celeb news Bette Midler turns into Jk Rowling, post transphobic tweet

[Headlock]

23 minutes ago, CaptainMusic said:

I don’t think most trans men even get pregnant anyway so it’s less than that  

That's not what "birthing people" means 

[Trent W]

4 minutes ago, Headlock said:

So you acknowledge this isn't actually a real issue you would ever encounter, and is just right-wing reactionary nonsense 

I honestly believe that the people suggesting that we call women those terms should be treated in a mental asylum.

 

And yeah I’m left-center but well for a radical extremist everything is right wing so whatever 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Trent W

[Headlock]

"I can't believe people would do this!"

 

*two sentences later*

 

"I've never even heard someone say this before."

 

[Headlock]

1 minute ago, Trent W said:

I honestly believe that the people suggesting that we call women those terms should be treated in a mental asylum.

 

1 minute ago, Trent W said:

And yeah I’m left-center

Sis, do I got some news for you 

[Trent W]

Just now, Headlock said:

 

Sis, do I got some news for you 

Hmmm people like you are “so left” that you basically reduced a woman to their reproductive organs with those terms

 

I’m sorry but that’s so left it basically went right wing

 

It’s dehumanizing 

[Communion]

15 minutes ago, Headlock said:

It's almost like the goal of a physician or other medical professional is to serve their patients to the best of their ability, and using inclusive language aids in that objective because it allows them access to patient populations that require service but are often excluded due to prejudice, fear, or trepidation of their own due to past experiences with the (admittedly, sometimes awful) healthcare system 

 

Your MSM is a perfect example, honestly. The amount of research, data, and care that is able to be provided due to that term cannot be underscored. You would think as mainly cis gay men on this website that one would be thankful such advances in terminology are made when new data shows its value to both the patient and the provider.

Odd how also doctors uniformly prefer terms that describe actions over ones that denote identity. 

 

"Men who have sex with men" instead of "gay men, bisexual men, pansexual men and others"

"Sperm donor" instead of "cis men, trans women, and all others who may produce semen"

"People who menstruate" instead of "cis women, trans men and all others who may menstruate"

 

The irony being that this discourse just a few years back was people saying that trans people are being ridiculous if they are uncomfortable with words like "female" and "male" being used in medical settings and that medical accuracy comes before personal comfort... and so doctors adapted their language to be inclusive... (ie: swapping out inaccurate terms like "female" and "male" for relevant terms that denote health processes) and.... now I guess comfort comes before medical accuracy. 

 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Communion

[Headlock]

1 minute ago, Trent W said:

Hmmm people like you are “so left” that you basically reduced a woman to their reproductive organs with those terms

It's almost as if these terms are almost exclusively used in specific medical situations where a focus on someone's reproductive organs is the point of the interaction 

 

2 minutes ago, Trent W said:

I’m sorry but that’s so left it basically went right wing

Sigh.

[Communion]

5 minutes ago, Trent W said:

basically reduced to their reproductive organs

4 hours ago, Communion said:

What is the common term used for someone who produces semen and donates their ejaculate to those desiring to have a baby? 

I wonder why everyone keeps refusing to answer this question. 

@Rican @Bey Admired my blue hair dye has ruined my SJW brain - please help me figure out the term I'm trying to remember!!

Edited July 5, 2022 by Communion

[Headlock]

6 minutes ago, Communion said:

Odd how also doctors uniformly prefer terms that describe actions over ones that denote identity. 

 

"Men who have sex with men" instead of "gay men, bisexual men, pansexual men and others"

"Sperm donor" instead of "cis men, trans women, and all others who may produce semen"

"People who menstruate" instead of "cis women, trans men and all others who may menstruate"

 

The irony being that this discourse just a few years back was people saying that trans people are being ridiculous if they are uncomfortable with words like "female" and "male" being used in medical settings and that medical accuracy comes before personal comfort... and so doctors adapted their language to be inclusive... (ie: swapping out "female" for relevant terms that denote health processes) and now I guess comfort comes before medical accuracy. 

 

Who could have thought, making your patients feel comfortable because of, not in spite of, using medically inclusive terms makes their overall care better for everyone involved 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Headlock

[Trent W]

3 minutes ago, Communion said:

I wonder why everyone keeps refusing to answer this question. 

Sperm donor doesn’t even sound half as bad as “menstruator”

 

Imagine welcoming a woman to a hospital under the term “menstruator”  

[Headlock]

Just now, Trent W said:

Sperm donor doesn’t even sound half as bad as “menstruator”

So your issue is with how something sounds to you? 

 

Just now, Trent W said:

Imagine welcoming a woman to a hospital under the term “menstruator”  

Good thing literally no one does this 

[Trent W]

1 minute ago, Headlock said:

So your issue is with how something sounds to you? 

 

Good thing literally no one does this 

Is not about what I think

 

There are terms that were created thousands of years ago for us to describe our sex, and not use terms like “menstruator”

 

Is called man and woman, you might wanna read about it 

 

 

[Communion]

7 minutes ago, Trent W said:

Sperm donor doesn’t even sound half as bad as “menstruator”

Menstruator sounds awkward because it sounds irregular to conversational English, like as though you're introducing a newly rebooted version of the Terminator. But English being a phonetic language where some words sound clunky and thus we use them less cause we don't like the literal sound formation of the word itself  =/= those words being dehumanizing because they sound clunky.

 

"People who menstruate" sounds much more flowy and natural, so it's not shocking why it is used more often than menstruator, with both fairly limited to medical settings.

 

Still though, you've not explained how "people who menstruate" can be dehumanizing but "sperm donor" not when both are substituting proper nouns for phrases that describe actions related to bodily functions.

 

 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Communion

[Rican]

40 minutes ago, Trent W said:

I agree, but honestly have you read the last few pages?

 

This thread went into a mental asylum mode

 

I will just keep it cute an say again, I would punch anyone who called a woman close to me a “menstruator” or a “birthing person”

 

A woman is a lot more than their reproductive organs, it’s so dehumanizing, humiliating and unnecessary. Idgaf if it’s only for medical terms is completely dehumanizing to call a woman that.

 

Anyway I’ve never even heard these terms irl, it sounds like something a lunatic on twitter made up.

 

I hope it doesn’t become a thing cause there will be a lot more division in real life.

It’s far left language and the fact users in here are deflecting by blaming Republicans for that of type language displays that they are not ready to have that honest conversation about how that language is very uncomfortable for cisgender woman.
 

In real life I have only encounter this situation once in which a (cis) woman was being refer to as a birthing person and it was awkward for everyone around and perhaps it’s becoming more common in todays society since Bettie is tweeting about it so perhaps it’s time for woman to speak up about it.

Edited July 5, 2022 by Rican

[Headlock]

5 minutes ago, Trent W said:

Is not about what I think

 

There are terms that were created thousands of years ago for us to describe our sex, and not use terms like “menstruator”

 

So you agree language is invented and changes based on culture and necessity, like, say, in a medical setting 

 

6 minutes ago, Trent W said:

Is called man and woman, you might wanna read about it 

You really are going full mask-off huh 

[Trent W]

1 minute ago, Communion said:

Menstruator sounds awkward because it sounds irregular to conversational English, like as though you're introducing a newly rebooted version of the Terminator. But English being a phonetic language where some words sound clunky and thus we use them less cause we don't like the literal sound formation of the word itself  =/= those words being dehumanizing because they sound clunky.

 

"People who menstruate" sounds much more flowy and natural, so it's not shocking why it is used more often than menstruator, with both fairly limited to medical settings.

 

Still though, you've not explained how "people who menstruate" can be dehumanizing by "sperm donor" not when both are substituting proper nouns for phrases that describe actions related to bodily functions.

 

 

“People who menstruate” sounds more logic.

 

But are we really going to create a medical term for such an extremely specific description.

 

Like I don’t have the exact data but I’m almost sure that 95% or trans men don’t want to have kids or be a “birthing person”. One of the main reason they transition is to feel masculine which is the opposite of birthing.

 

Honestly this is just extremely extra and it’s so unnecessary.

[Headlock]

1 minute ago, Rican said:

deflecting by blaming Republicans for that of type language 

 

In real life I have only encounter this situation once 

You are so close to getting it 

[Frappucino]

Lol at people getting big mad over having to change their vocabulary. Lazy af. Pick up a dictionary plz 

[Headlock]

5 minutes ago, Trent W said:

But are we really going to create a medical term for such an extremely specific description.

That's LITERALLY what medicine is omfg   

Why do you think doctors go through over a decade of schooling and training, to learn broad definitions of things? 

 

Or do you want your interactions with a doctor to stay at "my tummy hurts" 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Headlock

[Headlock]

3 minutes ago, Trent W said:

Like I don’t have the exact data but I’m almost sure

[Trent W]

2 minutes ago, Headlock said:

That's LITERALLY what medicine is omfg   

Why do you think doctors go through over a decade of schooling and training, to learn broad definitions of things? 

So now you want Doctors to go to school, to learn terms for transmen that birth babies, but transmen transitioned from women to men to feel manly.

 

Are you hearing yourself?

 

Sure of a transmen wants to have a baby that’s alright, but you want to change the vocabulary for such a specific event  

[Harriser]

18 minutes ago, Communion said:

I wonder why everyone keeps refusing to answer this question. 

@Rican @Bey Admired my blue hair dye has ruined my SJW brain - please help me figure out the term I'm trying to remember!!

It's kind of a non-point because we also say 'egg donor'  The equivalent phrase to 'people who menstruate' would be 'people who ejaculate' or 'people with prostates', both of which are equally as awkward.

 

I would argue for making a clearer distinction between female/woman and male/man, and then in this case just using the terms for sex 
 

[Trent W]

9 minutes ago, Rican said:

It’s far left language and the fact users in here are deflecting by blaming Republicans for that of type language displays that they are not ready to have that honest conversation about how that language is very uncomfortable for cisgender woman.
 

In real life I have only encounter this situation once in which a (cis) woman was being refer to as a birthing person and it was awkward for everyone around and perhaps it’s becoming more common in todays society since Bettie is tweeting about it so perhaps it’s time for woman to speak up about it.

I connect the term far left with high-taxes, green deal and labor rights.

 

What I’m reading in this thread is mental asylum talk about terms that don’t even make sense.

 

It’s insane honestly 

[Bosque]

1 hour ago, Headlock said:

I'll give you a hint, some of these people aren't left-center 

Literally everyone on this forum agrees that abortion should be possible. The fact that you are calling them right-wing because you disagree over one specific medical term does nothing but prove my point. Never ever would any Republican or right-wingers even dream about having a discussion this senseless while they take away your rights

[Headlock]

Just now, Trent W said:

So now you want Doctors to go to school, to learn terms for transmen that birth babies, but transmen transitioned from women to men to feel manly.

 

Jesus ******* christ I don't even know where to start with this dumpster fire of a sentence, there's so many things going wrong 

 

1 minute ago, Trent W said:

Sure of a transmen wants to have a baby that’s alright, but you want to change the vocabulary for such a specific event  

That's literally how medicine and science works 

It changes CONSTANTLY given new insights and data, (good) doctors are constantly researching new developments and adapting their care to better serve their patients. Not to mention to keep your license you have to re-take boards multiple times throughout your career to ensure your practice is up to date and you maintain your quality of care.