discussion Hunter Schafer (Euphoria) gets lashed for liking IG post dragging nonbinary people

[Headlock]

1 hour ago, ChapelHooker said:

via Kel Lauren, saying it better than I could. **** Hunter. **** Jordan.  

Quote

*ALL* work is exploitative and abusive by design

Okay I agree with the spirit of their post, but this sentence took me out 

[Uncatena]

11 minutes ago, meangreen11 said:

Exactly this. It’s the lowest cost of entry into the Queer umbrella these days so you end up with a mix of people who do truly identify as NB mixed in with people joining as a fad and to be able to feel more unique. Some argue “the more the merrier” while others see it as performative for attention. It’s similar to the early 00’s when it was as “cool” for girls to say they were bi for a little while for attention and then quietly drop it and move back to their otherwise boring cishet lives.
 

It creates an unfortunate sense of dismissiveness for people who actually identify as such. We still see people deny that bisexuality is a real thing as a result of that old fad. We see the same dismissiveness now towards NB. 
 

It’s extremely easy for a guy to throw on a skirt and say “look at me, I’m so quirky!” ala Harry Styles, and then expect the same treatment and outpouring of support as someone who is ftm or mtf and can’t fly under the radar when they want. And honestly, we all know damn well a large portion of folks currently using the NB label will forget about it in a year or two (or less in the case of Demi) when it isn’t as trendy. Their performances do nothing more than cause true experiences to be dismissed as a result. The new trend of using both gendered AND non gendered pronouns doesn’t do anything to help either - it makes it seem like you can “clock out” from being NB when you want. Whether or not cishet people should have an opinion doesn’t matter - people have to accept that if the overall cishet community is skeptical of your existence, they will not respect it. 

Y’all yell this all day but there is literally zero evidence for any significant amount of people “pretending” (lmao) to be trans. this is ludicrous. This is such a chronically online take, Twitter isn’t reality. 
 

Also the bolded part… you’re ******* joking right? Like… what? A) Harry Styles isn’t non-binary/trans and has never claimed to be and wearing “feminine clothing” doesn’t make him, and thinking that is extremely weird and B) on WHAT planet are trans people getting an “outpour of support”?

Edited August 23, 2022 by ChapelHooker

[Uncatena]

3 minutes ago, Headlock said:

Okay I agree with the spirit of their post, but this sentence took me out 

well it’s the absolute truth x

[NausAllien]

 

I agree with 99% of that post.

 

A lot of cis people are treating nonbinary like trend and are delegitimizing the seriousness of gender dysphoria and how it requires people to transition to live a happy life. Some people even go as far as to claim a different gender identity and change their pronouns every month and that's really hurting the trans community.

 

Now, I still think Republicans wouldn't be super accepting of trans people and they'd try to undermine the seriousness of their condition even if the nonbinary trend didn't exist, but this is just making matters worse. Cisgender white women need to STOP this disgusting trend of treating gender like an accessory you can change whenever you want. 

[Beyonnaise]

9 minutes ago, Headlock said:

Okay I agree with the spirit of their post, but this sentence took me out 

I laughed too but this part of that post genuinely annoyed me   Yes you can argue we're all oppressed under capitalism, eat the rich etc. but come on. That is such a copout. Sex workers are unbelievably more exploited and are far more in danger of violence and death than the large majority of us going to our office or retail jobs. Saying otherwise is both laughably absurd and misogynistic. Yes I support sex workers' bodily autonomy and oppose economic systems that force them into those jobs as a last resort, but that doesn't mean we have to pretend it's the same level of abuse that a TJ Maxx cashier faces.

Edited August 23, 2022 by Beyonnaise

[Uncatena]

6 minutes ago, NausAllien said:

A lot of cis people are treating nonbinary like trend and are delegitimizing the seriousness of gender dysphoria and how it requires people to transition to live a happy life. Some people even go as far as to claim a different gender identity and change their pronouns every month and that's really hurting the trans community. 

Evidence? 

[Uncatena]

6 minutes ago, Beyonnaise said:

I laughed too but this part of that post genuinely annoyed me   Yes you can argue we're all oppressed under capitalism, eat the rich etc. but come on. That is such a copout. Sex workers are unbelievably more exploited and are far more in danger of violence and death than the large majority of us going to our office or retail jobs. Saying otherwise is both laughably absurd and misogynistic. Yes I support sex workers' bodily autonomy and oppose economic systems that force them into those jobs as a last resort, but that doesn't mean we have to pretend it's the same level of abuse that a TJ Maxx cashier faces.

It’s not a competition and the argument stands. No one said this isn’t true. 

[Bloodflowers.]

The post was a mess, but there's deep discussion to be had about the different life experiences of trans people and non-binary people instead of grouping both together when two are not nearly the same thing

[mandynasty]

Blaming oppressive policies on other queer people "queering wrong" is always stupid, 100% of the time. In any and every context. It will never be correct or make any sense.

 

You can be on your best behaviour, police yourself and your community to the last detail just to avoid ever scaring or confusing conservatives, and it will not matter. They will always find a new excuse to erase you from public life, they will never stop. You can lead the most harmless existence imaginable and you will still be attacked. As long as you are a deviation from 'the norm' in any way, you remain a target and a scapegoat.

 

By insisting other queer people rein themselves in, you're throwing them under the bus and getting absolutely nothing in return. It's abominably stupid.

[Headlock]

6 minutes ago, Beyonnaise said:

I laughed too but this part of that post genuinely annoyed me   Yes you can argue we're all oppressed under capitalism, eat the rich etc. but come on. That is such a copout. Sex workers are unbelievably more exploited and are far more in danger of violence and death than the large majority of us going to our office or retail jobs. Saying otherwise is both laughably absurd and misogynistic. Yes I support sex workers' bodily autonomy and oppose economic systems that force them into those jobs as a last resort, but that doesn't mean we have to pretend it's the same level of abuse that a TJ Maxx cashier faces.

But SWERFs, or something 

You can legitimize the validity of sex work as a profession while also recognizing that currently, given current stigmatization and shame, it is an incredibly dangerous job to have for most that enter it. Never mind the fact that in the context of trans individuals sex work is notoriously exploitative historically.

 

14 minutes ago, ChapelHooker said:

well it’s the absolute truth x

“Work” as defined as the trading of labor for goods, services, or money, is not inherently anything, let alone exploitative or abusive 

Giving your kid an allowance to wash the dishes is not abusive 

[Uncatena]

2 minutes ago, mandynasty said:

Blaming oppressive policies on other queer people "queering wrong" is always stupid, 100% of the time. In any and every context. It will never be correct or make any sense.

 

You can be on your best behaviour, police yourself and your community to the last detail just to avoid ever scaring or confusing conservatives, and it will not matter. They will always find a new excuse to erase you from public life, they will never stop. You can lead the most harmless existence imaginable and you will still be attacked. As long as you are a deviation from 'the norm' in any way, you remain a target and a scapegoat.

 

By insisting other queer people rein themselves in, you're throwing them under the bus and getting absolutely nothing in return. It's abominably stupid.

absolutely spilled, well said. not a single lie. 

[A Bomb]

People who think in that way are legitimately braindead. Bigots don't categorize their hate under homophobia or transphobia. It's all abnormal to them. 

 

I also just have to say there are a lot of transwomen of color that seek out surgeries to feminize their bodies to not get killed in a way that Hunter has clearly not had to. This is just some white people ****. Not surprising

[Headlock]

9 minutes ago, ChapelHooker said:

It’s not a competition and the argument stands. No one said this isn’t true. 

If you believe this post regarding sex work to be true, than you recognize why highlighting sex work is valid in the original post 

Edited August 23, 2022 by Headlock

[Uncatena]

2 minutes ago, Headlock said:

“Work” as defined as the trading of labor for goods, services, or money, is not inherently anything, let alone exploitative or abusive 

Giving your kid an allowance to wash the dishes is not abusive 

You know damn well they weren’t talking about the textbook definition or an allowance, come on now  

[SmittenCake]

43 minutes ago, ZIVERT said:

The only thing that I can say is that letting black trans women be the voice of the community over the white, buzzcut, button up floral shirt variety of enby with their annoying social media infographics would definitely be much better for the community.

[Bosque]

An enormous mess. Just let trans people exist and NB people also exist. I never liked her and now I know why. 

[GraceRandolph]

I mean she’s kind of right. Alok Vaid-Menon and Jacob Tobia being representatives of the trans community when they aren’t necessarily trans in the traditional sense is a problem IMO. 

[fountain]

How exactly is that supposed to be non binary peoples fault? I would like to see examples where these non binary people apparently rallied to take away access to HRT and gender affirming surgery.

 

The reality is they want - and are going to do everything they can - to take away trans rights regardless, and the existence of non binary people has literally no impact on this whatsoever. 

[VOSS]

Oh yes I’m sure Florida legislators are against medical transition because of what “enbies” have been saying on twitter

[Patient Zero]

This is getting complicated and I'm TIRED.

 

And I'm gay. Imagine how the straights are feeling about all of the troubles within the LGBTQ+ community regarding gender and pronounces.

 

It's just not a good look. The community is alienating itself even more.

[Headlock]

30 minutes ago, ChapelHooker said:

You know damn well they weren’t talking about the textbook definition or an allowance, come on now  

Then they shouldn't have written it, because that is literally what they said 

[fauxtography]

Is "transmedicalist" the new "terf" ?

 

ITT I see a bunch of gays telling a trans person how to think and feel.

[Draper.]

I think there hasn't been much of a public conversation around this topics and I see and understand both positions. We are all learning, including Hunter and other trans people. Lashing her or saying "**** Hunter" for an IG like is not part of the solution.

[GraceRandolph]

25 minutes ago, InventedGays said:

Good thing no one is looking for your opinion. There isn't one way to be trans. Looking nice for the straights so they "accept" you isn't going to stop them from murdering trans people. Good luck with that middle of the road bullshit

Except the “non-binary” way of being trans gets way more coverage and they talk over the “binary” trans people who view medically transitioning as part of being trans and if you draw distinctions you are gatekeeping or invalidating. Like, no people can be NB, but when they want to totally control all conversations about LGBT topics and invalidate transmedicalist perspectives it’s a problem. 

[GraceRandolph]

3 minutes ago, InventedGays said:

They don't. lol and if they do to you thats much more indicative of the media you choose to take in versus not.  You are making nothing but hyperbolic assumptions based on nothing except your own clearly biased opinion.  And either way, conversative will hate the trans community/lgbt community whether the person speaking is a binary trans person or NB. YOU trying to limit what is considered to be trans enough based on your own clear distain for NB folks isn't going to make those straight people hate you less. 

So what makes a NB person who doesn’t medically transition and presents as their birth sex different from a cis person?