celeb news Cocktails With Queens support & defend Macy Gray over her trans comments

[That Bad Eartha]

16 minutes ago, Bey Admired said:

She walked back her comments because she was bullied and threatened into doing so. People threatened her livelihood if she did not backtrack. You think that’s normal? 

People calling out someone for a bad and uneducated take isn't bullying. What she said on a show watched by millions of people is infinitely more harmful than anything someone can say in her comments.

 

And places not wanting to book someone over public comments is not "threatening her livelihood". A job would be well in their rights to fire someone for making racist remarks online, so don't see how this is any different than that.

 

Also if anything and I hate to admit it, this is probably actually giving her a career boost at least with certain demos because as someone who actively was a fan of hers up until this point I can promise you this is by far the most press and social media attention Macy Gray has gotten in the past 10 years. But it'll just be a temporary flash in the pan and then she'll be left with an even smaller touring fan base, no pride bookings, and have to go back to giving out cd's to people on TikTok to try to drum up a scrap of attention. 

[Bey Admired]

36 minutes ago, That Bad Eartha said:

People calling out someone for a bad and uneducated take isn't bullying. What she said on a show watched by millions of people is infinitely more harmful than anything someone can say in her comments.

 

And places not wanting to book someone over public comments is not "threatening her livelihood". A job would be well in their rights to fire someone for making racist remarks online, so don't see how this is any different than that.

 

Also if anything and I hate to admit it, this is probably actually giving her a career boost at least with certain demos because as someone who actively was a fan of hers up until this point I can promise you this is by far the most press and social media attention Macy Gray has gotten in the past 10 years. But it'll just be a temporary flash in the pan and then she'll be left with an even smaller touring fan base, no pride bookings, and have to go back to giving out cd's to people on TikTok to try to drum up a scrap of attention. 

She shouldn’t have backtracked because as you are showing, people are generally unforgiving even when people do apologise. You still want her livelihood to be destroyed and her career to wane despite the fact she has apologised. Bizarre to say the least. 

[That Bad Eartha]

15 minutes ago, Bey Admired said:

She shouldn’t have backtracked because as you are showing, people are generally unforgiving even when people do apologise. You still want her livelihood to be destroyed and her career to wane despite the fact she has apologised. Bizarre to say the least. 

So you are saying if people are unwilling to forgive a horrible statement someone said a mere week after they said it, that the person shouldn't apologize at all and double down on those remarks?

 

Macy's just in a damage control stage where she'll say anything and the only trans women she is willing to engage with currently are ones like Flame Monroe who are well-known for being a trans voice who will support other transphobes like Dave Chappelle at any chance they get (largely for the same reason Macy took that Piers interview, because it is the only way they can get attention nowadays). 

 

If she takes the time to meaningfully engage with the topic and hear from a breadth of trans women about why what she said was so harmful then I'd consider accepting an apology. 

 

Not willing to be lectured here. I've spent most of my teenage years and adulthood stanning Macy Gray even when not a single soul cared about her anymore. I've bought so many projects on cd including even the random stuff like the covers album, the jazz-reimaginings, the Stevie Wonder album. I've supported a poorly managed Pledgemusic campaign and have a burnt cd demo album of pre-debut songs with a hand drawn CD cover from her to prove it. I've gone to a show of an artist I didn't know just to see Macy perform 2-songs as a special guest. I was literally supposed to see her live last week, having bought the ticket before the controversy. Luckily it got cancelled after that statement so I got my money back in that case.

 

I have a lot of residual love for Macy and hope she truly is learning from this mistake and not just doing damage control, but she's going to have to do more to earn my support back.

[modeblock]

On 7/12/2022 at 5:32 AM, ReginaPhalange said:

That Lisa woman acting like trans women are a new phenomenon  it might be to your ignorant self but in terms of society, we’ve been here from the beginning. Just like the rest of you.

 

’Natural born women’ transphobic cis women love that line. If that’s what helps you sleep at night ladies then sure, go off you natural born women

 

Also the commentary that the LGBTQ+ community says things about heterosexuals but aren’t chastised for it. Heterosexuals AREN’T A MINORITY. They aren’t persecuted for who they are. Such dumb logic. I’ve never witnessed anything straight-phobic towards heterosexuals 

Exactly! The language itself may be relatively new, but the existence of LGBTQIA+ people is a tale as old as time 

[Legend ReX]

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Edited July 25, 2022 by Legend ReX

[Sugar-Rush]

I'll never understand why it's so easy for some people to pick on women of color and try to nullify their opinions just because said opinions don't align with the progressive consensus. Macy even backtracked her comments to appease some folks, but she's still dragged regardless. She may as well have not apologized at this rate.

[Pleighboy]

I’m just shocked this thread is still open and no one has been issued a warning. 

[GraceRandolph]

On 7/12/2022 at 9:10 PM, Communion said:

She walked back her comment out of embarrassment and realizing the only people who care about Macy Gray in 2022 - aka the pride gigs she books - are in a far different place mentally than her.

 

Good she apologized and realized what she said wasn't up to snuff. 

 

OP needs to learn when to take the L already re: trans people. 

This is what people don’t get about this conversation. It’s all “people should be able to say what they want” but what they really mean is “I don’t want to be held accountable by the communities that I profit off of” if we are being honest. 

[TiaTamera]

Wow I thought Cocktails with Queens was some YouTube channel of drag queens drinking cocktails and talking about different topics. I’m like the irony of drag queens being transphobic 

[TiaTamera]

On 7/13/2022 at 10:47 PM, Legend ReX said:

Women of color were denied access to “womanhood” for centuries. AMAB people being able to simply identify as women and be accepted as such was always going to cause problems. 

What’s AMAB?

[Marla Singer]

TERFs: Stop telling women what to say or think about women's issues!

 

Also TERFs: She shouldn't have reflected on her comments or apologised, she should've rigidly stuck to the same views that we agreed with!

[ReginaPhalange]

11 minutes ago, TiaTamera said:

What’s AMAB?

Assigned male at birth

[Theshigo Washidu]

She shouldn't have apologised tbh. Macy said that she had no ill intent towards transwomen and her opinion was just her own personal view on how she feels about womanhood in 2022.

 

Not everyone is going to agree on certain things, that's life. 

[TiaTamera]

2 hours ago, ReginaPhalange said:

Assigned male at birth

Thank you, but this is what confuses me. Why isn’t man instead of male? Or boy I guess. Because I understand that sex and gender are different. Sex is biological while gender is a social construct. You cannot change your sex, right? And changing your peen peen to a vajayjay (idk what words ATRL mutes so ima just say that lol) isn’t changing ones sex as there other internal and chromosomal things that dictate a person’s sex. 
 

What confuses me, and a lot of other cisgender people, is the back and forth of using sex and gender. A person assigned a girl at birth will never be a male and vice versa, unless people start acting like God.

 

A female having ovaries and an uterus is not a social construct, it’s biological and if those organs don’t work something is medically wrong with that female, that doesn’t make her a male.

[Communion]

28 minutes ago, TiaTamera said:

Thank you, but this is what confuses me. Why isn’t man instead of male? Or boy I guess. Because I understand that sex and gender are different. Sex is biological while gender is a social construct. You cannot change your sex, right? And changing your peen peen to a vajayjay (idk what words ATRL mutes so ima just say that lol) isn’t changing ones sex as there other internal and chromosomal things that dictate a person’s sex. 
 

What confuses me, and a lot of other cisgender people, is the back and forth of using sex and gender. A person assigned a girl at birth will never be a male and vice versa, unless people start acting like God.

 

A female having ovaries and an uterus is not a social construct, it’s biological and if those organs don’t work something is medically wrong with that female, that doesn’t make her a male.

How do you tell what people's chromosomes are by looking at them?

[PoisonPill]

As they should. There is absolutely nothing wrong with recognizing that biological women go through a unique experience that cannot be replicated.

[TiaTamera]

24 minutes ago, Communion said:

How do you tell what people's chromosomes are by looking at them?

I didn’t say you can tell someone’s chromosomes (well in some instances you can with Down syndrome) by looking at them. I said you can’t just change a body part to change someone’s sex because there are other things such as internal organs and chromosomes that determine the sex of a person. A person with no Y chromosome is a female. Yes a male can have two XX chromosomes but the male will have a Y as well. XXY is male, XY is male. The absence of the Y chromosome is what makes someone a female according to biology. If there is a person with Y chromosomes who not only has the female reproductive organs but functions as it’s supposed to as well, they are an exception to the rule and rules aren’t made by the exception. 
 

should the argument be a chromosome test should be done to determine the sex? Idk, and I don’t think it really matters cause someone’s gender expression can be whatever regardless of what their sex is. 
 

im just trying to understand why it’s assigned [sex] at birth and no assigned [gender]

[Mr.Link]

On 7/13/2022 at 10:07 PM, Sugar-Rush said:

I'll never understand why it's so easy for some people to pick on women of color and try to nullify their opinions just because said opinions don't align with the progressive consensus. Macy even backtracked her comments to appease some folks, but she's still dragged regardless. She may as well have not apologized at this rate.

So people are supposed to ignore what she said because she’s a wOmAn of CoLoR? Her race has literally nothing to do with anything here

 

I love Macy but if she gets dragged by the media she has it coming for being so adamantly ignorant, if she apologized is irrelevant, everyone does when the heat comes (except Rowling who takes pride on being a TERF). 

[ReginaPhalange]

5 hours ago, TiaTamera said:

 

im just trying to understand why it’s assigned [sex] at birth and no assigned [gender]

Because the doctor or midwife assigns you a sex at birth based on your body’s physical characteristics, not how you identify.
 

A trans woman is AMAB but identifies as female. A trans man is AFAB but now identifies as male. So while yes, you can’t change your sex, that doesn’t take away from the fact that a trans woman is female and a trans man is a man. 
 

 

[TiaTamera]

4 minutes ago, ReginaPhalange said:

Because the doctor or midwife assigns you a sex at birth based on your body’s physical characteristics, not how you identify.
 

A trans woman is AMAB but identifies as female. A trans man is AFAB but now identifies as male. So while yes, you can’t change your sex, that doesn’t take away from the fact that a trans woman is female and a trans man is a man. 
 

 

Hmm and this is where my confusion comes in because I thought sex cannot be changed while your gender expression can because that’s a social construct. Wouldn’t it be correct to say that a trans woman is AMAB but identifies as a woman and a trans man is AFAB but identifies as a man?

 

the sex of a transman is female but their gender is man?

 

I’m asking for semantics because I don’t deny that trans women are women and trans men are men. What I’m trying to understand is someone “identifying” as a sex, when sex and gender are two separate things but keep on being used interchangeably.

[ReginaPhalange]

2 minutes ago, TiaTamera said:

Hmm and this is where my confusion comes in because I thought sex cannot be changed while your gender expression can because that’s a social construct. Wouldn’t it be correct to say that a trans woman is AMAB but identifies as a woman and a trans man is AFAB but identifies as a man?

 

the sex of a transman is female but their gender is man?

 

I’m asking for semantics because I don’t deny that trans women are women and trans men are men. What I’m trying to understand is someone “identifying” as a sex, when sex and gender are two separate things but keep on being used interchangeably.

I’m a little confused with what you’re trying to understand so let me try the best I can

Trans people can’t change the sex they were assigned at birth, hence why a trans woman will always be AMAB and vice versa for a trans man. While their sex at birth can’t be changed, their gender identity does. They no longer align with the sex they were born with and begin their transition