in Europe (as touchy of a subject that is ironically on ATRL). But such comparisons don't support interventionism, which is objectively part of the West's desired response, so they seemingly don't get made. People may have the knee-jerk reaction that discussing other countries is "whataboutism", but if the conversation is inherently about global reactions to repression, then the realities of other countries do matter lol. Terrorism in Xinjiang reached a boiling point in the early 2010s (US media called Urumqi the Chinese hub of Wahhabism), though one can argue the Chinese government fails to appreciate the reduction in extremism achieved by not being agile enough to take their foot off the peddle. Or at least play geopolitics how others do. The AP story from 2021 indicated counter-terrorism efforts slowed due to COVID and the "Xinjiang Police Files" indicated that those who had gone through and were still placed in de-radicalization programs against their will was smaller than imagined. It's reasonable to criticize that China's "wolf warrior" diplomacy causes these facts to get lost and they harm their own image. It goes back to what action people claim to want. Someone who thinks Xinjiang has never been Xinjiang or part of China, and there is a moral imperative to intervene and balkanize China to free it, is likely to be disappointed in the UN's report, as the people above seem to be. Ethnocentrism clearly seems like an issue within China, but as an onlooker from a country directly asked to intervene, the UN's findings don't seem to support interventionism over diplomacy. Edited September 1, 2022 by Communion
Katy V.! Posted September 3, 2022 Posted September 3, 2022 It's truly a wonder to see tankies writing paragraphs defending crimes against humanity while pretending they care about people.
SmittenCake Posted September 4, 2022 Posted September 4, 2022 22 hours ago, Katy V.! said: It's truly a wonder to see tankies writing paragraphs defending crimes against humanity while pretending they care about people. +1
AlanRickman1946 Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 Noam Chomsky on Xin Jiang: Ask him about China’s repression of the Uighurs, as Katie Halper and I do here, and he asks, “Is it as bad as Gaza? It's very hard to argue that.” Just because it is not as bad does not mean it isn't bad.
Genius1111 Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 5 hours ago, AlanRickman1946 said: Noam Chomsky on Xin Jiang: Ask him about China’s repression of the Uighurs, as Katie Halper and I do here, and he asks, “Is it as bad as Gaza? It's very hard to argue that.” Just because it is not as bad does not mean it isn't bad. The thing is that, at least for reporting on Gaza, correspondents from different networks around the globe are allowed to be based in Israel and they can go down to report on the atrocities first hand. Even though both the Israeli government and Palestinian authorities would rather investigative journalists not dig their dirt up, at least foreign journalists can be based there. This is in contrast to Xinjiang and Tibet, where foreign journalists can only be there if they are on a special organized press tour. [I was visiting a friend in Tel Aviv just before the pandemic started and he shared that he was acquainted with a correspondent who's based in Tel Aviv. We are both non-Jewish people who are from the eastern side of Asia.]
AlanRickman1946 Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 21 minutes ago, Genius1111 said: The thing is that, at least for reporting on Gaza, correspondents from different networks around the globe are allowed to be based in Israel and they can go down to report on the atrocities first hand. Even though both the Israeli government and Palestinian authorities would rather investigative journalists not dig their dirt up, at least foreign journalists can be based there. This is in contrast to Xinjiang and Tibet, where foreign journalists can only be there if they are on a special organized press tour. [I was visiting a friend in Tel Aviv just before the pandemic started and he shared that he was acquainted with a correspondent who's based in Tel Aviv. We are both non-Jewish people who are from the eastern side of Asia.] that's a very good point I had not thought of that before.
Communion Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Genius1111 said: The thing is that, at least for reporting on Gaza, correspondents from different networks around the globe are allowed to be based in Israel and they can go down to report on the atrocities first hand. ?? Talking about the treatment of journalists only further proves Chomsky's point, but I can only people will soon be calling Noam Chomsky of all people a "tankie" because they would rather not actually engage with the valid criticisms he's put forward. It's even highlighted in the topic of this thread in how the UN reports dodges and largely rebukes many of the greater claims of evil that have been made. Edited September 10, 2022 by Communion
ClashAndBurn Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 8 hours ago, Genius1111 said: The thing is that, at least for reporting on Gaza, correspondents from different networks around the globe are allowed to be based in Israel and they can go down to report on the atrocities first hand. Even though both the Israeli government and Palestinian authorities would rather investigative journalists not dig their dirt up, at least foreign journalists can be based there. This is in contrast to Xinjiang and Tibet, where foreign journalists can only be there if they are on a special organized press tour. [I was visiting a friend in Tel Aviv just before the pandemic started and he shared that he was acquainted with a correspondent who's based in Tel Aviv. We are both non-Jewish people who are from the eastern side of Asia.] The thing is, Israel does the things it does to Palestinians with full throated support from Western governments, and journalists can get sniped WHILE WEARING PRESS VESTS and Israel will face zero condemnation from anyone who is actually in power. In America, the water situation that black people have been facing in Mississippi (with overflowing OPEN SEWERS) has been completely overshadowed by the death of a foreign queen and will never get talked about again. Even though it’s an absolutely gross human rights violation that the United States should honestly be sanctioned for. Still, zero condemnation from the world at large. China’s treatment of Uighur Muslims is abhorrent and should be called out. But it’s obvious now more than ever that the UN exists to advance US policy goals and serves no real purpose other than that.
ZIVERT Posted September 10, 2022 Posted September 10, 2022 y'all love to use the UN when the 22 nations in the Arab League abuse their numbers to condemn Israel but the moment the UN turns around and condemns China for their own human rights abuses, its suddenly "the UN exists to advance US policy goals and serves no real purpose other than that."
ClashAndBurn Posted September 11, 2022 Posted September 11, 2022 29 minutes ago, ZIVERT said: y'all love to use the UN when the 22 nations in the Arab League abuse their numbers to condemn Israel but the moment the UN turns around and condemns China for their own human rights abuses, its suddenly "the UN exists to advance US policy goals and serves no real purpose other than that." What has “the UN condemning Israel” (when 99% of the time the US vetoes those resolutions anyway) done for the Palestinian people?
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