cloudbusting Posted April 10 Posted April 10 6 minutes ago, ShouldersSideways said: Something I've noticed in the last few years is some people have no ability to simply enjoy things anymore. I'm all for dissecting lyrics, but people are constantly looking for the hidden meaning in everything. I'm old man yells at cloud, but I think it's just TikTok culture. Like YES she puts a lot of thought and intention into her work, but when we start looking for hidden meanings like this… it's just too much NOW THE WORLD WILL BOW TO LUCIFER all over again
chaeyonce Posted April 10 Posted April 10 Thought it was sweet when they was walkin' In the backdoor of the kitchen past the dirty dishes Now we on a mission, tried to turn me to the opposition I'm appalled 'bout the proposition Y'all been played by the plagiaristic, ain't gonna give no clout addiction my attention I ain't no regular singer, now come get everythin' you came for 2
Cbreezy Posted April 10 Posted April 10 So many thoughts post-release... The Good * Elated at the sales. Happily eating humble pie given that I for sure saw 300k range as the upper limit (all things considered). I will say that, in light of the botched physicals (more on that in a sec) the fact she had 27 tracks this time helped a ton (e.g. streaming being the main means of hearing the entire album) and doesn't necessarily see the initial worry rendered totally invalid. We'd be looking at nearer 500k (IMO) had the preorder window been longer. But no point dwelling on that. * The discourse around the album is amazing. For better or worse, I am pretty consumed by the marketing aspect of my faves releases and Bey (since at least ST) has always had an...angle. And not just something limp and basic, but something qualitative and culture-shifting. CC continues that trend and has been rightfully received well because of it (the reviews etc). Which is great as... * The album is actually...impeccable! The Hmm * While the botched physicals isn't doom and gloom (nor is it the disaster some are trying to make out to be), it's sloppier than I like from Bey. She has had this innate ability to "Olivia Pope" her missteps in ways the GP end up being none the wiser about. Even her whole "artiste" positioning does not pardon the fact that BOTH the vinyl (understandable) AND the CD (totally unjust) don't have the full tracklist. I imagine ish was pressed a long time ago, which probably means act 2 was due a while back (which is in direct contrast to many thinking it was due later than now hence the "rushed" release), but it still isn't very Beyonce-like. I personally want the original cover and the full tracklist, so won't buy a physical thing. I almost feel like putting on my clown makeup because there doesn't seem to be any guarantees it's even coming. Again, not the end of the world or any kind of "real" stain on Bey or the album, but just a little personally disappointed. The Pending * There are clear similarities in how she rolled CC and Rennie out (super on-the-nose lead single, no visuals etc), but I'm going to need that to be the end of the parallels. My gut tells me CC will **need** a **something** and sooner than Rennie did. Both my gut and the intel I got (several people removed) tell me Rennie caught even Bey's camp by surprise in terms of its cultural resonance. In that it "apparently" wasn't the plan for the albums to be as spaced out as they have been. Take with a grain of salt if you choose, but at the same time, their pivot (to stretching Rennie out) makes sense. Why pass up an opportunity to take ish slow, let ish breathe, and figure out the visual drama when the source material is selling itself? IMO, there's no way we'd be getting CC only now if Rennie flopped into oblivion. That plus the deep embrace from both critics and the queer community that the album resonated with would have made her flinging on a cowboy hat and switching up her sound 6 months later feel a little disingenuous. I say all of that to say, as well as CC has been received, I just don't know if the "nothing til the tour" approach (next year?) will placate the fans or GP nor sustain the album as long as it did Rennie. Beyond Rennie taking on a life of its own in the clubs (which I highly doubt will be CC's edit), the lion's share of us were convinced visuals were coming imminently after its release, so we held on for so long because we were SO SURE the videos were around the corner. SO SURE. Knowing her games and shenanigans now, I can't see the attention span of listeners being the same. So, for her sake, I hope the visuals or tour or a live something are indeed imminent. Cus a part of me feels, for as strong of a launch as this has been commercially, she may legit lose ppl's interest in the three-album arc without anything supporting vehicle to push it. The Random * Bodyguard is life and this era's Cuff It if handled right. * Tyrant needs to be sent to Urban at some point soon. * The Act III Rock thing is still perplexing me. In one regard, CC album feels like the perfect precursor to a Rock & Roll album in the vein of Tina Turner / Little Richard (e.g. Ya Ya instead of a Don't Hurt Yourself type Rock). But with so much of CC having Rock influences it almost feels like it she has come in before the beat (if Rock really is the anchoring genre for Act III). 9 3
Jotham Posted April 10 Posted April 10 (edited) HANGMAN, ANSWER ME NOW YOU OWE ME A DEBT, YOU STOLE HIM FROM ME I HATED YOU ONCE, I ENVY YOU NOW JUST TELL ME HOW, TELL ME HOW Edited April 10 by Jotham 4 1
ShouldersSideways Posted April 10 Posted April 10 Quote The dream scenario, to her mind, is being able to "make things and pop out when I need to pop out, and then have a safe and protected life with my family, and not be worried that if I'm not delivering something all the time, or not giving all the time, that everything's going to go away. I think that's always been a massive anxiety of mine: this idea that people will just be like, Actually, I know I've been with you since you were 14, but I'm over you now because you're boring.” This part of Zendaya's interview in Vogue is a reminder she's a Bey stan 1
swissman Posted April 10 Posted April 10 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bender34 said: I can't believe these morons are still screaming on TikTok that Tyrant is about lynching and sundown towns 1 hour ago, cloudbusting said: Like YES she puts a lot of thought and intention into her work, but when we start looking for hidden meanings like this… it's just too much I duno, I don't necessarily think it's very "hidden" when she literally says the words "hangman" and "when the sun goes down" in the song. In fact I'd call that an overt clue, if you were looking for deeper meaning. I'm of the opinion that it can mean different things to different people, and that is what art is about...and that Beyoncé knows this when using double entendres or themes that can apply to two different scenarios. It wouldn't be the first time Beyoncé has added allusions to very real racial issues behind the surface of her music, like the sample in Freedom. In the trajectory of Lemonade, Freedom falls into the part of the story when she decides to forgive and move past her relationship issues and lyrically could very possibly only be interpreted to be about personal freedom if we didn't have the video to double its meaning and the sample to outright confirm it. Edited April 10 by swissman 2 1
Lose My Breath Posted April 10 Posted April 10 Been country seems like it's a overall large banner or something, with "Cowboy Carter" in the middle, if that's the case, we are almost through the other half. Probably her inspiration for the album, and it will be reflected in the visuals or something
swissman Posted April 10 Posted April 10 1 hour ago, Cbreezy said: So many thoughts post-release... The Good * Elated at the sales. Happily eating humble pie given that I for sure saw 300k range as the upper limit (all things considered). I will say that, in light of the botched physicals (more on that in a sec) the fact she had 27 tracks this time helped a ton (e.g. streaming being the main means of hearing the entire album) and doesn't necessarily see the initial worry rendered totally invalid. We'd be looking at nearer 500k (IMO) had the preorder window been longer. But no point dwelling on that. * The discourse around the album is amazing. For better or worse, I am pretty consumed by the marketing aspect of my faves releases and Bey (since at least ST) has always had an...angle. And not just something limp and basic, but something qualitative and culture-shifting. CC continues that trend and has been rightfully received well because of it (the reviews etc). Which is great as... * The album is actually...impeccable! The Hmm * While the botched physicals isn't doom and gloom (nor is it the disaster some are trying to make out to be), it's sloppier than I like from Bey. She has had this innate ability to "Olivia Pope" her missteps in ways the GP end up being none the wiser about. Even her whole "artiste" positioning does not pardon the fact that BOTH the vinyl (understandable) AND the CD (totally unjust) don't have the full tracklist. I imagine ish was pressed a long time ago, which probably means act 2 was due a while back (which is in direct contrast to many thinking it was due later than now hence the "rushed" release), but it still isn't very Beyonce-like. I personally want the original cover and the full tracklist, so won't buy a physical thing. I almost feel like putting on my clown makeup because there doesn't seem to be any guarantees it's even coming. Again, not the end of the world or any kind of "real" stain on Bey or the album, but just a little personally disappointed. The Pending * There are clear similarities in how she rolled CC and Rennie out (super on-the-nose lead single, no visuals etc), but I'm going to need that to be the end of the parallels. My gut tells me CC will **need** a **something** and sooner than Rennie did. Both my gut and the intel I got (several people removed) tell me Rennie caught even Bey's camp by surprise in terms of its cultural resonance. In that it "apparently" wasn't the plan for the albums to be as spaced out as they have been. Take with a grain of salt if you choose, but at the same time, their pivot (to stretching Rennie out) makes sense. Why pass up an opportunity to take ish slow, let ish breathe, and figure out the visual drama when the source material is selling itself? IMO, there's no way we'd be getting CC only now if Rennie flopped into oblivion. That plus the deep embrace from both critics and the queer community that the album resonated with would have made her flinging on a cowboy hat and switching up her sound 6 months later feel a little disingenuous. I say all of that to say, as well as CC has been received, I just don't know if the "nothing til the tour" approach (next year?) will placate the fans or GP nor sustain the album as long as it did Rennie. Beyond Rennie taking on a life of its own in the clubs (which I highly doubt will be CC's edit), the lion's share of us were convinced visuals were coming imminently after its release, so we held on for so long because we were SO SURE the videos were around the corner. SO SURE. Knowing her games and shenanigans now, I can't see the attention span of listeners being the same. So, for her sake, I hope the visuals or tour or a live something are indeed imminent. Cus a part of me feels, for as strong of a launch as this has been commercially, she may legit lose ppl's interest in the three-album arc without anything supporting vehicle to push it. The Random * Bodyguard is life and this era's Cuff It if handled right. * Tyrant needs to be sent to Urban at some point soon. * The Act III Rock thing is still perplexing me. In one regard, CC album feels like the perfect precursor to a Rock & Roll album in the vein of Tina Turner / Little Richard (e.g. Ya Ya instead of a Don't Hurt Yourself type Rock). But with so much of CC having Rock influences it almost feels like it she has come in before the beat (if Rock really is the anchoring genre for Act III). sanity!!!! 1
Blue Rose Posted April 10 Posted April 10 7 hours ago, ScorpiosGroove said: crying at them putting up posters for any and anything thinking it'll make anyone buy the album let alone replace performances and ACTUAL promo just lazy and dumb… 7 hours ago, sillycilla said: This is what I was thinking.. Just placing posters and billboards at random places is not going to sell the album or make people stream it. They do things with no actual conclusion. I think the posters are just the label trying to do something since she will not lift a finger
Blue Rose Posted April 10 Posted April 10 Just now, swissman said: sanity!!!! A 12 paragraph essay about the post-release of a week old album is the farthest thing from sanity regardless of the points being made 2
chaeyonce Posted April 10 Posted April 10 10 minutes ago, Brikenbur said: "I BEEN COUNTRY!” She been country and the only pictures she could post were the ones the Hive been spamming for a month
swissman Posted April 10 Posted April 10 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Blue Rose said: A 12 paragraph essay about the post-release of a week old album is the farthest thing from sanity regardless of the points being made I'll always think a well-reasoned "essay" is more sane than posting 200 two-sentence overreactions about a week old album. Edited April 10 by swissman 2 1
chaeyonce Posted April 10 Posted April 10 I'm not complaining yet as I'm enjoying this album A LOT but I hope the radio silence won't last past this week announce the tour or the visuals pls 1
Triton Posted April 10 Posted April 10 1 hour ago, Cbreezy said: So many thoughts post-release... The Good * Elated at the sales. Happily eating humble pie given that I for sure saw 300k range as the upper limit (all things considered). I will say that, in light of the botched physicals (more on that in a sec) the fact she had 27 tracks this time helped a ton (e.g. streaming being the main means of hearing the entire album) and doesn't necessarily see the initial worry rendered totally invalid. We'd be looking at nearer 500k (IMO) had the preorder window been longer. But no point dwelling on that. * The discourse around the album is amazing. For better or worse, I am pretty consumed by the marketing aspect of my faves releases and Bey (since at least ST) has always had an...angle. And not just something limp and basic, but something qualitative and culture-shifting. CC continues that trend and has been rightfully received well because of it (the reviews etc). Which is great as... * The album is actually...impeccable! The Hmm * While the botched physicals isn't doom and gloom (nor is it the disaster some are trying to make out to be), it's sloppier than I like from Bey. She has had this innate ability to "Olivia Pope" her missteps in ways the GP end up being none the wiser about. Even her whole "artiste" positioning does not pardon the fact that BOTH the vinyl (understandable) AND the CD (totally unjust) don't have the full tracklist. I imagine ish was pressed a long time ago, which probably means act 2 was due a while back (which is in direct contrast to many thinking it was due later than now hence the "rushed" release), but it still isn't very Beyonce-like. I personally want the original cover and the full tracklist, so won't buy a physical thing. I almost feel like putting on my clown makeup because there doesn't seem to be any guarantees it's even coming. Again, not the end of the world or any kind of "real" stain on Bey or the album, but just a little personally disappointed. The Pending * There are clear similarities in how she rolled CC and Rennie out (super on-the-nose lead single, no visuals etc), but I'm going to need that to be the end of the parallels. My gut tells me CC will **need** a **something** and sooner than Rennie did. Both my gut and the intel I got (several people removed) tell me Rennie caught even Bey's camp by surprise in terms of its cultural resonance. In that it "apparently" wasn't the plan for the albums to be as spaced out as they have been. Take with a grain of salt if you choose, but at the same time, their pivot (to stretching Rennie out) makes sense. Why pass up an opportunity to take ish slow, let ish breathe, and figure out the visual drama when the source material is selling itself? IMO, there's no way we'd be getting CC only now if Rennie flopped into oblivion. That plus the deep embrace from both critics and the queer community that the album resonated with would have made her flinging on a cowboy hat and switching up her sound 6 months later feel a little disingenuous. I say all of that to say, as well as CC has been received, I just don't know if the "nothing til the tour" approach (next year?) will placate the fans or GP nor sustain the album as long as it did Rennie. Beyond Rennie taking on a life of its own in the clubs (which I highly doubt will be CC's edit), the lion's share of us were convinced visuals were coming imminently after its release, so we held on for so long because we were SO SURE the videos were around the corner. SO SURE. Knowing her games and shenanigans now, I can't see the attention span of listeners being the same. So, for her sake, I hope the visuals or tour or a live something are indeed imminent. Cus a part of me feels, for as strong of a launch as this has been commercially, she may legit lose ppl's interest in the three-album arc without anything supporting vehicle to push it. The Random * Bodyguard is life and this era's Cuff It if handled right. * Tyrant needs to be sent to Urban at some point soon. * The Act III Rock thing is still perplexing me. In one regard, CC album feels like the perfect precursor to a Rock & Roll album in the vein of Tina Turner / Little Richard (e.g. Ya Ya instead of a Don't Hurt Yourself type Rock). But with so much of CC having Rock influences it almost feels like it she has come in before the beat (if Rock really is the anchoring genre for Act III). She had her knee surgery which kind of killed the momentum (if she actually had anything planned) but luckily Cuff It had such strong legs on its own. Hopefully she does something to sustain the project. That's why I loved the idea of the Sphere, she can still do a show on her own terms, less worries about stages being shipped all over and a country show would be ideal in Vegas. Then work out everything for a proper tour next year. Though I guess she could start in the fall/winter but it would have to be in SA/Australia, she loves touring in the summer too much. Even then getting a crumb until the fall is meh, we have a whole summer Giselle. You don't have a broken knee, get those Levi's shorts on, slap on that platinum wig and shake it proper! 2
BGKC Posted April 10 Posted April 10 I just realized how similar Tyrant and 6 Inch are. She's talking in third person on both, referring to the way "she" wields her sexuality for profit and power (only in Tyrant she simultaneously refers to herself as the Tyrant). Theres also a plead in both songs. On 6 Inch she sings "you'll always come back to me" followed by the heart wrenching plead (to come back). In Tyrant she pleads in the bridge asking the hangman to take away her pain and teach her how not to cry. The hangman can be a metaphor for a lot of things, but I personally think it's a reference to her shadow self, that or the cold blooded part of herself that her father instilled (which is mentioned in Daughter). 3
cloudbusting Posted April 10 Posted April 10 31 minutes ago, swissman said: I duno, I don't necessarily think it's very "hidden" when she literally says the words "hangman" and "when the sun goes down" in the song. In fact I'd call that an overt clue, if you were looking for deeper meaning. I'm of the opinion that it can mean different things to different people, and that is what art is about...and that Beyoncé knows this when using double entendres or themes that can apply to two different scenarios. It wouldn't be the first time Beyoncé has added allusions to very real racial issues behind the surface of her music, like the sample in Freedom. In the trajectory of Lemonade, Freedom falls into the part of the story when she decides to forgive and move past her relationship issues and lyrically could very possibly only be interpreted to be about personal freedom if we didn't have the video to double its meaning and the sample to outright confirm it. In general yes, I agree with this outlook because everyone's interpretation is going to be colored by their own experiences, thoughts, feelings, etcetera and that is one of the really magical things about music: it can be used as a lens to process other things. That being said, the majority of this song is not so subtly about sex. The intersection of sexual liberation and racial identity are important, and Bey has definitely been vocal about that in her music and elsewhere, but I think trying to draw overly literal connections to lynchings and sundown towns here in particular kinda misses the forest for the trees. Tyrant does feel like a conversation about power in sexual politics, but more on an intrapersonal level kinda like how @BGKC elaborated. 2
swissman Posted April 10 Posted April 10 (edited) I do think she should do some promo this era that RENAISSANCE didn't have, but at the same time, I think disregarding the no-promo-precedent she's set over the last 11 years is foolish. She's clearly not going to go out of her way to promote within the first week or so of her release, and expecting as much only sets oneself up for being underwhelmed by it. Especially when the album is exceeding all expectations as it is, wondering why she's not doing more seems like you just joined the hive yesterday. A lot of the expectations expressed completely misunderstand the strategies she does have: having the music speak for itself, not pushing it into people's ears through over-saturation, letting listeners form and find their own unique and personal attachments to the music, etc. etc. As with RENAISSANCE, there is something to be said for the way she managed to make a cult album (ie. one that has a very strong and ardent fanbase who fight hard for it perhaps because of it not getting its due credits in the mainstream) out of a very mainstream project (#1 album; #1 single; "#1" tour; #1 film; longest running BB Hot 100 hit of her career) by one of the most mainstream artists ever. This balancing act is also the key to the kind of respect and adoration we see that she receives from both the public and her peers, because as obvious as it is to love Beyoncé, someone who has been at or near the top since 1997, it's very much not a guilty pleasure thing, nor unremarkable, there's a sense of gravity and legitimacy in loving her music because of the fact that she's not pushing it towards us, we as listeners are pulling her towards us. If we want to speculate and act like marketing strategists, I think we should also consider what use it would be to do promote when its not really needed, when the person in question is not one who seems to need or want to do promo, and when it would just be icing on an already successful cake. As I began saying, I do think she should do promo this era, but it's far too soon to start complaining that she hasn't, especially because waiting to make use of the little promo she probably will do is probably much wiser than front-loading it and then getting nothing after. Edited April 10 by swissman 1
Allopatry Posted April 10 Posted April 10 (edited) why did my boyfriend drag her for doing a country album for me to only catch him listening to 16 carriages, jolene, levii's jeans, and tyrant. this fake b*tch. he better repent Edited April 10 by Allopatry 1 7
FLAallday Posted April 10 Posted April 10 1 hour ago, Lose My Breath said: Been country seems like it's an overall large banner or something, with "Cowboy Carter" in the middle, if that's the case, we are almost through the other half. Probably her inspiration for the album, and it will be reflected in the visuals or something And when its revealed to be all of the images of a collage that she was going to use for the album cover but changed last minute then what
Cbreezy Posted April 11 Posted April 11 2 hours ago, Blue Rose said: A 12 paragraph essay about the post-release of a week old album is the farthest thing from sanity regardless of the points being made Shade lol. I love us for real and all jabs in good jest, but at the same time there's only so many rankings or complaints that one can read either. Similarly, have enjoyed genuinely soaking up the album and the launch and formulating a take from that rather than - what I've seen to be - heightened excitement on launch only to switch up moments later when Bey does what she's BEEN doing post-release and gives us the expected...the bare minimum. Would sooner channel my expression into what is a) actively happening and b) what I actively want than moan post in back-to-back posts. 1
Cbreezy Posted April 11 Posted April 11 2 hours ago, Triton said: She had her knee surgery which kind of killed the momentum (if she actually had anything planned) but luckily Cuff It had such strong legs on its own. Hopefully she does something to sustain the project. That's why I loved the idea of the Sphere, she can still do a show on her own terms, less worries about stages being shipped all over and a country show would be ideal in Vegas. Then work out everything for a proper tour next year. Though I guess she could start in the fall/winter but it would have to be in SA/Australia, she loves touring in the summer too much. Even then getting a crumb until the fall is meh, we have a whole summer Giselle. You don't have a broken knee, get those Levi's shorts on, slap on that platinum wig and shake it proper! I also REALLY was here for The Sphere idea and hope it or something similar still comes to fruition for the CC era. An all-new tour would be epic and dispel any doubts about the prolificness of her work rate. But I legit think it "may" be too much too soon. Would love to be wrong. That said, I still think between a residency or a festival of her own, there are clear pathways to avoiding the grueling nature of going on the road so soon after the RWT and still giving this era a live **something** that can resonate in a really epic way.
Blue Rose Posted April 11 Posted April 11 37 minutes ago, Cbreezy said: Shade lol. I love us for real and all jabs in good jest, but at the same time there's only so many rankings or complaints that one can read either. Similarly, have enjoyed genuinely soaking up the album and the launch and formulating a take from that rather than - what I've seen to be - heightened excitement on launch only to switch up moments later when Bey does what she's BEEN doing post-release and gives us the expected...the bare minimum. Would sooner channel my expression into what is a) actively happening and b) what I actively want than moan post in back-to-back posts. The well thought out takes are welcome here and it's part of the Basé healthy ecosystem But sometimes it's just not that serious for 12 paragraphs lol. I've been dragging her nonstop and yet I'm on my 5th or 6th listen of the album today. All the complaints we post don't mean anything. Whether she makes this era fun for us or not, we'll still be here 2
ShouldersSideways Posted April 11 Posted April 11 The CDs are showing up at stores and its the "limited edition" versions with her wearing the Beyince sash Not only is that a slap in the face and false advertising to those who bought it earlier, but imagine being a casual person looking for Cowboy Carter and all you can find is the Beyince album. It even says it on the spine 1
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