news 2024 US Election Megathread 🇺🇸🏛️

[Vroom Vroom]

4 minutes ago, Relampago. said:

You're right, except public opinion isn't the sole reason Biden's admin was such a catastrophic failure.

 

Biden's main accomplishments were the withdraw from Afghanistan, CHIPS Act, Infrastructure Bill… and that's mostly it? We can throw in some student loan forgiveness just for good measure.

 

That is not exactly outweighing the fact that he also: continued to destabilize the Middle East by allowing Israel to run amok, crushed protestors who were against the Palestinian genocide, had a disastrous immigration crisis, lied about legalizing marijuana, did not even attempt to raise the minimum wage despite record high inflation, allowed the housing crisis to worsen, and worst of all— had literal dementia and couldn't even attend briefings in times of utmost importance, pretty much the bare minimum for a president.

 

Then there's more nebulous items like Ukraine which had their pros and cons, but ultimately wasn't a resounding success either. 

 

Above all of this, his lies and failures have completely destroyed any trust people had in him and the Democratic Party. He buried progressives and now his own party. His failures will be remembered for decades to come, and the amount of work in front of us is because he was simply THAT bad. 

 

The same can't be said for any of these other presidents except Carter, who at least spent the rest of his life making up for his impotent administration. Biden will die in a year or two and we'll be left cleaning up his mess. He'll die happy with a pint of ice cream at his side, while the rest of us are picking up scraps. He is a massive failure, and despite his admin's few accomplishments, they are entirely eclipsed by how far he has set everyone back.  

You think the Republican Party was in a good place at the end of Bush's presidency? His administration's lies literally led to a war. And he abused 9/11 to take rights away from Americans. AND oversaw the greatest recession in the last 100 years. 
 

Biden had his legislative accomplishments, united NATO and led the country out of Covid. His economic stats also wash Carter, H.W Bush and Bush's 
Again, the bar is low. Carter was useless in almost every issue and Bush's lies shaped the country negatively for decades to come. 

 

Biden had a middle of the road presidency and didn't meet the moment. But we really won't know how bad or how good his presidency was until 10 years from now

[Communion]

1 hour ago, MAKSIM said:

I'm glad you're all realizing this country is far right and center right. The progressive movement is dead. The Democratic Party is dead. 

LIBERALISM IS DEAD! 

[TeeJay]

18 minutes ago, Relampago. said:

The bill allows people to be deported when they are *charged* with theft, NOT *convicted*. Essentially, someone can call the cops on someone who did nothing, claim they stole some item/property, and because they were charged with theft, they can be deported without due process.

 

Absolutely horrible. 

I see, i mean, I have no issue with them being deported if they are in fact, here illegally. So I guess we just have different views on the immigration issue which is fine.

[Relampago.]

3 minutes ago, Vroom Vroom said:

You think the Republican Party was in a good place at the end of Bush's presidency? His administration's lies literally led to a war. And he abused 9/11 to take rights away from Americans. AND oversaw the greatest recession in the last 100 years. 
 

Biden had his legislative accomplishments, united NATO and led the country out of Covid. His economic stats also wash Carter, H.W Bush and Bush's 
Again, the bar is low. Carter was useless in almost every issue and Bush's lies shaped the country negatively for decades to come. 

 

Biden had a middle of the road presidency and didn't meet the moment. But we really won't know how bad or how good his presidency was until 10 years from now

Bush won two terms though. Biden bombed so hard they couldn't even beat a candidate as weak as Trump. Obama '08 was a massive force. Trump was an unpopular, flop president, but Biden was just *that* bad that he couldn't even get his VP to win, and he would have been crushed even further if he himself had ran.

 

I think that's very telling. I do agree we'll need to see how the next decade plays out to really know, but Biden had the playbook of what to do and how to do it laid out in front of him and he took every wrong turn just to save his own ego.

[Relampago.]

Just now, TeeJay said:

I see, i mean, I have no issue with them being deported if they are in fact, here illegally. So I guess we just have different views on the immigration issue which is fine.

Not everyone here who is undocumented is here illegally, my friend. That's how they trick you into thinking laws like this are justified and fair. They're not and never will be.

[Communion]

45 minutes ago, TeeJay said:

care to explain why that bill is bad? Honestly curious to hear cuz if it does what that link says it does, I don't see the issue with it. If they are here illegally and committing crimes, detain them. I don't get why that is bad?

1) Most state and municipal police forces don't hold people who are undocumented for petty crimes or low-level offenses like accidentally speeding or small shoplifting because they do not have the additional space to hold people in their facilities. No undocumented person is being 'not detained' if they commit a crime a citizen would be detained for. No one in law enforcement simply wants to give special treatment to the undocumented. People who think people should be rapidly deported want local and state police - whose jobs and capacities are not made for fulfilling immigration services - to detain people no matter the offense to then be picked up by ICE. 

 

2) This essentially wipes away the due process of a criminal investigation. If you're undocumented and your neighbor doesn't like you and calls the cops claiming they heard you beating your wife and the cops bring you into the station for questioning, that means you're getting insta-deported even if you've never done anything criminal* and even if you're in the process of seeking legal citizenship.

 

*- "But simply being here undocumented means you committed a crime!!". Most Americans think the vast majority of undocumented immigrants should have a path to citizenship without needing to 'start the whole process over' as currently required, while we already see ICE do things 'accidentally' like insta-deport people under things like temporary protective status like Haitians or Venezuelans who have a legal status to be here, deporting people in as little as 6 hours of being within ICE custody without ever contacting their lawyer.

 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by Communion

[TeeJay]

Just now, Relampago. said:

Not everyone here who is undocumented is here illegally, my friend. That's how they trick you into thinking laws like this are justified and fair. They're not and never will be.

Interesting, i'll have to look into that cuz i almost thought undocumented meant they crossed into the country illegally no? I do not agree with the republican side on anything at all usually except for the fact that I do think that people who have not gone through the legal process to come here, should be deported. I do not think they should be mistreated or anything but i do think they should be sent back to their country and are always welcome to come back through the proper processes.

[TeeJay]

1 minute ago, Communion said:

1) Most state and municipal police forces don't hold people who are undocumented for petty crimes or low-level offenses like accidentally speeding or small shoplifting because they do not have the additional space to hold people in their facilities. No undocumented person is being 'not detained' if they commit a crime a citizen would be detained for. No one in law enforcement simply wants to give special treatment to the undocumented. People who think people should be rapidly deported want local and state police - whose jobs and capacities are not made for fulfilling immigration services - to detain people no matter the offense to then be picked up by ICE.

 

2) This essentially wipes away the due process of a criminal investigation. If you're undocumented and your neighbor doesn't like you and calls the cops claiming they heard you beating your wife and the cops bring you into the station for questioning, that means you're getting insta-deported even if you've never done anything criminal* and even if you're in the process of seeking legal citizenship.

 

*- "But simply being here undocumented means you committed a crime!!". Most Americans think the vast majority of undocumented immigrants should have a path to citizenship without needing to 'start the whole process over' as currently required, while we already see ICE do things like insta-deport people under things like temporary protective status like Haitians or Venezuelans who have a legal status to be here, deporting people in as little as 6 hours of being within ICE custody without ever contacting their lawyer.

 

 

I'm gonna be honest, I normally ignore you and your posts cuz for years I have found you annoying and unreasonable. I'm not being shady, I only say that so my following statements makes sense lol...

 

Thank you for the reasonable, polite response. That all actually made it make alot more sense so thank you. I'm  slightly conflicted now on how I feel about the bill and the whole immigration issue in general cuz I agree with parts of it and disagree with other parts and don't really know what a good solution for it would be overall. But again, thanks for the response, it put it clearly into context.

[RihRihGirrrl]

22 minutes ago, Relampago. said:

Bush won two terms though. Biden bombed so hard they couldn't even beat a candidate as weak as Trump. Obama '08 was a massive force. Trump was an unpopular, flop president, but Biden was just *that* bad that he couldn't even get his VP to win, and he would have been crushed even further if he himself had ran.

 

I think that's very telling. I do agree we'll need to see how the next decade plays out to really know, but Biden had the playbook of what to do and how to do it laid out in front of him and he took every wrong turn just to save his own ego.

I think a good amount of the negative perception of Biden's Presidency is due to his age, stubbornness in running for a second term, and his complete inability to communicate any of the successes of his administration.

 

I think objectively, his administration was better than Bush's (overall) or Trump's first term....had Biden fumbled the pandemic the way Trump did, he would have been dragged out of office.

[Communion]

Michael Tracey being more left-wing and anti-reactionary than Ana K of TYT nkknkjnknj we live in a timeline!