Cruel Summer Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 11 hours ago, Kassi said: Warren’s interpretation was likely spot on Pelosi’s historic leadership Neither of these are a thing. If you can’t tell that Warren was taking a desperate cheap shot as a last ditch effort to muster a meaningful chance at consolidating the left under her, why bother? It was plain as day from the second that it happened that she wasn’t being genuine and truthful about how the conversation played out. Even the timing was intentional and meant to inflict damage on Sanders’ campaign. Honestly the constant erasure of the barriers that Democrats put in Sanders’ path at every single possible turn - this being one of them - is like, super weird and disingenuous. The Democratic Party hated and feared Bernie Sanders (I expect you to nitpick the word “feared” here but we’ve all heard how they were shitting their pants in closed-door secret meetings with Pete “Polls at 0% With Black Voters” Buttigieg ), and Elizabeth Warren was significantly more concerned with her own political prospects than the health of progressivism in the US (and gravely misstepped since it didn’t get her anywhere and her stubbornness killed both their chances).
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 11 hours ago, Kassi said: Pelosi maneuvering to getting ~only~ 90% of Americans access to healthcare To quote a wise woman named Nancy Pelosi: "One of the principles of universal healthcare is universal access. For access to be universal, it must be affordable." So while you can claim "only" 10% of Americans don't have health insurance - that figure being pre-pandemic, with the estimate of it jumping to 15% with 15M Americans losing their insurance going into 2021 - having insurance is not the same thing, per Nancy Pelosi, as having access to healthcare: Quote Americans are increasingly skeptical that they're getting their money's worth when it comes to medical care, the study found. About 52% adults said their most recent health care experience wasn't worth the cost, up from 43% in April 2021. Overall, 9 in 10 Americans say people are paying too much for the quality of health care they are receiving. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/health-care-costs-rising-americans/ High estimates placing close to 50% of all citizens in the world's richest country can't afford healthcare? No wonder that Congress has historically low approval. Nancy should be grateful this ain't revolutionary France. Nancy & Chuck's Congress coming in at an almighty -62 Approval rating.
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) Anyway, as a reminder of what is happening in 2022, it's less than 3 weeks until Biden forces 45 Million Americans to choose between letting their loans go into default or being able to eat: It is not humane to force people living within poverty to live on the edge of "Will he? Won't he?" as their livelihoods hang in the balance depending on another monthly bill they won't be able to afford. It is quite literally impossible for payments to resume in 18 days based on the lack of notice alone. No company will have billing statements. No one can afford for them to start. He said he would announce his student debt relief plan "in a few weeks" 5 months ago. Edited August 14, 2022 by Communion
Kassi Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 31 minutes ago, Cruel Summer said: Neither of these are a thing. If you can’t tell that Warren was taking a desperate cheap shot as a last ditch effort to muster a meaningful chance at consolidating the left under her, why bother? It was plain as day from the second that it happened that she wasn’t being genuine and truthful about how the conversation played out. Even the timing was intentional and meant to inflict damage on Sanders’ campaign. Honestly the constant erasure of the barriers that Democrats put in Sanders’ path at every single possible turn - this being one of them - is like, super weird and disingenuous. The Democratic Party hated and feared Bernie Sanders (I expect you to nitpick the word “feared” here but we’ve all heard how they were shitting their pants in closed-door secret meetings with Pete “Polls at 0% With Black Voters” Buttigieg ), and Elizabeth Warren was significantly more concerned with her own political prospects than the health of progressivism in the US (and gravely misstepped since it didn’t get her anywhere and her stubbornness killed both their chances). Well yeah, it was a primary, babe. Warren straight up decimated Bloomberg. Tulsi nuked Kamala. Pete ethered Tulsi. Amy stayed on Pete’s neck. Julian self-deleted with his ageist attack on Biden. And Bernie was nasty all around, per usual. Etc The only person to rise above the fray was Biden, ergo why he became the unity candidate. But I digress. The point of a primary wasn’t to coronate Bernie, and he in fact was not the only one to encounter barriers to his run so I’m not sure why you’re pretending like that’s the case. Acting like Bernie’s candidacy was inevitable and everyone else just got in the way is even MORE weird and disingenuous. He was not entitled to easy debates, black votes, or a split field. Regardless, whether or not it was a “cheap shot” against a primary opponent, it only existed because it’s likely TRUE that Bernie expressed his concerns to dissuade her to run.
Kassi Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 32 minutes ago, Communion said: To quote a wise woman named Nancy Pelosi: "One of the principles of universal healthcare is universal access. For access to be universal, it must be affordable." So while you can claim "only" 10% of Americans don't have health insurance - that figure being pre-pandemic, with the estimate of it jumping to 15% with 15M Americans losing their insurance going into 2021 - having insurance is not the same thing, per Nancy Pelosi, as having access to healthcare: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/health-care-costs-rising-americans/ High estimates placing close to 50% of all citizens in the world's richest country can't afford healthcare? No wonder that Congress has historically low approval. Nancy should be grateful this ain't revolutionary France. Nancy & Chuck's Congress coming in at an almighty -62 Approval rating. Then have Bernie FTV or run for Senate Majority Leader or literally anything to get his bills across the finish the line. Stop blaming women doing the work and start holding MEN accountable challenge.
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Kassi said: The only person to rise above the fray was Biden, Rose above the fray by suggesting Bernie was personally responsible for the AME church massacre? The same time that Bernie attacked his own supporters (Teachout) for highlighting Biden's corruption? At this point, your presence is just disruptive here. No one else is doing these long rants about the past that you do to get the whole thread discussing an issue. @slik was right - it's cultist. Your posts read like a straight man posting on a sports betting forum. The reality is that your entitlement and privilege to treat politics as no different than the kind of entertainment that sports betting provides is disruptive and unnecessary. I genuinely think you'd be happier posting on some globe emoji reddit than literally only checking this thread to "run interference to anti-Dem messaging", as you once called it, for people... who vent or complain about their elected officials. This is supposed to be a place to discuss US politics, not have people who semi-joke about being Dem operatives trying to run PR for a political party they have a career-based investment in. Edited August 14, 2022 by Communion
Vermillion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 Sigh. Ok. Too many intersections of cynical political strategy and my Tylenol for my headache from this morning hasn't kicked in yet.
Kassi Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 1 hour ago, Communion said: Rose above the fray by suggesting Bernie was personally responsible for the AME church massacre? The same time that Bernie attacked his own supporters (Teachout) for highlighting Biden's corruption? At this point, your presence is just disruptive here. No one else is doing these long rants about the past that you do to get the whole thread discussing an issue. @slik was right - it's cultist. Your posts read like a straight man posting on a sports betting forum. The reality is that your entitlement and privilege to treat politics as no different than the kind of entertainment that sports betting provides is disruptive and unnecessary. I genuinely think you'd be happier posting on some globe emoji reddit than literally only checking this thread to "run interference to anti-Dem messaging", as you once called it, for people... who vent or complain about their elected officials. This is supposed to be a place to discuss US politics, not have people who semi-joke about being Dem operatives trying to run PR for a political party they have a career-based investment in. I mean, no. But by all means don’t let facts get in the way of your narrative. Quote “Bernie voted five times against the Brady Bill and wanted a waiting period of 12 hours,” Biden said to huge cheers from the crowd. “I’m not saying he’s responsible but that man would not have been able to get that weapon with a waiting period had been what I suggested, until you are cleared.” https://nypost.com/2020/02/25/democratic-debate-biden-comes-out-swinging-against-sanders-on-gun-control-obama-support/amp/ Calling out candidates on their voting records is exactly what primary debates are for. I know it’s common for the far left to bury their heads in the sand over Bernie’s right wing views on guns and immigration, but not everyone is obligated to play along. Also, I didn’t bring up the 2020 primaries topic. Also, I complain/vent about Democrats like AOC, Omar, Manchin, Sinema, and Amy Schumer’s cousin (who I’ve repeatedly said should be replaced). I complain about independents like Bernie. I vent about Republicans like Trump, McConnell, and my own elected official/the most hated man in Congress Ted Cruz. So it would appear I’m using this thread the same way everyone else does.
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Kassi said: I mean, no. But by all means don’t let facts get in the way of your narrative. I don't know how to explain to you that no one wants to see essays of Nancy Pelosi fan fiction anymore. Even people generally pro-Democrat and sympathetic to VBNMW feel it's disruptive. Literally any subject with valid criticism of Democrats' corruption: "NANCY PELOSI IS THE MOST PROGRESSIVE POLITICIAN IN HISTORY!" "BERNIE'S SENATE IS FAILING LIKE HOW ALL LEFTISTS FAIL!" "THE BIDEN AGENDA IS POPULAR AND SOARING!" Like it's not even creative or entertaining anymore. At what point is a conflict of interest reached to have operatives running PR on a pop forum? Edited August 14, 2022 by Communion
Vermillion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 The Brady Bill and his immigration positions are the biggest dings (among several) against Bernie with the majority of leftists I keep in touch with, both past and present, which I don't feel like personally unpacking, but y'all are welcome to it. If he had a remote shot in 2024 as those hoping for Biden to die claim or higher office after that, I might.
Kassi Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 24 minutes ago, Communion said: I don't know how to explain to you that no one wants to see essays of Nancy Pelosi fan fiction anymore. Even people generally pro-Democrat and sympathetic to VBNMW feel it's disruptive. Literally any subject with valid criticism of Democrats' corruption: "NANCY PELOSI IS THE MOST PROGRESSIVE POLITICIAN IN HISTORY!" "BERNIE'S SENATE IS FAILING LIKE HOW ALL LEFTISTS FAIL!" "THE BIDEN AGENDA IS POPULAR AND SOARING!" Like it's not even creative or entertaining anymore. At what point is a conflict of interest reached to have operatives running PR on a pop forum? So you hate hearing good things about Democrats and bad things about leftists? Idk what that has to do with me. Seems like a personal problem. Like everyone else, I’m just commentating on things as they happen in real time like unanimous passage of the historic IRA in the House less than 48 hours ago. If you would have dinged Pelosi for it failing//stalling, then it’s fair game for someone to credit for it sailing through without a hitch. Idek know what your point is? That all posts in here should be anti-Democrat? Isn’t there a already a?thread for that?
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 7 minutes ago, Espresso said: The Brady Bill and his immigration positions are the biggest dings (among several) against Bernie with the majority of leftists I keep in touch with, both past and present, which I don't feel like personally unpacking, but y'all are welcome to it. If he had a remote shot in 2024 as those hoping for Biden to die claim or higher office after that, I might. Bernie Sanders is not running for president in 2024. The entire topic is also disingenuous when you have operatives say things like: 26 minutes ago, Kassi said: Calling out candidates on their voting records is exactly what primary debates are for. Yet we saw hostility and threats against those who called out Biden's policy past. A analyst on financial corruption who simply supported Bernie did an article on Biden's long-path of financial corruption (he was literally nicknamed for his allegiance to predatory banks!) and an op-ed became hysteria about progressives "trying to sabotage Democrats" and "not taking the threat of Trump seriously enough". It was deemed "inappropriate" to link Biden's choices to the attempt to end of social security but it was fine to try and paint Bernie Sanders as having put the gun in the hand of the man behind the AME church massacre. I think Kassi's constant rants and partisanship ironically exemplifies the kind of partisanship most people have fatigue from. If you want to be a propagandist, you have to be able to read the room and give an inch where there's resentment and feelings of anger. Not everything can be going perfect. Dems, objectively, can't be "winning and having their best week ever!!!!" when majority of the nation says we're on the wrong path. It's all just very: "There is nothing wrong with the Democrats! They're doing amazing and everyone is satisfied!" People want strong leadership, not negligence. No one thinks Joe Biden is a strong leader. No one thinks Nancy Pelosi or Chuck Schumer are strong leaders. Dems lack any kind of coherent leadership identity to where even partisan Dems like those in this thread are getting annoyed at the extreme propaganda their more extreme peers push out.
Kassi Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 Anyway. @Espressomama, I just learned that DeSantis is 5'9". Eisenhower was the last president 5'9" or less and the last 7 Presidents have been over 6 feet. Did you know this? Does this impact your assessment of a DeSantis run in any way?
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Kassi said: So you hate hearing good things about Democrats You: *posts that Nancy Pelosi is the most progressive politician on healthcare to distract from the failings of the IRA on on Medicare negotiating drug prices and Nancy and Chuck's failures to cap insulin in private insurance* Anyone with common sense or knowledge of history: "......I don't think that's true". You: *posts that Nancy Pelosi has ensured 90% of Americans have healthcare as undeniably fact" Anyone with common sense or knowledge of history: "Again.....I don't think that's true". You: *some tangent about how Bernie Sanders teaming with immigrant rights groups to stop a predatory Immigration bill that would have empowered corporations and loosened the protections of low-skilled migrants over 20 years ago makes him *checks notes* a Republican and thus not as progressive as *checks notes* Icon Pelosi" Anyone with common sense or knowledge of history: "Are you.. okay? There's no evidence to any of what you're claiming and posting. Are you good? And what does any this have to do with the objectively disappointing window for when the limited drug pricing kicks in??" Sis, these circles of disinformation you run this thread around in all because....what? You think a few homosexuals complaining online will have any impact on elections? You can't dedicate hours and hours to posting misinformation and have there be no incentive on your end. What do you gain from perpetually fighting with people who say criticisms as mild as "things could be better"? . The idea that people owe loyalty to a political party by nature of other options being worse is inherently unserious. You can't silence people into obedience via "well look at how bad Republicans are!". People need to somehow benefit from a political party (or be lied to) to support it. This is 101 stuff. Tell whoever you know at the Texas State Democratic Party if they send me a check too I'll post nice things about them online. Let's get those checks flowing, okay? Edited August 14, 2022 by Communion
Ibrahim Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 There's a huge difference with being progressive and getting progressive legislation done. Sure, "progressive" can be relative dependent on the current political center, but if you can't get legislation passed as a "true" leftist but you can get relatively progressive legislation done that moves the status quo to the left, even a little, why not be happy about it? What's the point of being an ineffective progressive leader?
Communion Posted August 14, 2022 Posted August 14, 2022 6 minutes ago, Ibrahim said: getting progressive legislation done. The "progressive" legislation in question: A majority of Americans support no co-pays, no deductibles and no premiums for healthcare. Congressional Democrats are at odds with Democratic voters because they're more interested in career-building as an organization for themselves than representing the views of their voters:
Recommended Posts