news 2024 US Election Megathread 🇺🇸🏛️

[Vermillion]

 

[tiejc]

 

[Vermillion]

 

[Relampago.]

1 hour ago, Communion said:

Not this just now coming across my timeline..

 

We were so happy back then...

 

 

 

Not Tio Bernie bringing up such sweet memories…

 

 

But really, it's baffling to see Dems just… let Latinos slowly slip away. I've said it in here before, many Latinos have conservative values and if Republicans drop the racism from their mouths (or Latinos just stomach it like they're already starting to do cause let's be honest, many of them are racist/colorist themselves!) it's game over. Latinos are also becoming the largest racial demographic in the US. Without any move to the left and policy to appeal to them, Dems will only hold on for so long.

 

I know it sounds alarmist to some, but I have seen such a quick shift in my area from being basically solid blue my whole life to turning into basically a 60/40ish split. After Deporter in Chief Obama, his right hand man Biden, and "Bipartisan Immigration Bill!!!" Harris, it's really no wonder they're starting to move away from the party— there's nothing there for them. Sure, Trump is racist but he at least appeals to the Latino groups who love to pull the ladder up from behind them once they become citizens and those who fear the communist countries they fled. 

 

 

[Vermillion]

 

[Sannie]

18 minutes ago, Relampago. said:

Not Tio Bernie bringing up such sweet memories…

 

 

But really, it's baffling to see Dems just… let Latinos slowly slip away. I've said it in here before, many Latinos have conservative values and if Republicans drop the racism from their mouths (or Latinos just stomach it like they're already starting to do cause let's be honest, many of them are racist/colorist themselves!) it's game over. Latinos are also becoming the largest racial demographic in the US. Without any move to the left and policy to appeal to them, Dems will only hold on for so long.

 

I know it sounds alarmist to some, but I have seen such a quick shift in my area from being basically solid blue my whole life to turning into basically a 60/40ish split. After Deporter in Chief Obama, his right hand man Biden, and "Bipartisan Immigration Bill!!!" Harris, it's really no wonder they're starting to move away from the party— there's nothing there for them. Sure, Trump is racist but he at least appeals to the Latino groups who love to pull the ladder up from behind them once they become citizens and those who fear the communist countries they fled. 

 

 

But do these people truly not understand their legal status or even being a citizen is not going to give them a pass under Republican control? The only way mass deportation works is by throwing a wide net and arresting anyone who "looks illegal" and then dealing with it later. Have they convinced themselves they're safe because they "did it the legal way"?

[Marianah Adkins]

7 minutes ago, Sannie said:

But do these people truly not understand their legal status or even being a citizen is not going to give them a pass under Republican control? The only way mass deportation works is by throwing a wide net and arresting anyone who "looks illegal" and then dealing with it later. Have they convinced themselves they're safe because they "did it the legal way"?

I think that they are just tired that the Dems have led them on into nothing. Not that I'm fully blaming it on them but legal immigration is not the only priority they have. Outside of Florida, most of these Latinos are akin to New Deal Democrats- economically liberal and socially conservative. The Dems lately have tempered that economic liberal aspect so it is of no surprise that some are looking at the GOP.

 

The real damage really will happen once Trump is off the game, thats when we will see if the Latinos have really shifted towards the GOP.

 

And lets be honest, most of these Latinos are white passing. They'll be considered white in a couple of election cycles from now. 

[Blade]

Finding out Nate Silver is a hunty  

[Relampago.]

34 minutes ago, Sannie said:

But do these people truly not understand their legal status or even being a citizen is not going to give them a pass under Republican control? The only way mass deportation works is by throwing a wide net and arresting anyone who "looks illegal" and then dealing with it later. Have they convinced themselves they're safe because they "did it the legal way"?

 

Yeah, they don't really understand that. It's a very "Leopards Eating People's Faces" type of moment.

 

But at the same time, it's not like Democrats have been shining beacons of ethical and excellent immigration practices either. Sure, one is definitely better than the other, but it's not like Democrats are convincing on immigration either. It's not enough to be "not as bad" to convince anyone.

 

And besides that, Latinos as a demographic being pretty much boxed into the immigration problem and not anything else shows a level of ignorance from the Democratic Party in how to really connect with them. Many of them are blue collar workers or grew up with those values, they'd like to see some return on investment for the hard work they put in doing the jobs many other people find undesirable here. Even those who do have white collar jobs likely grew up hearing those same values. Bernie providing them with that ROI for their work that no one else seems to truly be invested in is a huge incentive for them, so its no wonder they gravitate towards him. 

 

The Dems have a lot of work to do if they want to bring them back, obviously. But if they want a quicker fix, I wish they'd highlight Walz more. He's the whitest white man ever, which is the only sorta downside, but a lot of his messaging and values are very in line with Latino men specifically. I don't think Kamala has that same appeal whatsoever, charismatic as she is.

 

 

 

 

Edited Friday at 03:19 AM by Relampago.

[shelven]

11 minutes ago, Blade said:

Finding out Nate Silver is a hunty  

Not you only learning this now  I've been reading his tweets with a "petty older gay white man" vibe for YEARS and it always makes them better.

[VOSS]

 

[Relampago.]

1 hour ago, Blade said:

Finding out Nate Silver is a hunty  

 

[Lil Mistee]

LMAO

[Mr. Mendes]

On 9/9/2024 at 3:05 AM, Communion said:

@Mr. Mendes Sister, the Democratic Secretary of State for Nevada directly provided this form to the NV Green Party after the NV Dems originally sued and forced the Greens to have to re-validate all 29,000 signatures for ballot access a second time:

 

 

The NV Democratic Party then amended their affidavit and successfully got the Green Party kicked off the ballot because item "(6)" is incorrectly copied + pasted by the SOS's office from the language meant for referendums and not minor party ballot access despite the form being labeled as such by the SOS.

 

This sample form is still readily accessible via the Nevada Secretary of State's website:

https://www.nvsos.gov/sos/home/showpublisheddocument/10564/638266480307830000

 

Supporting Democrats is not a form of suppressed speech. There is no mass movement in action by leftists to disenfranchise people who want to vote Democratic. Not to say you believe such, but I am just making it clear what the context of the conversation is.

 

I've already said I'm not going to hold such over anyone's head and try to like personally attack anyone, whether in real life or online who votes for Harris.

 

But yet it feels like you're under the assumption I am, and even - correct me if I'm wrong - are claiming it is evidence of such that I similarly don't judge Green Party voters for hating Democrats, especially in light of things like the above, and not agreeing with the sentiment that they're a lesser evil but an equal evil to Republicans. 

 

I do not personally care how any individual votes. I am much more terribly disturbed and focused on interrogating Dems on examples of corruption like the above.

 

Ironically, Jill Stein winning 5% of the national vote would solve these issues and automatically reclassify the Green Party from a minor party to a major party and end these unethical lawsuits over ballot access that make leftists resent Democrats. One might even imagine Democrats would suddenly support rank choice voting if Green were solidified as a national party for ballot access. 

Spoiler

Alright, it has been a long while since the comment passed and I want to firstly apologize from that. A few days after this, my mother and i received some news about our health that has fundamentally completely changed our lives forever, and the last thing I wanted to do while overly emotional and dealing with that was talk politics. So I receded into talking about pop music LMAO

 

But this was promised a response, and It deserves one. 

 

I want to re-iterate that I think you're still not really acknowledging what conversation I'm actually trying to have with you. I'm not here to talk about the rights and wrongs of the Democrats, their pros and their cons, or even get into why I personally don't hold any reverence for them in my heart. I'm here to talk about this continued cycle of people being made out to be all sorts of things because their lives and situations dictates that they have to make decisions in a way that you and many others who share your beliefs don't like. 

 

To start, I do not believe that supporting Democrats is a form of suppressed speech, nor do I believe that there is any leftist movement to disenfranchise voters who vote Democrat. To suggest otherwise would be foolish.

 

What I am getting at though is a very real phenomenon of leftists becoming incredibly aggressive with people who are not party loyalists but are choosing to vote for Harris because they believe that it is the best path in front of them. You yourself haven't really engaged in this, but it is something I see play out both online and in person. 

 

I've made mention before of one of my best friends in the world being trans. She is not registered to any political party, and has more than once aligned herself with initiatives and local groups that aim to strengthen and widen the reach of third party candidates that are positioned on the further left, and that includes the Greens. In this election, she is voting for Kamala Harris because she understands that there is no reality where a third party candidate wins in November 2024. It will either be Harris or it will be Trump. She has chosen a path of harm reduction. 

 

Multiple people that she has been involved with for some time in those aforementioned circles have given an absolutely hellish time for it. She, as a trans woman, is being spoken to and about as if she is evil for voting for a candidate that she feels poses less harm to her as she continues her transitioning journey. 

 

That is happening quite a bit. 

 

I absolutely agree that is not right for leftists to be mistreated for their perspective. I at the same time believe that it is not right for leftists to mistreat others for their perspective. Leftists sometimes get into this mode where many of them wish to act like they're innocent bystanders who get picked at for no reason, and will defend their own picking as being somehow morally okay because of what their ultimate stance politically is. 

 

You say that you don't wish to change anyone's mind, but you do sometimes fall into a pattern of directly challenging people over the reasons for voting Democrat, even if they're not all attempting to engage in any sort of argument or saying anything disparaging about those who aren't. You have called people followers, sheep, loyalists, etc simply because they have made a choice that really is only as deep as "this is what I feel opens up the best future for myself and those I care about."

 

Yes there are hardcore Democratic lapdogs around here. We all know who they are. But you and other leftists do sometimes treat everyone who votes in a way you may not agree with like they are the same kind of person. It's very hard to believe you at times when you say "I don't care who people vote for" or "I wouldn't shame someone for voting for a Democrat" because you have done that before, especially the longer a debate or discussion goes on. 

 

And that is why I keep returning to the idea of you cannot put everyone who is voting for Kamala Harris into a neat little box. You just can't. The reasons are too numerous and wide and diverse for such that. But a lot of leftists seem to want to do just that. They want to frame everyone who is voting for Harris as a certain kind of person who stands for a certain kind of thing without giving any consideration to the circumstances that lead them to that point. 

 

Not everyone has the privilege to vote or align their politics solely according to what is happening in Gaza. Not everyone has the privilege to say "if the platform isn't perfect, then I'm not interested". And certainly not many of us have the privilege to be a single issue voter (you don't seem to be, but I have noticed more and more that there are quite a large number of single issue voters within the leftists community). And yet, that is still viewed as unacceptable, worthy of condemnation, worth interrogating simply because it means we end up voting for a candidate that leftists do not like. 

 

That is the message I'm trying to get across here. Leftists are by and large actively turning the individuals who are most likely to agree with their beliefs and platforms away because many of them do not seem interested in hearing what those people have to say unless they're not voting for Kamala. 

 

You don't have to tell me the Democrats are doing incredibly shifty, immoral things in regard to the Greens and beyond. You don't have to tell me that the Democratic platform is imperfect and full of issues. You don't have to tell me that the Democrats moving to the right on certain issues is disappointing. Most of us know that. It's not a secret to us, or something we don't recognize. We agree with you wholeheartedly on that.

 

But when those points go a step further to begin to say that Democrats and Republicans are the same, that's when it starts to become a little difficult to take seriously because it is something that can be said only by someone who subjectively feels strongly negatively toward the Democrats. It is not objective fact, and we need to stop treating it as if it is. They are not anywhere near the same as the Republicans. And it doesn't make someone a partisan sheep for saying so. 

 

There just seems to be a complete lack of acknowledgement about the people who are caught in the middle, not trying to push party politics or toe a party line, but rather are just trying to make the best choice in their eyes. A lack of acknowledgement that is until they're talked to as if they're stupid or dark sided for casting their vote for a person that an entirely different group of people has decided is persona non grata. And I'm getting incredibly frustrated the further into this election we all get at how those people are being treated. 

 

It isn't the Democrats being unfairly targeted and bullied. It isn't the leftists who're being unfairly targeted and bullied. In those in between who are. And it has become incredibly normalized to do so in this age of "if you're not with me , you're against me." 

 

I respect you a great deal and believe you're one of the most consistently intelligent and well balanced posters here. I don't say this because I want to attack your or attack leftists. I say it because there are just things happening this election cycle that I believe are incredibly unnecessary and are making this whole thing far more taxing and painful than it has to be. And of course I know you do not represent all leftists nor can you fix any problems yourself. I cannot either. But we inhabit the same space, and get involved in the same conversations, so I don't see why we can't have that talk on a micro level in the hopes that maybe just maybe we can both walk away with more understanding of the other, where they're coming from, and at the very least remove some of the tension from this small, isolated space. 

 

Edited Friday at 04:55 AM by Mr. Mendes

[Communion]

3 hours ago, Virgos Groove said:

I've been thinking a lot about that 2017-2020 period (since it was more or less my political awakening and how I learned about progressivism, socialism, Marxism, etc.) and I still cannot believe it hapenned. An era where most of the Dem candidates were fighting to see who was the most progressive. Where slogans like "abolish ICE" and "defund the police" didn't just go viral, but were legitimately discussed. Where previously fringe "loony left" policies like student debt relief and the Green New Deal were made part of the Dem platform. Where the "paradox of tolerance" was being discussed by liberals. Like, Starbucks liberals.

 

Naturally, this wasn't meant to last and it didn't. The moment Supreme Commander Biden stepped into office after the chaos of January 6th, the centrists abandoned any commitment to progressivism and the (very few) progressives that didn't follow the party line were dismissed as "enabling a second Trump term". Russia invaded Ukraine and everyone right of Joseph Stalin began painting ******* NATO as a liberation movement (pffft ). "Abolish ICE" and "resist the American Gestapo" became "actually, we do need to kick out the migrants". And now genocide is considered a totally acceptable reality or, at worst, a consequence of realpolitik that no liberal or progressive should question.

 

Trump's term was undeniably - and I cannot stress this enough - AWFUL. But if there is one small thing I miss, it's that it lit a fire under Dems' ass. That late-2018/2019 Squad AOC Omar Tlaib Green New Deal Bernie 2020 era...

 

Going from Democrats fighting over how big of a student loan forgiveness to do:

• Harris' dumbass ******* plan knknj
• -> to Warren's $50k with some nonsense researched thesis on why not too little but not too much to be equitable
• -> to Sanders calling for just getting rid of it all ljnknjk

To now we got Harris copying Trump just making **** up on the spot like "STOP TAXING TIPS!!"  

[Communion]

ljnknkjn sister maybe put it behind a spoiler and I'll respond behind a spoiler myself @Mr. Mendes 

[Mr. Mendes]

Just now, Communion said:

ljnknkjn sister maybe put it behind a spoiler and I'll respond behind a spoiler myself @Mr. Mendes 

No you know what I'm gonna break this goddamn forum one post at a time until they finally fix the back end enough that it can at least load words! 

 

But yeah, you're right lemme do that. 

[feelslikeadream]

2 hours ago, Vermillion said:

 

My favorite thing about living in PA now is how I'll get to vote against Fetterman and Shapiro eventually

 

[dancingqueen]

6 hours ago, Blade said:

High black turnout combined with educated white voters shifting to D'/ even more than 2020.

The Black population of Georgia is also more college educated relative to other states as well.

 

Meanwhile in AZ an absolute collapse in Latino support would do the trick.

All of this tbh. The state has also grown by over 400,000 people since the 2020 election with over 250,000 of these people relocating to the blue Atlanta region. According to the Brookings Institute on top of these statistics, the vast majority of the growth has been from POC and the state's white population has slightly declined during the same time span. I'll concede that Georgia is still a red state locally but on a federal level it's much different. The 2020 and 2022 senate races prove this in my opinion. Also given Trump already lost in 2020 Im thinking there is just general fatigue for him in the state. Normie Republicans can win but the MAGA ones are gonna have trouble state wide. Im also not worried about MTG in 2028 because of this.

Oh and I also think the polls are underrepresented the black vote which makes up 1/3 of the electorate. Just my 2 cents.

These stats are through 2023 so I imagine they are even higher now

Hispanic Growth - +105K

Asian - +58K

Black - +142K

White - (-)15K

Edited Friday at 05:49 AM by dancingqueen
added information

[Blade]

"Leftists are by and large actively turning the individuals who are most likely to agree with their beliefs and platforms away" @Mr. Mendes

I've been feeling this so hard lately. Luckily this won't turn me into those "**** the left" blue MAGA losers but it's exhausting and counterproductive.

This is an extreme example because it's directed at a politician and not a reg person but I compare it to how people this week have been using the execution of Marcellus Williams to dunk on... AOC? Actually dunk isn't even the right word because I'm all for criticism of elected officials but almost blaming her for it? And yes, I know the DNC platform removed abolition of the death penalty from their platform but like...how far are we jumping to accuse one of the few Congressional members *closest* to our side as being part of the reason Marcellus Williams was unjustly executed? Even if you want to blame Dems for it, the 3 Dems who actually had the chance to halt it tried to and got outnumbered by 6 Republicans.

 

[XDNA]

4 hours ago, Relampago. said:

Not Tio Bernie bringing up such sweet memories…

 

 

But really, it's baffling to see Dems just… let Latinos slowly slip away. I've said it in here before, many Latinos have conservative values and if Republicans drop the racism from their mouths (or Latinos just stomach it like they're already starting to do cause let's be honest, many of them are racist/colorist themselves!) it's game over. Latinos are also becoming the largest racial demographic in the US. Without any move to the left and policy to appeal to them, Dems will only hold on for so long.

 

I know it sounds alarmist to some, but I have seen such a quick shift in my area from being basically solid blue my whole life to turning into basically a 60/40ish split. After Deporter in Chief Obama, his right hand man Biden, and "Bipartisan Immigration Bill!!!" Harris, it's really no wonder they're starting to move away from the party— there's nothing there for them. Sure, Trump is racist but he at least appeals to the Latino groups who love to pull the ladder up from behind them once they become citizens and those who fear the communist countries they fled. 

 

 

The mistake Obama made was not using all his political capital to pass immigration reform. Right now there would be an entire generation of latinos loyal to democrats (minus Cubans) had he done that. And yeah latinos are more traditional culturally, but many Latin American countries follow the separation of church and state more than we do these days.

[FameFatale]

 

[Raspberries]

 

[dabunique]

14 minutes ago, Raspberries said:

 

Well damn 

[Armani?]

40 minutes ago, Raspberries said:

 

A quarter of the Hispanic electorate is undecided in this poll